Illegal conversion question
To legalize it with respect to fire-safety, you would either need to install a fire escape, or install sprinklers in the stairway. The regulations set forth in MDL Article 6 (HCA) would apply.
jayhey
in Conversion 11 years and 2 months ago
9
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9 replies
sanvean6 | 11 years and 2 months ago
I’m hoping someone can give me some advice. I have happily rented in a three story brownstone for 6 years, with leases. I have a nice relationship with my landlord and I’m not interested in moving. I believe that for the past 20 years, the building has operated as a three family – a duplex and two one bedroom floor-throughs above the duplex. I recently looked up our building on the DOB website and was surprised to see the C of O lists us as a two family (a cellar and two duplexes). An opportunity came for me to check the cellar and I observed only two electrical meters and two gas meters. I pay my own gas and electric accounts so the other tenants in the building must have utilities included in their rents. Both other units have had turnover and recent renovations, so I can be pretty confident my apartment would be deemed the illegal one if push came to shove. There are no fire escapes or sprinklers. What should I do now that I may be renting an illegal unit? Like I said, I enjoy living here but now I’m concerned about safety issues. And, potentially, if something did actually go wrong, I do wonder if my renter’s insurance would cover me or if they would reject the claim. These days, I’m nervous that I could be vacated at any time if someone else decides to report my illegal unit. Could that happen? How does the DOB handle these units when they are occupied by paying tenants with leases? I’m a good tenant and I’m not interested in withholding rent or screwing over my landlord – but I am very confused as to how I should proceed. Thanks for any advice you can offer.
brokelin | 11 years and 2 months ago
I think you should forget about it. If you ever have an insurance claim, and the insurance company gives you a problem, fight it then…it isn’t like you as the tenant are responsible for knowing the city regulation stuff that the landlord is responsible for. You didn’t certify to your insurance company anything about the legality of the rental, did you? (I never did in buying renters insurance.) And I’m confused about how you think an actual unit would be considered illegal…it would seem to me that the usage of a house would be deemed not conforming, not a particular unit. I’m a worrier as a renter, but I can’t for the life of me figure out what it is that you have to be worried about. Who would report your unit? Does your landlord make enemies of the other tenants? If you ever have to move because of it, then deal with it then. If you aren’t rent stabilized, and you aren’t, then you can be forced to move at some point for any number of reasons. If you have to move out before a lease is up, sue your landlord. The only thing I’d worry about is whether I was paying for some other apartment’s utilities today…are your up utilities what they were in you last place? Does your meter stop spinning when you turn everything off, including your refrigerator?
metalwork | 11 years and 2 months ago
Sorry, SAFETY comes first.FULL STOP…….. my life and my family life is more valuable than anything in this world. that alone is enough to confront my landlord about, and if my landlord not willing to address.I would be looking for a next apt. be wise.
daveinbedstuy | 11 years and 2 months ago
What safety issue, metalwork? No sprinklers? You’re being hysterical.
metalwork | 11 years and 2 months ago
If you read carefully, sanvean6 stated in the end of her first paragraph. There are no fire escapes or sprinklers. daveinbedstuy if your think i am hysterical what can i say,that’s your opinion.Have you ever woke up 3 am and your apt/building on fire, and here is n fire escape or sprinklers and your on the 3 floor??? well i have. If you don’t see that as a safety issues. Good for you.
Townie | 11 years and 2 months ago
Well not many old buildings in NYC have C of O’s so i assume that permitted filed work was performed at some time in the past. There may be plans on file at the DoB showing the legal permitted use. I’m going to assume that you are living in one of the 2 apartments created when the landlord split the upper duplex into two separate units. If this is in violation of the C of O then yes you may be kicked out of your apartment at a moments notice as the owner would have to either legalize the set up or return it to it’s previous condition. If you are in the lower duplex you most likely have nothing to worry about. I saw a Prat report that there are something like 115,000 units of questionable housing in NYC. Housing advocates and some politicians believe that laws should be changed to legalize or at least make it easier to legalize many of these shadow apartment units in order to provide affordable safe housing. I would agree. Help landlords if possible to legalize the units. One concern I would have is that you may be paying for others utilities. Two meters, one for the house the other for ? If you have an account the number for the meter should be documented in which case you could always trip the breaker for your unit and see if anyone complains about loss of power. Same with the gas line. Who knows maybe you are on someone else’s line in that case you would still have power after the breakers were turned off. Only you can determine your level of safety. I would not worry about your insurance however the landlords insurance policy may be void if he has misrepresented the building which could cause you problems if there was some disaster. Years ago I invested in one of those fire ladders that can be quickly secured to the window frame and rolled out in case your main exit is blocked. It came in a bag and stores easily in the corner by a radiator.
ventilated | 11 years and 2 months ago
There are many reasons why a CofO might not conform to use, including intentional illegal conversion, lousy DOB record-keeping, or permitted conversion that was never signed off. The fact that you’ve lived there 6 years, but write about the building’s past 20 years, as well as your recent “opportunity” to check the cellar, tells me there’s more to the story than what you’ve written. Not saying that your concern is good or bad, appropriate or inappropriate, safety-related or unrelated. Just saying there’s more to the story than what you’ve written.
brokelin | 11 years and 2 months ago
You seem to be confusing what is safe with what is legal. If you want a fire escape from an upstairs unit, the same safety issues apply whether it is legal or not, or whether the second floor is in a single family home for that matter. Get a collapsible ladder if you want another way out from a higher floor. If you want an iron fire escape, move to a building with one. (The lack of one wasn’t a priority when you moved in, obviously, or something that has prompted you to move I’ve the last six years.) If you want a building with an internal building fire stair, move to a building with one. Trying to get your landlord to build you one is a losing proposition. You will be out of your apartment at the end of your lease if you try that. Better to move on your timetable, when you want to. You seem to want to use the laws to force to landlord to do things…good luck with that, seriously. Makes me doubt you when you say you aren’t trying to screw with your landlord. And I’m about as renter-friendly as you’ll ever find in my opinions (not a landlord, have been a sometimes renter and sometimes owner of apartments I’ve lived in.)
cate | 11 years and 2 months ago
It’s unsafe to live in a below grade basement or in an apartment that’s been partitioned and is overcrowded. There’s not too much difference in the safety of an upper level floor-through vs. a duplex in a small house.