What kind of professional can help me warm up a room?
Urbandad is right. You need to seal air leak and drafts first and the windows are the most likely culprit. They are also cold to the touch because glass does not have a high insulation value, even many double-pane windows.
If you want a storm window that is easier to install and remove, window inserts may be worth a try. Ours create a near airtight seal on the window and a dead air space between the insert and window for further insulation. They are made from acrylic which has higher insulation value than glass so isn’t cold to the touch, which increases the mean radiant room temperature.
Guest User | 5 years and 9 months ago
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NewOwner | 5 years and 10 months ago
Hi, all. I’m trying to figure out what kind of person I can call to help me to think about options – both in terms of insulation and potentially in terms of plumbing – to help me warm an eternally cold room in my house. It’s the ground floor extension to my brownstone – so the only room in the building that doesn’t have party walls on two sides, with four windows and a door to the backyard. And no cellar underneath it. So every winter it gets pretty darn cold. We also have a room on the parlor floor right above it which is always a little chilly but only has two windows and not on the ground so a smidge warmer. We blew in insulation about 10 years ago but I’m not sure how much that would help.
How can I assess different interventions to warm up the room – the extent to which closing off a window or two, or doing something (?) to insulate the floor (?) would make a meaningful difference, for example, or if we should be looking at storm windows, or if we need to do a major plumbing job and add a radiator to the room? Is there a professional that can help me with the se questions? Or does anyone on the forum have general ideas about what could help?
My dad has been using it as his bedroom but as he’s getting older, he’s using the space heater more frequently and electric bills are going sky high…
hkapstein | 5 years and 10 months ago
In my view, you’ll be in much better shape if you can figure out the problem and hire someone to fix it than trying to find someone to sherlock holmes it for you. The first step is to identify drafts. Insulation doesn’t help if outdoor air is getting in. Does the the air in there smell kind of fresh like outdoors? Even if not, check for cold spots and leaks around windows etc. Caulk, seal, and repair as needed. Once that is addressed, touch the walls and ceiling, or use an infrared thermometer or camera and compare that to other exterior walls in the house. Is is it cold? That could be an insulation issue. If you already blew in insulation, you problem need to consider opening up the walls an investigating, or putting in spray foam or rigid insulation. You might be able to insulate from the exterior depending on the situation. There is information online about finding thermal bridges, but perfection should not be expected in an old building like this and the heating system should be sized to handle it. You could try to thermally isolate the foundation, from outside but t hat might put you on on the road to rebuilding the extension which I’m sure you’d like to avoid. I suspeect there’s a good chance of a bad foundation there, but I don’t really know. If all else fails you could put a radiator in there(hard with steam) or a minisplit heat pump.
slopefarm | 5 years and 10 months ago
Urban dad has it right. You can do a lot of troubleshooting yourself. Are the walls cold to the touch? That’s an insulation issue. Check for drafts — feel around the windows, but also electric outlets (there are outlet insulation pads, believe it or not), and along the baseboard moldings. Take all reasonable insulation measures.
I would add that, at the end of the day, the goal is to have the temperature rise and fall evenly throughout the house, but you are probably never going to get an extension to retain heat as well as the rest of the house. Consider adding some ceramic electric baseboard heaters to supplement the heat in the extension. That’s what we ended up doing.
stevecym | 5 years and 10 months ago
you mention adding a radiator to the room. do you not have a radiator in the room? is the room closed off from other rooms? if so, it absolutely needs a radiator to heat it and one should be added if there is none. also, do you have modern, double glazed windows? modern windows will help but i am thinking that if the space is isolated and there is no heat source in it, all the insulation in the world will not help.
daveinbedstuy | 5 years and 10 months ago
What type of heat does the rest of the house have? If forced air, can you get a duct there? If baseboard hot water, that would be a lot easier to do. Otherwise an electric baseboard heater but install a 220 v circuit for it. it’ll be a lot more efficient.
cate | 5 years and 10 months ago
We had a small and leaky mudroom/extension, which precluded a working powder room. (The plumbing froze and cracked the toilet before our arrival on the scene.) In our case, the siding was full of holes, the 19th century concrete slab foundation was tilted and crumbling, air and water were coming in, and the outside door did not close or open correctly. We poured a new foundation (quite an undertaking — use an engineer to prevent settling), installed a new door, and rebuilt the original window, all of which made the room air tight, then we covered the mudroom with house wrap, insulation, and cement fiber board. (In retrospect, we should have torn the whole thing down and rebuilt it entirely, as everyone advised us to do.) My advice is to first make sure no outside air is penetrating the space. Next, make sure the exterior material is sound (repoint brick, etc.) and insulate if possible. Three, if this is a bedroom and not a vestibule, the space must be heated.
stevecym | 5 years and 10 months ago
keep this in mind as you proceed. while electric seems pricey and counter intuitive to all of us, if this space might be the only space heated, say during the day while others are out, it might be economical to do what dibs said, electric baseboard. my shop is in my house and i work from home a lot and being the only one in the house during the day, i use electric heat to heat only the area where i am working at the time (office or shop) which while expensive, it is cheaper than firing up the boiler to unnecessarily heat the entire house.
NewOwner | 5 years and 10 months ago
Thank you everyone for your thoughtful replies! Some responses and follow-up questions if I may:
– yes, the walls to the exterior are a little cooler than the interior walls, but not cold.
– the double pane windows are definitely cold to the touch (which is normal?) and a little drafty at the seams – what can be done on that? (Ultimately I wonder if there are just too
many windows and if sealing up a window or two would make a meaningful difference – thoughts? Or do storm windows actually help?)
– How do I know if the foundation is poor? That’s scary! The door and windows seem to be in alignment.
– Would a ceramic baseboard heater be cheaper than a space heater?
– There are two radiators in the room – it’s a hot water system.
– Does anyone have experience with carpeting and if that could make a meaningful ambient temperature difference (ie, while someone is in bed rather than standing on the floor). It’s currently wood flooring.
Thanks!
Guest User | 5 years and 10 months ago
have you tried installing that plastic wrap over the windows? a huge amount of our sense of cold has to do with a feeling of draftiness so reducing all drafts will make a big difference. if the plastic wrap over the windows helps but you don’t want to do it every year investing some time in new weatherstripping of your window sashes and caulk around the window frames could do a lot of good. don’t seal up windows, that’s a much larger than necessary project for a problem like this.
hkapstein | 5 years and 10 months ago
The windows might be cold because there’s a draft, but yes the insulation value of the window is less than the wall so it should be a little colder. Is the weather stripping all in good shape? Are the tilt latches working? Maybe have a window repair company take a look. Just be careful, they will probably be looking to sell you replacement windows. Does it need caulking at the interior or exterior? I’d probably prefer to replace a window with a well installed high performance window over sealing it up, but i guess it depends on the exact circumstances. Still though, a room should not be cold because it has windows, even a lot of windows. If the remaining windows a drafty after you close a few off, you’ll probably still have this issue. If the window wrap works, you probably have a draft problem that needs to be addressed. Storm windows would definitely help if the problem is with the windows, but might be overkill if you just need caulk.
Regarding the foundation, I’m not saying I think your foundation is dangerous. What I’m saying is that the foundation could be anythin g, stacked stone, a slab on grade, cinderblocks, or nothing at all. But if you dig it up and mess with it, you, and any responsible contractor, will not be comfortable leaving it with an improper foundation. If there haven’t been any problems in decades, it’s likely that the existing foundation could last through your ownership of the house, maybe even for centuries, but if you do work on it, you won’t be able to unsee possible features that are unacceptable by modern engineering standards, and this could put you on the road to some expensive work.
You have two hot water radiators. This you can work with. You may try to adjust the balance of the system to increase the heat output of those radiators. There are several other posts discussing this recently. If the radiators seem to be achieving maximum output, you could upsize the radiators, which is definitely what I would do before I installed electric radiators. I would also explore cold climate single zone minisplits such as a mitsubishi hyperheat before I installed electric radiators. This will use less power, and give AC in the summer.
Regarding carpet, any situation in which it helps should probably be dealt with another way.
If this were me, I’d probably do the following in this order:
1. Indentify and seal air leaks and drafts. Perhaps consult a window repair company to refurbish weatherstipping, glass seals, etc..
2. Address inadequate insulation and thermal bridges. but don’t go crazy.
3. Increase heating supply/radiation.
At the end of the day, the greater surface area to volume ratio of the extension means it will likely have a higher rate of heat loss than the rest of the building. A mechanical engineer could calculate this for you, but it’s probably a waste of time. If the extension is sealed and insulated, then the heat output is too low.
NewOwner | 5 years and 10 months ago
Thank you so so much for everyone’s advice!
cate | 5 years and 10 months ago
Your extension has heat, a wood floor, isn’t actually all that cold, and sounds like a properly built room — nothing like our formerly crumbling shed/mudroom. Please ignore my previous comments and you probably shouldn’t worry about your foundation.
Guest User | 5 years and 10 months ago
Urbandad has it right. I have dealt with this issue several times in renovations. It’s always extensions or similar structures (outbuildings, etc.) that have these issues. In general, I take a two phase approach. The first phase involves insulation and draft reduction. Are all doors weatherstripped? Are the windows energy efficient? Is there insulation in the walls? It is incredible how much of a difference taking care of these three items can make. And while the upfront expense is higher than, say, adding an electric baseboard, these interventions will last decades and will create a much more comfortable environment.
Only after you have taken care of the sealing, windows, and insulation should you proceed on the path to supplemental heat. If you already have two radiators in the space, you may not even need any more heat.
stevecym | 5 years and 10 months ago
second vanderlyn: urbandad has it right. i can add, if you have heat in the space and the windows are old, that space might be a few degrees colder than the walled up sides of the rest of the house. the first thing we did when we bought our house was change the windows (mostly to combat noise from the buses) and we compared our first year oil consumption to the previous year’s and it was literally cut in half. all the caulking in the world will not help an old set of single pane windows, if that is what you have.
adam_dahill | 5 years and 10 months ago
My original 2 story extension is similar in that’s its at least 15 degrees if not colder than the rest of the house. No cellar under the extension, exposed on 3 sides. I have baseboard heating but still cold. I plan on dropping in radiant floor heating when I renovate that space. It’s always going to be colder than the rest of the house not matter due to the issues mentioned above. Radiant should be a good constant heating source to keep the temp inline.