So you changed the C of O as part of your renovation?

It is the unfortunate reality that a more equitable tax system would mean that a vast majority of people would pay higher real estate taxes, probably substantially higher. And it isn’t just people who have done work illegally. It’s people who did renovations legally, but years ago. There would be little support or sympathy for this kind of equalization nor the political will to do it. So we are stuck with the disincentives and the distortions. The Brownstoner audience is somewhat self-selecting – often people who own brownstones and want to know how to improve them. But this community, which is often so generous with their time and advice, is not, I suspect, representative of City real estate owners on the whole.

housepoor

in General Discussion 5 years and 11 months ago

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Augustiner | 5 years and 11 months ago

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If you changed the Certificate of Occupancy please get in touch, even if the tax robot did not serve your papers yet. After my first post (https://www.brownstoner.com/forum/#!/dob:your-property-tax-might-jum) I heard back from 4-5 people who are in the same boat. We need to be MORE.

The property tax system puts the burden on those who file everything properly. It permanently destroys property value of those who abide by the law. It encourages illegal construction and endangers us all.

a fictional example:
2 houses in the same zip code with identical SQF and lot size, identical year of completion, identical reno budget, identical finishes, identical appearance
-> class 1 property, 3 family no CO change:
$ 10,000 taxes after renovation (added reno budget to assessed value)
-> class 1 property, 3 family from SRO :
$ 20,000 taxes after renovation (added reno budget to assessed value, then cap removal)
The question is: how can an identical asset be taxed at twice the rate? It doesn’t make sense.

If you fall into the second category the appeal channels offe red on you ‘notice of property value’ are not worth the paper they are printed on.
You won’t be able to contest market value as yours was artificially deflated at re-assessment to not result in an even more outrageous bill.
You won’t be ably to contest assessed value with DOF unless there is a clerical error on your assessment. And even then, good luck!

Property taxation in NYC is neither transparent, equal or fair.
If we get enough people together we can discuss similarities in our cases and find options to move forward. I have no answers yet, but would like to form a work group of sorts. Shoot me an email if you would like me to keep you posted

flo@flat-peach.com

Lurker | 5 years and 11 months ago

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I agree in principle: there’s no equity in NYC to the way a brand new building, vs abated, vs, old, vs renovated get taxed, and how neighbors with precisely the same buildings can have vastly different taxes. And our current system does indeed disincentivize people from following the law, by penalizing anyone who abide the building code and regulations. It’s perverse and also means that housing stock isn’t maintained the way it should be.

I would note, though, that the effective taxes we pay for existing properties here are still a fraction of what you would pay most anywhere else versus the value of your home. 5 or 10 or even 20 grand for a million or two property? Go 20-50-1000-miles in any direction and see what your taxes would be on the same priced home. This site says Kings is high-priced on average, however the city and state drastically discount what you actually pay (as you know). http://www.tax-rates.org/new_york/kings_county_property_tax

Augustiner | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Taxes are different based on areas. Suburbs have less density and less income tax to pay for amenities, so they make up for it by higher property taxes. But in the same neck of the woods neighbor A doesn’t pay 4 times as much as neighbor B .
NYC property taxation is like we both work the same job at the same company and one of us pays 4 times as much income tax on the same salary.

Property taxation is not equal and transparent, and it is based on made up numbers.
E.g. the number for ‘market value’ is artificially deflated in class 2 properties and does not reflect the actual market value as it does in class 1. Why? because the percentage to calculate the assessed value is different than class 1 and the final number would not makes sense. That is the equivalent of making up numbers just to get to a certain result. There is no other explanation: either the term ‘Market value’ is false or the number. In any case: it is fake math.
Market Values on Class 1 notices seem to be shifting randomly also.
Half of the properties on my street raised in Market value last year, and half declined. You know that is not what happened in real life.
Instead of doctoring around and playing Fantasy-taxation they should just start from scratch.

It is obvious that NYC wants to raise property taxes all across the board and that’s fine as long as it is done equally and transparently. The problem is that they max it out where they can and that leads to an imbalance that is not justifiable.