Rosie and Nelson Redux
Did any of you just listen to Rosie Perez and Nelson George discussing the impact of gentrification on the neighborhoods of Fort Greene and Clinton Hill? We find Nelson’s nostalgic but realistic take on things quite interesting to hear; he’s clearly thought through a lot of these issues. Rosie’s relatively un-nuanced views, however, rubbed us…
Did any of you just listen to Rosie Perez and Nelson George discussing the impact of gentrification on the neighborhoods of Fort Greene and Clinton Hill? We find Nelson’s nostalgic but realistic take on things quite interesting to hear; he’s clearly thought through a lot of these issues. Rosie’s relatively un-nuanced views, however, rubbed us the wrong way. Her main point seems to be that she doesn’t know as many people when she walks down the street but (1) she’s a movie star now, which impacts how people view and interact with you and (2) we don’t get the sense she’s even around very much. In the four years we’ve been taking our kids to school just a few houses away from hers, we’ve never laid eyes on her; in fact, we’re not sure we’ve ever seen the shutters on her house open! (Her house also has the obligatory-for-a-Brooklyn-celeb attached garage.) She was complaining about how people fight over tennis courts in Fort Greene Park now–and then a caller reminded her that she used to have bricks thrown at her by local kids when she was playing tennis. We get how people can miss (and idealize) things from the past, but Fort Greene and Clinton Hill have to be some of the friendliest, most neighborly, streets to walk down in the entire city. How about a little love!
I think the take away message here is: “treat people like, um people” regardless.
As a new-ish resident in the neighborhood I have always made an effort to say hello, open doors, make chit chat, and generally treat my neighbors with the respect they deserve. On the flip-side, they have welcomed me and my family.
respect your neighbors, and they will respect you.
I know, a little sanctimonius… sorry
Well after all this time that I have only been a spectator on the brownstoner I felt the need to finally add. This chat has sparked so many different points of reason and while it is good to respect everyones opinion some of the things I read is just plain crazy. I have ben a resident of bklyn all my life so as far as the neighboorhood I feel I seen it all. I truely understand Rosies point of view I feel it has gotten ridiculous a takeover has truely happened kind of out of nowere its like when you get that that roach with an egg and once that egg drops you can never get rid of them. I have a brownstown that has been in my family for years and I just watch what the neighboorhood has become,and it really sickens me to see how these people (and yeah you know what I mean) move in and try to take over but whats new they have been doing it all there lives its in there blood and character. There was a little fleamarket on that same block before the invaders came along and what happened they got pushed out by those people. Please who said we wanted the freakin habbana bull sh*t. Last note what if the old Putnam Downing FT Green pjs ST James Atlantic Terminals Washington and Classon ave would have moved to Bensonhurst do you think we would have been greeted with open arm. HELL NO you would have probley been murdered. Stay in your area and trust I will stay in mine.
I came late to this discussion so have had the advantage (self-inflicted torture) of reading all that came before. What jumps out most is the seemingly willful ignorance of the newbies. There are comments like ‘nothing but white babies’, clearly demonstrating that the author has never been to Myrtle Ave let alone the Walt Whitman projects, unsurprising as so many seem to think that Ft Greene is the area bt BAM and De Kalb. Soon enough they’ll probably want to rename the Navy Yards side of Myrtle to distinguish the ‘real’ Fort Greene form the dirty, trashy section which no-one in their right mind would like to be associated with.
There is also the usual attitude demonstrated by the privileged – get over it, it’s inevitable, this is how the world works. Well FU too. The dismissal of the concerns of others does nor ameliorate these issues, and in fact often plays against you in the long run. From minor examples, such as the community my yuppie upstairs neighbors miss who think that our next-door neighbors are drug dealers as they have a nice car or that the Dominicans who repair cars on our street are slimy and crooked and have no contact with anyone who was here before them except in our building as they have no choice…by community I mean the ‘drug dealing’ next-door neighbor calling when my car was hit while parked so I could get out and catch the culprit (also they stay to get my back if anything goes down), to free car repair and the loan of a van from the ‘slimy’ Dominicans, to paid work from another neighbor who happens to be in the same business…etc etc..To the larger repercussion of fight back, and the reality that the bad attitude of the newbies will inevitably lead to the destruction of what they liked about the area in the first place.
One final observation about white Americans. When my wife was pregnant last year to our amazement we found that the natural camaraderie between pregnant women seemed to have a color barrier. Now not all white mothers-to-be were guilty but the majority actually looked away or kept their heads down when my pregnant wife would smile in conspiratorial sympathy, of course other women of color would beam back…and most of these folk probably voted for Obama.. because they’re just not racist.
Thanks, La Negrita, for saying what’s been on the mind of this white woman for almost a year: Privilege. Class, race, sex, or what-have-you, it’s all around us, all the time. I wish people here would learn about privilege, particularly white privilege, to try to gain some understanding of why the alleged “betterment” of Fort Greene and Clinton Hill is viewed poorly by many “old-timers” of all colors. Sadly, most will not likely be open to learning about privilege since that is it’s nature. I won’t go through my growing list, but even the belittling of Ms. Perez and “reverse-racism” commentary in this thread indicate reactions rooted in white privilege. So ingrained is privilege in our culture, we don’t see that it lies at the heart of so much big and small around here.
As a white FG resident for all of my 40 years, I also miss much from the 1970s, 1980s and 1990s – people, solidarity, kindness, etc. Some changes have been good over the years, yet some are not (I like some of the restaurants, but hate their now garbage-filled basements and their burrowing rats – rats were less of a problem before the elimination of street containers in the name of beautification, folks). I’ve also experienced much of the described negative behavior from newer neighbors and visitors in lack of thank yous, weird looks, no hellos, rudeness to store clerks, and worse. However, we’ve been pretty lucky and continue to be thankful for our good neighbors, old and new.
The best thing that happened to my white family in 1968 when we moved in was that our neighbors accepted us – not “we accepted them”. We worked together in the streets, in one another’s homes, took care of one another’s children, and formed true friendships that have endured. Their acceptance of my family transformed my life, my way of thinking about people and myself, and I am eternally grateful.
Wow, after reading this, one can tell exactly who was born and raised in Brooklyn, and who was not. As a white teenager who hung out with white friends who were born and raised in FG (and yes there were very few of us) we did not let the crackhouses or Brothels on the block bother us. We smiled and made jokes with people who lived in those buildings, and no you did not ned a bullet proof vest to walk around there.
The real prob with the neighborhood started in 2004-5 when housing prices skyrocketed almost 80%! My problem really is that a lot of these new people do not smile or say hi. The crackheads/whores I grew up with made me feel safe, and were nicer to be around than a lot of these new residents. And I find that to be the case with most Brooklyn neighborhoods these days. These new “yuppies” or “hipsters” or whatever you call them, just for the most part are not nearly as nice and helpful as the people I know who were born and raised in these areas.
everyone should just quit the bitching and righteousness and STFU. this has nothing to do with black or white or gentrification or anything. it is called entropy.
That’s great. I have seen Rosie a few times around the Slope (although not recently). She always looked sexy as hell, even in sweatpants.
She is probably just like me in that she uses Park Slope as her home base, but is never here. This place as a neighborhood in the last ten years has become a virtual toilet of two-dimensional suburban-refugees acting out a Sesame Street fantasy minus Gordon and Olivia, and Luis and Maria (i.e., the Blacks and Puerto Ricans). Oh, and Mr. Roper’s bodega was replaced by Mr. Nasalbeard the 28yr old gourmet organic grocer and Mr. Kim the overpriced Korean fruit and cat food salesman.
Rosie is a narcissistic douchebag liar. The Dutch were here before her fuching people and my people.
I lived in FG in the last 90s and early 2000’s. I understand the change is inevitable, yet as an African American it was wonderful to live in a place that was beautiful, relatively safe and filled with young progressive people of color. It was just great. I don’t think white people can fully understand that as they have many, many places to go where they can find the same. Other than maybe some areas of PG county, there are no other places I know of that are predominately black, middle class and progressive. PG County might be wealthier but it is as classist or more so than its lily white counter part.
FG was exciting, you had younger professional black people mixing with older blacks who owned homes for years. You could walk to FG park on the weekends for the gay old skool house music party and head over to Blue Moon and listen to awful but very enthusiastic poets ;-). Summer concerts in Prospect park and events at BAM would bring out all the folks.
But as FG became safer and more entertaining it drew people of more means, and there is nothing landlords love more than seeing young white people with LARGER amounts of disposable income and guarantors. I understand that. Whites having access to larger amounts of money than black people have a very different perspective. The last 20 years in America is really the first time the black community has experienced large numbers of educated black people entering the work force and being accepted and allowed to compete in any fashion with their white counterparts…so this is the first generation to experience middle class ascendence in any real way.
Also for older black people who lived in Fort Greene and Clinton Hill the idea of paying $2000 a month rent would have been absurd.
Any older black American or Caribbean relative would scream if you told them the you were paying $2000 a month rent. You would be told to “Buy a house” right away. Many black people thought it ridiculous to pay $2,000-$3000 a month rent but many of those same older blacks do charge their white renters the very same price and they are happy to get it every month.
Yet many of my friends in Fort Green and Clinton Hill found that by the time they reached an age and career point to be able to afford to purchase a home…they were already priced out of the neighborhood they loved.
Now the vast majority of people I see in Fort Greene are white. I rarely see black people in large numbers. With $2M brownstones I would imagine so.
And yes I have witnessed young white new comers giving long time FG residents “side eye”, I guess it is just a way of priviledge as I imagine many of them are not even aware they are doing it, as I guess it is their neighborhood now as they are in the majority.
So the older black former residents are expressing a sadness that they may have had to go and they did not want to but they were priced out…the difference is white residents have many choices of other similiar places to move where they would feel comfortable and young professional blacks did not.