Asbestos Encapsulation

We are new owners of a 1925 townhouse, with a basement that is basically unfinished, but filled with a number of confusing plywood “walls” that have been installed over vinyl tile and could easily be ripped out, which we had planned to do sometime in the next year, once we’re in the house.

We just discovered that the vinyl tile is laid over previous vinyl tile. The earlier stuff, which is bare in a few places in the basement (and cracked in even fewer places) is 9×9 asbestos. We’ve had it tested, and are planning to encapsulate in epoxy now for the short term, but I’m wondering if someone here can help me with a longer term timeline/process question.

If we intend to finish the basement and demo these weird walls which are all nailed into the existing tile, it’s clear that we’re going to have to do simultaneous asbestos abatement during the demo. We had intended to remove the walls and pour a layer of self-leveling concrete over the whole basement, fully encapsulating everything and giving ourselves a fresh work surface. But is this a job for one company or two? ie, d o we hire a contractor to clear out the basement and lay the flooring and simultaneously hire an asbestos firm? Or does the asbestos firm do both the demo and the basement flooring?

Thanks in advance!

tpeckosh

in Renovation 3 years and 3 months ago

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cate | 3 years and 3 months ago

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Thank you!

tpeckosh | 3 years and 3 months ago

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It is about 750 sf, and he charged us 12,5k including the demo

cate | 3 years and 3 months ago

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Thanks for the report! What did they charge and how big is your basement? Thank you!

tpeckosh | 3 years and 3 months ago

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I just want to circle back to this post and thank everyone for their advice on the tile and the demo required for our basement. An additional recommendation for Patrick at Leinster, who came to see the site within hours of our call and scheduled the demo of the whole space, including the tiles, immediately.

His team was fantastic, got the job done quickly and seamlessly, and now we are asbestos free, with a very large, very empty basement that will make for a great blank slate when we are ready to renovate.

Honestly, it all worked out perfectly, and we can’t recommend him enough. Thanks to everyone on the Brownstoner boards for the help!

andriywww1990 | 3 years and 3 months ago

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here is the link to the NYC Code:

https://codelibrary.amlegal.com/codes/newyorkcity/latest/NYCrules/0-0-0-23190

stevecym | 3 years and 3 months ago

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OP, I would still read the nyc code to see if there are some exceptions. I did not read it, I perused it. If I was going through this in my house, I would print that entire code out and read it from end to end with a red pen in hand to note questions.

I might place a link here to the code later when I am on my desktop.

Stevecym and doors are the same person.

tpeckosh | 3 years and 3 months ago

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Doors — Thanks so much for checking the code!

Bob – it seems now as though, with tile, at least, the EPA and other experts recommend encapsulation over removal. The problem here is that to fully encapsulate it, we have to remove framing that was drilled into it, so it’s not quite as simple as just adding a new layer. We have to pull out some stuff, which is where we want to get it right.

andriywww1990 | 3 years and 3 months ago

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i have been reading and the new york city code makes no mention of any difference between friable and non-friable. they seem to treat the floor tiles as any other asbestos containing material. leave it to the city to do this to people. i just read that in the great NYS per something called industrial code rule 56, homeowners can remove asbestos in their own single family homes.

bob, we used to be told that if this stuff was in good condition, it could be left in place. so i do not see why there would be anything wrong with putting something over it.

RobertGMarvin

in Renovation 3 years and 3 months ago

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Would a new layer of vinyl, or other flooring, be practicable and would that be sufficient encapsulation?

stevecym | 3 years and 3 months ago

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In so far as the state code is concerned, non friable floor tiles can be removed by anyone. They spell that out in very simple, straight forward language. The city might be another matter.

As someone who has worked in building management, I always find it is better to know the codes than to rely on information from contractors. Learn the code, then call contractors and when they tell you something contrary to the code, put the code to them and watch them wiggle around and try to get out of what they are saying and if their story does not sound good enough, understand that you do not do business with those people. It is a way of weeding dishonest or incompetent people out. Especially with something expensive where people may be out to take advantage of people.

stevennn | 3 years and 3 months ago

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There is no one answer. Call General contractors, Asbestos removal companies, etc.… and have a conversation with each.

andriywww1990 | 3 years and 3 months ago

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i just checked. New York state still considers the floor tiles to be a Non Asbestos job. New York city on the other hand has its own regulations and they do not seem to address asbestos as “friable” and “non-friable” but that was a quick look at the code and there is a lot there and i am not sure i want to read it all.

andriywww1990 | 3 years and 3 months ago

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it used to be, 10 or more years ago, that the 9×9 tiles were not considered “friable” and therefor were not considered an “asbestos job”. we used to remove them (legally). i am not sure if the law has changed as these days a lot changes in ten years.

i would check the current law on this and the handling of “non-friable” asbestos to see if an abatement contractor is required before making any decisions. ​

i can tell you how to remove it in case it can be done by anyone: get slabs of dry ice. we would buy 50 lbs of it and have it sliced into 3″ slabs and lay a few of them on tiles. the cold breaks the glue bond and the tiles lift right off. easy. we would wet the tile to hold the dust down and wear p100 masks.

check the code before calling expensive contractors.