Is my renovation quote reasonable?
I’m planning my first major renovation on a co-op apartment in Brooklyn. Just got my first contractor quote and I don’t have a ton of context into cost, and would love to get opinions on if it’s reasonable, close to reasonable, or too expensive. The kitchen cost feels reasonable, but not sure what goes into moving walls/doors which is the second part of the proposal.
Attached plans for the proposal. Here is the quote:
Kitchen: $15k
Countertops
Leave bottom of picture wall 8” above countertop to create a serving shelf
Supply and install a black quartz top approximately 8” wide x 60” long for shelf
Demolition
Demo wall cabinets on stove wall
Demo wall to create a picture frame opening looking into living room area
Dishwasher
Modify existing cabinet for install of dishwasher
Install plumbing, waterline and hose drain for dishwasher
Install electric for dishwasher
Bedroom/hallway: $26k
Partition walls
Demo hallway wall from floor to ceiling to enlarge for dining room and remove all debris
Repair all walls and ceiling where needed
Repair wood flooring; will not be perfect color match
Build new wall to create a bedroom space.
Sheetrock, frame, tape and spackle ready for paint.
Supply and install a pocket door frame with a 30” primed wood door.
Move breaker box
[Plans](//muut.com/u/brownstoner/s3/:brownstoner:TMcU:plans.png.jpg)
Guest User | 3 months ago
10
1051
Please log in, in order to post replies!
10 replies
justinromeu26 | 3 months ago
a lot of old school contractors (people who have done a lot of serious demo work and out of the ground construction) would be able to look at this and know. op might have an old school contractor. Op just has to understand that without really knowing the contractor and that person’s experience, this is on his shoulders. keep in mind that a lot of people come on here thinking their contractor is great and when it comes down to it, they don’t know as much as they purport and when they do not know something, they will rarely admit it (for fear of losing a job). sometimes they know there might be an issue and they do not advise the customer because they are afraid the customer will go elsewhere. In addition to how experienced the contractor is, what also matters is how hungry the contractor is. a contractor who is always busy can afford to tell the truth and admit what they do not know at the risk of losing a job because they always have work lined up.
ladybug | 3 months ago
You should have a structural engineer look at the wall. Maybe the co-op wants their structural engineer to sign off on a wall removal so check with them before hiring your own person cause you might just pay the co-op’s structural engineer and be done with that.
hkapstein | 3 months ago
As crazy as it sounds, it does not technically require a permit to remove a non-load bearing wall under certain circumstances. An alt-1 permit would not likely be required for an internal wall of an apartment, but an Alt-2 permit might if it didn’t qualify as an minor alteration. That does not necessarily mean the co-op board will agree to the renovation. A possible argument for you to make is that pulling a permit will increase the building taxes when a permit was not required. As an alternative, you could have an engineer draw plans for the work, and name the co-op as additional insured on his malpractice and general liability policies. Or hers if she’s a girl engineer.
According to 1 RCNY §101-14
2. Non-fire-rated and non-load-bearing wall, permanent removal in Group R occupancies.
In Group R occupancies, where the cutting away and permanent removal of any portion of a non-load-bearing,
non-fire-rated partition is limited to the lesser of 50% of a given wall surface or 45 square feet in area.
Exception: a permit shall be required where the cutting away and permane nt removal of any size occurs in a
dwelling unit satisfying either of the following conditions:
i. The dwelling unit is located in any of the following areas**:
a. Special Hudson Yards District
b. Preservation Area P-2 of the Special Garment Center District
c. Special Clinton District
d. Special West Chelsea District
e. Greenpoint-Williamsburg anti-harassment areas in Community District 1, Borough of Brooklyn; and
ii. the dwelling unit is within a single room occupancy multiple dwelling††
** The permanent removal of a portion of the partition resulting in a change in the layout of rooms
within a dwelling unit shall constitute a “material alteration” in accordance with Zoning Resolution sections
93-90 and 96-01. Any “material alteration” to a dwelling unit located within the “anti-harassment areas” as
provided for in Zoning Resolution Sections 23-013, 93-90, 96-01, and 98-70 shall constitute an alteration in
accordance with the Building Code and, therefore, require a building permit.
†† Such work shall be considered an alteration and therefore require a building permit and, where
applicable, a Certificate of No Harassment in accordance with section 28-107.4 of the Administrative Code.
cate | 3 months ago
Removing and adding walls and rooms requires an architect or engineer to file an Alt-1 with the building department. Also, usually co-ops require review of plans.
justinromeu26 | 3 months ago
so barron: NOTHING can be assumed in these circumstances. the times when these go wrong is when someone bases what they “think” on their knowledge of the rest of the building and for some reason, the particular situation they are looking at is different than everything else. and look what happened in the bronx two months ago when a licensed engineer thought he knew something.
i will not tell you on this board how to check to see if this is a load-bearing wall but as the owner of this project (and the person with the most to lose) and as the project manager it is not that contractor’s responsibility to verify that the wall is not load bearing. You brought him in and if something goes wrong in your unit it will be your problem (especially if you move something structural). you have to find out if this is a load-bearing wall. People come onto this board with projects that went wrong all the time because they put their faith in some contractor who looks good on paper but has only been doing this work for five years and has no formal training.
two weeks ago, i was consulting for a customer who wishes to renovate one room in a house. the rooms in the entire upstairs of the house have those crappy drop ceilings like you see in a store or office building and 1970’s paneling on the walls. i asked them “what is above these ceilings” (i meant did it have the old plaster ceiling or had that been removed). he said “nothing”. i clarified “the old ceiling is gone?”. he said “yes”. I asked, “how do you know?” (mind you, i am playing this game with him to prove a point to him). He replied “i lifted a tile in the other room and there was no ceiling”. i finally told him “you have to check THIS ceiling, not the one next door”. I made him get a step stool and we looked up into the drop ceiling and there was the old plaster ceiling. this stuff happens all the time in buildings sometimes with people with some degree of experience.
NOTHING can be assumed in buildings and it is your responsibility, not your contractors.
i am not marketing myself to determine if walls are load-bearing. that is for someone above my pay grade.
justinromeu26 | 3 months ago
“don’t think” usually means further investigation is needed.
Guest User | 3 months ago
We (me and the contracter) don’t think the wall to be demo’d is loadbearing. The contractor has done renos in the building in the past which is how I got introduced!
cate | 3 months ago
Did you check if the wall to be demo’d is load bearing?
cate | 3 months ago
Are you working with an architect or designer experienced with similar co-op renovations in your area? Are all the contractors who are bidding also experienced with similar co-op renovations? Very important to check references, see prior work in person, and verify that licenses are current.