Rosie and Nelson Redux
Did any of you just listen to Rosie Perez and Nelson George discussing the impact of gentrification on the neighborhoods of Fort Greene and Clinton Hill? We find Nelson’s nostalgic but realistic take on things quite interesting to hear; he’s clearly thought through a lot of these issues. Rosie’s relatively un-nuanced views, however, rubbed us…
Did any of you just listen to Rosie Perez and Nelson George discussing the impact of gentrification on the neighborhoods of Fort Greene and Clinton Hill? We find Nelson’s nostalgic but realistic take on things quite interesting to hear; he’s clearly thought through a lot of these issues. Rosie’s relatively un-nuanced views, however, rubbed us the wrong way. Her main point seems to be that she doesn’t know as many people when she walks down the street but (1) she’s a movie star now, which impacts how people view and interact with you and (2) we don’t get the sense she’s even around very much. In the four years we’ve been taking our kids to school just a few houses away from hers, we’ve never laid eyes on her; in fact, we’re not sure we’ve ever seen the shutters on her house open! (Her house also has the obligatory-for-a-Brooklyn-celeb attached garage.) She was complaining about how people fight over tennis courts in Fort Greene Park now–and then a caller reminded her that she used to have bricks thrown at her by local kids when she was playing tennis. We get how people can miss (and idealize) things from the past, but Fort Greene and Clinton Hill have to be some of the friendliest, most neighborly, streets to walk down in the entire city. How about a little love!
it takes two to tango ramona.
if people don’t feel welcome in a neighborhood, they will make their own. it sounds like you just expect people to move into “your” neighborhood and know how it is.
“the first thing that can be done is to not ask us to revolve around you.”
it’s amazing what a smile and a hello will do. if you aren’t willing to do this then you sound like the bad neighbor who is doing nothing for their community.
“my child walked to school too . no problems. in fact it wasn’t UNTIL more white people moved in that they stared getting hassled. i never got held up UNTIL more white people moved in.i think the main thing is that there’s an air of superiority, self absobtion in this current generation.”
Ummm WHAT? Sorry, maybe I missed the memo. Are these white people robbing young black youth? Your the only person who sounds self absorbed, with an air of superiority.
sadly this is a discussion with no end. this neighborhood has grown too fast in too many ways and while i’m not mad that the produce is better how sad is it that white folks had to move in before you could buy an apple.
the newbies have our view. the ogs, theirs. we will rarely agree. there ya go. oh. we have 2 starbucks-
oh. in case you haven’t noticed- even the non pratt kids are funny looking LOL
can you afford to eat at 7? or buy at choice green?a neighborhood is more than hip resturants.
mostly black? are you kidding me? i hardly ever see black faces unless the school kids are out, or you include the pjs- which much of our new friends have forgotten is also part of fg.again, i am nOT the only one saying this. gather up 20 vets and 9/10 will say the same thing.
diversity is when there’s a mix.a real mix. when my black friends get”the look” from young white girls-i mean in their 20’s., things aren’t good.
as for showing newbies the ropes. the first thing that can be done is to not ask us to revolve around you. to understand how things work and try and work with it- to a reasonable degree. . it sounds as though you have the awareness to not allow that to happen. tell your friends.
when i and many of my friends moved here- in the mid 80’s we treated the older- mostly black- people with courtesy(something that should be done across the board- age or race. we played with the kids. we engaged in conversations with our neighbors and store keepers- yes we had stores, yes not as many or i will admit as nice but it was ok. we smiled. we got involved in the community. we kept an eye for the children on the block- my child walked to school too . no problems. in fact it wasn’t UNTIL more white people moved in that they stared getting hassled. i never got held up UNTIL more white people moved in.i think the main thing is that there’s an air of superiority, self absobtion in this current generation. a sense that their needs come first. that their children need not defer to an older person coming down the street because basic manner are not progressive. don’t see FG as a place to be but rather where you live. smile. talk. acknowledge.lighten up!
I used to think nobody in NYC could bitch so much about a great neighborhood than West Villagers, but this fucking thread is giving Villagers a run for their whiny.
For me, Ft. Greene/Clinton Hill is now a better place to live than the Village. I moved here from Barrow Street three years ago, and I love it.
First of all, gentrification has hardly turned FG/CH lily-white; it’s STILL predominantly black, thanks to a black middle class that has owned here for ages, and has an enormous range of other races/cultures. Yeah, it’s gotten a little whiter, but since when is diversity a bad thing? And I don’t know what people are talking about when they say the hood is unfriendly—even before the Flea, which is great, I’ve felt a great warmth from people of every race and stripe. The park has an enormous community and sense of camaraderie. We have a teeny but decent farmers market. We have the stability and funny-looking students afforded by Pratt. It has comfy, unpretentious old restaurants, diners, and bars, and it has several great new ones (Kif, General Greene). Have you eaten dinner at No. 7? A pretty, friendly, neighborhoodsy restaurant that has genuinely ambitious food. We have great new stores all over the place like Choice Greene, while the Pioneer grocery store that used to be disgusting has been nicely cleaned up.
AND: We STILL do not have a Starbucks, and with their stock price the way it is, we don’t seem likely to get one! Yay for us.
Actually, I could go on and on, but I don’t feel the need to. I really don’t care whether anybody agrees with me here or not. All I know is, there is nowhere I’d rather live.
I make an effort to be outgoing- It makes my day to a get a big smile from one of my neighbors or a good morning from someone walking up the street. My feeling is, i moved here and into the community. I didn’t come here to make it over into Brooklyn Heights. All neighborhoods have their own personalities and I like the way Crown heights is. not that i wouldn’t love a great coffee shop close by but that’s not what I love about living here. I think the biggest mistake any gentrifyer can make is to come into a neighborhood and act like they’re only tolerating it until it “gets better.” It’s counterproductive and disrespectful to long time residents.
dh, your 3:57 post is what I mean. I’m not big on talking to people on the street myself, and I’m a born Brooklynite! But I do make a point of saying “hi” to my neighbors since I’ve lived in Crown Heights. It goes a long way.
Williamsburg for 2 years (wasn’t my first, or even 2nd choice of neighborhoods, but have been making the most of it) – before that crown heights for 1.5 years (my landlord sold his house and the new owner didnt renew the leases) before that i bounced around manhattan while in school (chinatown, les, ues)
I don’t consider myself anything – i just want a nice place to live. but for arguements sake some might consider me a gentrifer.
i totally agree – just playing devil’s advocate of sorts.
I remember when I first moved to Crown Heights back in the day – i still had my manhattan mentality of walking really fast with my head down and not really paying attention to anyone. it wasn’t until someone said “good morning” to me one morning that i slowed down my pace a little, took a look around and realized i wasn’t in manhattan anymore. I was living in a community of people that knew each other. after that i got to know my neighbors alot better and loved my time there.
dipster how long have you lived in williamsburg? i would hardly call you a gentrifier. i think youre just the biproduct at this point, no? now if you moved to detroit you might be a gentrifier.
*rob*