lawyer for property damage claim dispute with insurance?

Let’s call a draw or truce so I don’t have to start deleting comments. Thank you!

cate

in General Discussion 4 years and 4 months ago

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solehappy | 4 years and 5 months ago

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hi,
looking for advice on a good attorney to represent me in an ongoing battle with my insurance company over the damage from a stolen car wrecking into my townhome’s stoop. insurance as of now is basically offering sub-repair cost and a structural engineer is saying the entire structure needs replaced, so obviously a wide gulf in opinion but insurance is standing firm. i guess i dont have any other options at this point. really appreciate any help!

stevecym | 4 years and 5 months ago

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Wow, this is still going on?

Are autos not insured no matter who is driving? I get it, if mine was stolen the first i would do is drop the insurance.

helen40

in General Discussion 4 years and 5 months ago

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So much of this depends on what your homeowner’s policy really covers. If it isnt for full replacement, then you may be out of luck. There is probably some liability coverage on the car through no-fault and or if the driver or owner has additional coverage. And your insurance company should be going after that. But maybe not enough for the full replacement that your engineer says you need.

Whats the difference in offer and estimate?

Sounds like you need someone to review your policy and see what you are covered for.
Maybe another broker or company will review if you say you are shopping around. A lawyer will cost you money regardless and you cant be sure they will change the outcome.

hkapstein | 4 years and 5 months ago

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A stoop rebuild is costing what these days, probably 20k? maybe 2-5k more if you have cast iron railings that need replacement. Get some bids done and then bring them to the insurance company and try to settle. Honestly, how much time do you want to spend dealing with a 25k repair? If a lawyer charges you 5k on this, are you even saving money?

restorationcontractor | 4 years and 4 months ago

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How are you justifying the cost to the insurance company? Do you have written estimates?

I just went through this something similar after a major NYC construction company crushed my storm sewer line during neighborhood gas main replacement (unbeknownst to me) right before a heavy rain. All custom woodwork, the damage was extensive.

I used an adjuster who is also a contractor, my attorney chimed in as he needed to during all the back and forth. My insurance company would not pay claiming flood wasn’t covered so we went after their insurance (if we had wound up in court we would have went after my insurance co. as well)

You need to document and price the full replacement cost to meet current code, footings below frost line, filing, permitting, etc., etc. everything that could possibly be spent to do the replacement in the most expensive way possible, then settle.

I was calling my attorney’s cell phone the morning of the damage wanting him in court that day to initiate a lawsuit. He wisely calmed me down and explained to me how court should only be used as an absolute last resort, you want to avoid.

Bottom line thanks to the adjuster (who was well worth his fee) and my lawyers minor inputs I came out ahead.

Urbandad the cost for a proper stoop replacement can be well north of 20k.
I assume you meant off the shelf simple wrought iron railings for the 2-5k. If you are talking about replacing cast iron railings large main posts can easily be 5k for a single post, smaller spindles and reproduction railings, turns, rolled ends etc. can all add up to lots of $.

solehappy | 4 years and 4 months ago

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for the record, i cant find anyone willing to repair this thing properly for anywhere close to $25k. a few people close to that number seem clearly to be uninsured and not aware of permitting requirements.

hkapstein | 4 years and 4 months ago

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No one coming close to 25k? Does that sound right for a stoop rebuild? Also, do you actually need a permit for this? I don’t think you technically need one repair it the way it was. You could get an LPC permit if you need one without filing a DOB permit, but if it’s just being repaired the way it was you don’t really need it. How much is the insurance company willing to pay?

restorationcontractor | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Urbandad as OP said his structural engineer is saying the entire structure needs to be replaced.

Stoop replacement or major repair will definitely require a DOB permit (& LPC if it’s in a historic district).

Can’t really comment too much on cost without seeing it but for a licensed, insured contractor to do demolition, proper footings, construct new stairs, brownstone stucco, ironwork etc., etc. to do the job properly will be well north of 25k.

Also as OP said even the bottom feeders can’t come close to 25k.

Cookthebooks the only way to do this is to get written proposals for everything that could possibly need to be done to repair this in the most anal, perfectionist, by the book way possible. Then settle, it’s your choice what you do after that.
For example things like soil borings/load tests for new stair footings, etc.

The only way you are going to get whole on this is to go after everything possible. You really need the help of an adjuster on this. If you want to contact me I can give you the contact info. of the guy I used.

hkapstein | 4 years and 4 months ago

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@restorationcontractor, you don’t know what you’re talking about. Soil borings for stoop? Useless permits that will bring a ton of headaches? This is about helping a guy get his house fixed, not getting you and your friends paid. Why would the footings be damaged? Why would it cost 10s of thousands of dollars to pour new footings? Two guys in 1 or two days could make a complete foundation for those steps, if that’s even necessary. That’s easy less than 2k. The structure is not where the cost is, is mainly the stucco that’s expensive of these projects.

This is absolutely bologna, and I’m calling it out.

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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I can’t comment on the borings, cost etc – that needs to be seen and examined. However, one does need a permit for structural work even if it is a repair. This is straight from the DOB. I called them about something similar. And I also agree that useless permits are headaches but if you do structural work and someone complains, that is also a big headache. Best to pay an engineer for a site visit and then make those calls.

greenworks | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Just helped two neighbors with full stoop replacements and did some minor work on ours – mind you, we’re in a very non-brownstoney non-landmarked nabe and used very non-fancy contractors., and well north of 25k sounds right if you want permits pulled (as OP explicitly said he did) and have a brownstone stoop.

Janedrew is correct, permits technically required. Can one do it without under the radar?Yes, but OP said they wanted permits pulled. Thus, those estimates sound even more correct.

Also, I read restorationcontractors recitation of doing soil borings, etc as a purposely anal extensive list to make sure the initial estimate came in high on purpose, so that after it was negotiated down with the insurance company, OP would still have an ok amount left over to do the work needed in the way he wants.

It was negotiating tactic to HELP OP. Yikes!

hkapstein | 4 years and 4 months ago

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If you do a renovation some things will always be under the radar if you like it or not, unless maybe it’s a total gut. Would you file structural plans and TR1s to sister or a add a joist? Even when plans are filed, what is actually done and signed off may not be exactly what was in the plans, but the inspector may not notice or know the difference and this happens all the time. Once the stoop is rebuilt, who could or would ever question it? It would comply perfectly with any plans on file at DOB, and it won’t raise your property taxes like filing a new stoop would.

Now usually the stoop is partly on city property. Check your survey. If the stoop is gone and you’re building a new one, do you need a revocable consent for it? Do you need to pay annually to lease sidewalk space for a new stoop, when a repaired stoop would continue to be grandfathered? Is part of the stoop in front of a neighbor’s property who might have something to say about it? Or are you willing to be a little more liberal about the permits when you’re the one paying.

If the insurance company will p ay for all this, then by all means, file paperwork to the moon and back and have them buy you breakfast. I’ve excavated and underpinned an entire brownstone for less than 30k with all the paperwork. So if you’re telling me you can’t build a stoop in front of your house where there is easy street access for materials and far less engineering, shoring, and safety requirements, I just don’t buy it.

cate | 4 years and 4 months ago

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If you can build on old footings you absolutely should. Otherwise please take precautions before, during and after, and make sure the soil is compacted correctly, or it’s highly likely the new stoop and the old house will have “settling” and be crooked with related damage.

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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As with everything one can pay $5 or $25 but one should probably make sure structural work is not required with an engineer before deciding whether to file or not. However before embarking on structural work, I think it’s sensible to know if it’s required. Whether to file permits or not is a personal decision. I understand Urbandad’s perspective on filing – I paid a heavy price for doing everything by the book.

greenworks | 4 years and 4 months ago

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I personally wouldn’t equate the skills/cost involved with excav/underpinning with that of a brownstone stoop rebuild but there it is.. scale of excav/underpinning much greater and PITA than bstone stoop but there’s a *teeny* bit more art and different skill involved, depending on how ornate your brownstone work is. Less access issues for sure with stoop but more nosy neighbors to see and call DOB on you for unpermitted work if you’re in that type of neighborhood, which most of you are.

In our nabe you could build a four story addition made of toothpicks and tar, store gasoline in it and host smoking parties with a fire pit and your neighbors would only call DOB if you murdered their sister (and maybe not even then). Others, a neighbor sees a bucket come out of your basement and the next day there’s an LS-4 on your door.

Anywhoo, I realized I went far afield from OP’s original question:

I would talk to an adjuster before an atty. Our friend just used one in his own dispute with insurance company. I can reach out to him and see if he was happy. If so will post info.

restorationcontractor | 4 years and 4 months ago

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@Urbandad YOU have no idea what you are talking about. Bring in your uninsured, unpermitted day laborers to do work until you get caught by DOB or someone gets hurt and then see how much that costs.

I simply offered advice to the OP about a situation that I understand as I just dealt with something similar. I am not sure how in your mind this equates to “getting me and my friends paid”?

If you bothered to read my post what I said was he should look for everything that he can to come up with as large a number as possible then settle for an amount that will allow him to hire a licensed and insured contractor to do the work properly. Any foundation work in NYC is technically required to have soil testing. This is about how to get adequate compensation from the insurance company nothing else.

In the future before you “call me out” stick to calling everybody on the eastern seaboard to price trimming out a few doors for yourself before you tell me a licensed, insur ed contractor with over 35 years in the construction/restoration business that I don’t know what I am talking about.

solehappy | 4 years and 4 months ago

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issue is that the stoop was knocked off its old soil footings. insurance company claims the jeep running into it has nothing to do with that, which is absurd to me.

so now i am moving onto the full replacement value insurance i pay for here will not get a licensed insured contractor to pull the proper permits and fix this issue for what they are offering.

hkapstein | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Look, try to have another engineer take a look. An engineer might say clear everything out and I’ll design a new construction for you, that’s the easiest for them. But there’s a reason you’re getting pushback here from the insurance co. I can tell you, I could get a stoop built for 25k, and I know specifically for this type of project, and full stoop rebuild and have priced it in detail. Maybe others cannot, that wouldn’t shock me.

restorationcontractor | 4 years and 4 months ago

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@Urbandad you really need to give up on this.

Now OP should shop around for another engineer?

Insurance company is giving pushback, must be OP’s engineer doesn’t know what he is doing because insurance companies are always honest and love to pay out full value for a claim with no hassle whatsoever.

I could get the stoop done over the weekend for 50 bucks with my buddies and a couple cases of Budweiser.

Run Forrest run!