Boiler sizing

In my quest for a new boiler install, I’ve run into a few contractors that size all over the place. One of them measured all the radiators, convectors in the building and risers in the bathrooms, he said I have 495sq ft. This is a 3 story, 6 family pre war building. One of the guys I liked and seemed the most honest to do the job wants to put in a eg65 which is rated at 654sq ft. I was thinking the eg55 which was 521sq ft, but he says that is cutting it too close. I have long mains in the basement that run around 60ft since it’s a long building, they are not insulated and also heat up the space down there. I’m guessing there are a ton of pipes in the walls up to the 3rd floor for the all the radiators, no clue about insulation on them. I also don’t want to insist on the smaller boiler and then if it doesn’t heat up enough can’t go back to the contractor. While I care about efficiency, I’m ok oversizing a little if the worst issue is a bit more $$ on fuel. From some of you experts here, do you see a big deal with going with the eg65 over the smaller eg55? Or would I be making a big mistake? Thanks all

ditmarsman

in Heating 10 years and 1 month ago

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bconstant | 10 years ago

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Do not oversize your boiler. It’s a huge no-no, and it’s unfortunately a sign of an amateur steam plumber. Your guy is going to install this thing, charge you, you’ll be happy as a clam because it won’t be running but it will look shiny and new, and come winter you’re going to start calling him asking why your top floors aren’t heated even though you have a monster boiler in your basement. He’s going to come, and he’s going to start trying to find reasons why your steam system isn’t running right, when the reality is that he just messed up the job from the start and oversized your boiler. It’s not just about wasting fuel, it’s about the functionality of the boiler. It’s also going to short-cycle, meaning it won’t stay fired for very long because it’s too darn big for the system. So your boiler is going to last half as long as it should, and it will be your fault, not the manufacturers. Your guy needs to come measure your radiators and your exposed pipes to find out your actual sqft (it’s called EDR). Not just eyeball. And if you have exposed steam pipes, insulate them. We left ours naked in our living room and office because they look nice naked and they act as radiators themselves, and those are high-demand rooms of the house. But in the basement particularly, you’ve got to wrap those pipes if they’re exposed. You have two options here it seems: learn enough about steam heating yourself so that you can hold this guys hand, or hire someone like Master Plumber above or one of the other steam guys you can find on this forum. They know what they’re doing and will take an extra minute to make sure they don’t have to come back to your house every month. Since you have steam heating, you really should learn how this stuff works no matter what. Buy this and read it. http://www.amazon.com/The-Lost-Art-Steam-Heating/dp/0974396095 It’s worth every penny, and you really, really do need to know how this very basic and very critical part of your house works. It’s not above to layman to comprehend, but it’s knowledge that you’ll never have unless an expert deigns to take the time and walk you through it.

eman134 | 10 years and 1 month ago

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Oversizing a steam boiler is a bad idea, period. Banging , short cycling , etc. To get an idea of what you need, use this (http://www.colonialsupply.com/resources/radiator.htm) insulate all the basement pipes, make sure the master vents work and size all the radiator vents appropriately

cmu | 10 years and 1 month ago

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> If my only consequence is wasting a little extra fuel, then I?m ok with that. Wow. Why so careless of money? With mvp’s figures (180k vs 250) you’ll be wasting some $900+/yr plus the extra capital cost. Why not get an expert who can size the boiler correctly? Insulating the exposed pipes is a DIY job and gives you huge returns.

Master Plvmber | 10 years and 1 month ago

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I have no idea then.

ditmarsman | 10 years and 1 month ago

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I don’t prefer any brand. It’s just that this installer I liked, seemed the most honest and responsive, so wanted to give him the job and he works with Weil Mclains. When I told him about putting the eg55 he says “we can’t put that on a 6 family”, how he’s been doing this for 40years, etc… He didn’t mention measuring or anything, I think he sizes based on guessing. I do think he will do a good job piping and seems like real honest guy. Most of my other other estimates wanted to put in between 300k-500k boilers (currently 500k in there now). If my only consequence is wasting a little extra fuel, then I’m ok with that. Plus I have some convectors that I might switch to radiators later on (I don’t think the convectors were part of the original heating system). I just don’t know from a heating specialist standpoint if this next size up is “grossly” oversized or just a little oversized. thanks

Master Plvmber | 10 years and 1 month ago

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Are you married to Weil-McLain? Burnham makes a 542 sq.ft./EDR boiler. Peerless makes a 533 sq.ft./EDR boiler. I don’t know your job but the EG-65 is a commitment to 250,000 BTU per hour while your system can only process roughly 180,000 per hour. Bigger isn’t better. Assuming the EDR calculation was done properly, the EG-55 is the best one for your system. Insulate your pipes and you’ll have the most efficiency steam heat can give you. Again, more assuming here that the boiler is properly install and the controls are set right.