Financing Remodel

Hi everyone! I am buying a fixer-upper in Boerum Hill, and trying to figure out how to finance the remodel. We got a quote from an architect for about $350k, but we don’t have the cash for that at the moment. Our banker suggested we do a construction loan, but I’m worried about (a) the 30% down requirement, and (b) the need to have everything approved by the bank. I’ve seen some horror stories in the forum about that, so I’m wondering how bad it really is. Our other option is to take out a HELOC immediately after closing, and our mortgage broker said we could get one up to 100% of the home’s value. Has anyone done either of these things and run into problems?

ggrkfppsn

in Renovation 9 years and 1 month ago

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vthatcher | 9 years and 1 month ago

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That’s correct but most people dont keep the loan eleven years, they refinance the property once its improved and remove the PMI.

workisfun | 9 years and 1 month ago

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Also…the 203k has prohibitively costly mortgage insurance fees for the first ELEVEN years.

vthatcher | 9 years and 1 month ago

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hood*

vthatcher | 9 years and 1 month ago

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I am a mortgage broker and to figure this out, I would need more information. Property type, sales price, is the property habitable now? The likely hook of getting an equity loan at 100% is low. This is not something I would bank on, I would only opt for that option if your broker will get you a commitment on it prior to closing or can coordinate a simultaneous closing, which may be an issue with the first lien as they wont allow 100% CLTV loan. The FHA 203K would be a great option depending on the loan size, but certain things have to work, the as is value and after repair value have to fit the criteria for that loan. FHA Loans have limits and vary by the number of units that the property is.

Vanessa Thatcher
Senior Loan Officer NMLS# 41404
vthatcher@athccorp.com

Atlantic Home Capital
627 Horseblock Road
Farmingville, NY 11738

Office: 631-687-3510 x106
Direct Dial: 631-468-8809
Direct Fax: 631-918-5222
Cell: 631-672-4113

CarmenR | 9 years and 1 month ago

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> @kquock
> So we are in a similar situation with the house we just bought in Greenwood Heights.

22k seems extremely low for both architectural and SE work, depending on the level of structural work required. We are currently gutting a house in Greenwood Heights- if you want any advice about the process or to see the job site, I’m always happy to chat. Shoot me an email at greenwoodframed at gmail I’ve met a few people from this board and shared war stories!

newtomehouse | 9 years and 1 month ago

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> @kquock
> What we ended up doing is we hired an architect to do the design, engineering, and filing with the DOB. Depending on the scope of work the price can add up in man hours

Architects do the design but never heard of them doing the engineering or filing. Be certain that what your architect quoted you includes the hiring of an outside engineer, includes the expediters fee, filing fees and any other associated items you need to get DOB approvals like an asbestos inspection etc. If not your 22k figure will quickly balloon to double that.

To the original poster. I wouldn’t go into buying a fixer upper with a budget from an architect that is likely not correct and unless you have the cash to finance the work.

CarmenR | 9 years and 1 month ago

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> @kquock
> What we ended up doing is we hired an architect to do the design, engineering, and filing with the DOB.

Is your architect also a structural engineer?

DanWilson | 9 years and 1 month ago

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So we are in a similar situation with the house we just bought in Greenwood Heights. We wanted to buy a fixer-upper but we had to be able to live in it. It’s a 3-story two family townhouse and pretty much will get a gut reno when all is said and done. We are trying to avoid having to take out any loans for this. Luckily we can do most of the work ourselves but there are still things we do need a contractor for. Biggest issue is figuring out what things to submit in the plans to the DOB because we want to be able to do a major construction project and then close out the permit and then carry on with small and medium projects over time. This way we can self finance it over time but get some of the major things done so we can get the rental unit ready and some of the critical spaces done. In the process of getting contractor quotes we saw some outrageous numbers upwards of $1M for a complete top to bottom gut reno. This was a high end full service construction and design firm so they do all the architecture, design, engineering, and construction….What we ended up doing is we hired an architect to do the design, engineering, and filing with the DOB. Depending on the scope of work the price can add up in man hours for the architect and Engineer so really understand the cost vs. project scope. Luckily ours should run us about $22k but at the end we will have approved plans with the DOB. In parallel we hired a separate contractor who estimated the work so we could make a decision on the scope of project within our budget. Once the plans are done we will marry up the architect and contractor, and he’ll go off and apply for the permits and start work. Unfortunately this doesn’t answer your question on construction loans but maybe this approach might give you some other ideas. Good Luck!

BKRed | 9 years and 1 month ago

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I did a construction loan with SunTrust in 2007 but they’re not in this market any longer. I will say that the construction loan went very smoothly and worked as “bad cop” to make the contractor hit dates to advance the next payment. I understand Wells Fargo still writes these loans in this area. Pay attention to what the terms of the final mortgage will be after you roll over the first + construction to the final mortgage. The value of your home will increase, so you’ll likely want to stay with the original lender to avoid additional transfer/closing costs. (Or at least factor that into your plan…) And DEFINITELY do not go with the architect’s construction budget. Even contractor estimates at this point will be very loose. Until you have construction documents from an architect, you can’t have a firm contractor’s bid.

daveinbedstuy | 9 years and 1 month ago

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> @resident2
> Contractors of today are all sales men and are mostly ex wall streeters

massive eye roll [Anigif_enhanced-8803-1411405215-28-1](//muut.com/u/brownstoner/s1/:brownstoner:DvD5:anigif_enhanced88031411405215281.gif.jpg)

But you’re right about all the rest.

resident2 | 9 years and 1 month ago

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An architect quoting construction costs is not realistic. But buying a fixer upper in Prime Brooklyn if money is tight is also unrealistic if the work needs to get done before you can move in.
Contractors of today are all sales men and are mostly ex wall streeters etc. that have jumped on the bandwagon, so will jump ship the minute your money has run out.
If it is a house that you can move into, then move in after doing a major clean etc and take a year to really work out what it is that you really want to do and educate yourself during that time to finding contractors that really know what they are doing and that you can communicate with…. and stop watching HGTV because it is not that easy in NY and takes 10X as long to get anything done.
As for financing: The FHA 203K loans do not work anymore because the prices are too high and the contractors that will work in that program are not going to care what it is that you want customized. A construction loan when you have only just bought will still mean you need mostly cash, due to the delays in the Bank releasing funds and the additional time delays etc.
Best bets are private loans, parents etc are best.. offer them 2-3% more than they are currently getting in their CD’s etc and write it up as a mortgage in a business fashion. Hard money lenders will not do it unless you own it in a corporate entity and it is not your primary residence and they will want to be in first position and no more than 55% LTV.
The bottom line is: this is the million dollar question for everyone with a house dream that is constant………..

ggrkfppsn | 9 years and 1 month ago

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Thanks for the suggestions! For the Brownstoner hivemind to store away: I checked with TD, and they don’t do the first mortgage + HELOC if the purpose is remodeling. They do construction loans, but only up to 70% total LTV. That’s consistent with what I’ve heard from a couple of other banks as well.

cate | 9 years and 1 month ago

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Does anyone know if a minimum of 30 percent down/equity is required for a residential construction loan? I hadn’t heard that.

vitent640 | 9 years and 1 month ago

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@YahwehOrTheHighway: can you share the info of your contact at TD?

randolph | 9 years and 1 month ago

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> @MC NYC
> We got a quote from an architect for about $350k

i would not trust an architect’s quote for construction costs.

mew11216 | 9 years and 1 month ago

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Research the FHA *203k* Loan.

It’s a loan program offered by FHA insured mortgage lenders to people buying fixer-uppers who need money to finance both the purchase and the repairs.

Short description (snippet from the FHA website)
>”Section 203(k) insurance enables homebuyers and homeowners to finance both the purchase (or refinancing) of a house and the cost of its rehabilitation through a single mortgage or to finance the rehabilitation of their existing home. ”

If you need help finding a lender shoot me an email; I know a pretty decent company.

David Roma
dave@daveroma.com
(516) 476-7328

*Resources:*
[Zillow Article](http://www.zillow.com/mortgage-learning/fha-203k/)

[HUD website](http://portal.hud.gov/hudportal/HUD?src=/program_offices/housing/sfh/203k/203k–df)

slopefarm | 9 years and 1 month ago

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We financed construction as part of the mortgage, but this was back in 2005. We had to have an estimate for all of the work, and the estimate had to be reviewed by the lender. Appraisal had to account for reno and the total financing had to be within a permissible LTV ratio on the basis of the value following reno. then. following closing, proceeds for construction were held back and then released in accordance with a schedule of completion (i.e., x% rough plumbing, x percent exterior, roof etc). With rates low, you are better off going this route if banks still do it because you can fix the rate of the construction financing. and pay back principal and interest. HELOC rates typically float, in my experience.

YahwehOrTheHighway | 9 years and 1 month ago

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TD will do a combo of first + HELOC at closing with up to 90 LTV on the appraised value.