Gut renovation - question about demolition and safety

We are planning a full gut renovation of a multi-floor townhouse – we’re fully permitted and hired a reputable contractor who has done many townhouses. BUT he says the demolition crew he is hiring should pull out all the subfloors at once – leaving all the joists exposed at all levels. Then he can start building at the entry level and use protective measures as he works in each area. He plans to completely close off the staircase so that workers can not enter any level where work isn’t safeguarded.

HOWEVER I spoke to site super from another company who said that while demo is being undertaken, a temporary subfloor must be added immediately and many levels with exposed joists is a safety hazard for workers even if it seems like access is prohibited.

This is a big and costly difference – is there a right and wrong, or is this a gray area? Does anyone have any insight??

intheheights

in Renovation 5 years and 6 months ago

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zlapqtorekgljwxy | 5 years and 5 months ago

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I agree with Ubandad here. It IS the contractor’s fault. He should be responsible for the cost to resolve the violation because you are relying on his expertise with regards to safe work procedures. If he was cited for a missing fire extinguisher would he ask you to pay for the fire extinguisher?

hkapstein | 5 years and 5 months ago

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That sucks. I’m not sure how much it cost you to do the plywood, or exactly what your arrangement was with the contractor, but I think you should explore if you have some recourse from him. Your contract should say that work will be done in compliance with local codes and laws so arguably this cost should arguably be borne by him. At the end of the day look, what’s the cost of the plywood, 1-2k? His team can probably lay this out in 1-2 days, so figure maybe another 1-2k in labor. This should cost less than 5k, can probably be done cheaper, and I don’t think your contractor should mark this up, if anything he should take the hit. You’ll probably end up spending 5k to clear the SWO, but hey that’s part of the fun. You say it’s not the contractors fault, but the contractor selected this strategy, and is the one who is doing the work and should know the rules, so I think ultimately a lot of the blame would fall on him legally, but I’m no expert and I don’t know the d etails. I’d at least push back if he’s charging a lot of money to make compliant a job that he bid too low because he planned to disregard safety regulations.

intheheights | 5 years and 5 months ago

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My worst fear came true: our neighbor, (who doesn’t want us to do ANY work that she can HEAR, cleverly called DOB everyday (even on days the site was quiet) during demo saying we were shaking her building (mind you – we just did basic demo – no excavation or slab). The BEST squad happened to arrive when all the joists exposed. It shut us down completely for unsafe conditions. Now I’m paying a lot to have plywood cover up every level. Because it was just bad luck, over zealous DOB and an evil neighbor, I take it that it’s really not the Contractor’s fault…
ps believe me, neighbor is beyond reason so don’t even bother commenting on that front

hkapstein | 5 years and 6 months ago

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Yeah, the only thing is, we don’t know if third party action over could apply to this project, if so is your contractor covered for labor law? Something to check out. Probably a question with implications beyond the floors. Having enough insurance to pull a permit does not mean having the right insurance to protect the owner.

slopefarm | 5 years and 6 months ago

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What everyone said. If he’s fully insured and you are indemnified in the contract, I would hold off. There are times for second-guessing — it’s your home — but I would reserve that for how things are being built or finished.

intheheights | 5 years and 6 months ago

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okay helpful ! – guess I was being overly cautious

hkapstein | 5 years and 6 months ago

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The only probably here is that temp floors should not be too expensive to install. I’d say a few thousand. If it matters to you, you can pay that. If he’s charging a lot more call him out on it. But I’m not sure I would question him over this.

daveinbedstuy | 5 years and 6 months ago

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What resident2 said.

resident2 | 5 years and 6 months ago

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You have ” hired a reputable contractor who has done many townhouses “.
Do not start second guessing him & questioning his management now.
What business are you in? If someone hired you for a job that you have many years of experience in & take pride in and then immediately started questioning your management & everything that you planned, how would you feel, think?
This is not a good way to start a relationship that by its nature is going to have some major questions along the way…. this is not one that needs to be questioned. Let him do his job.

daveinbedstuy | 5 years and 6 months ago

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Is he fully insured? If so I’d let him proceed the way he wants to. I’ve never heard of this particular objection before. It sounds like he will proceed in a logical manner that will include subfloors when work is being done on each successive floor. The ability to get all the domolition done first will greatly speed up the entire process instead of something moe piecemeal which I’ve never seen done. Try to avoid micromanaging.

stevecym | 5 years and 6 months ago

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start by familiarizing yourself with OSHA rules. they are federal. whether or not the city or state have more stringent rules, i do not know. there is a lot written about osha on line.