sickening cellar-basement topic again
Have you thought about excavating the basement? Is that cheap? Doable?
browngurl
in General Discussion 8 years and 10 months ago
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8 replies
bk123 | 8 years and 10 months ago
A single family house sits 20′ back from the front prop line. The first floor is a good 4′ above the curb. The grade around the house is much higher than the curb. The surveyor did a section showing the adjacent grade as part of the calculation which kills the basement. He refused to use the curb. Trying to find out when the curb is used vs adjacent grade for this determination. I know it has something to do with the “baseplane” but the definition for that is not black and white either. The MDL
says if the house is more than 25′ back, the adjacent grade is used. What does DOB use?
property is in Queens. They want a legal apt in the basement, will we need to excavate around the house to win this stupid game??
Guest User | 8 years and 10 months ago
Hello NYC is notoriously strict with their habitable cellar/basement guidelines. I just saw this on the NYCHPD website:
“Can the basement of a one-family
dwelling be lawfully rented?
Yes, but only if all of the following conditions
are met:
• Compliance with the requirements of the
Housing Maintenance Code for rooms not
located in the cellar or basement, e.g.,
minimum room size.
• There is a minimum ceiling height of
seven feet.
• The walls, as high as ground level, must
be damp- and water-proofed if HPD
determines that subsoil conditions on
the lot require such damp- and waterproofing.
• The basement is occupied by one family
and does NOT include boarders.
• Every room must have at least one
window complying with the requirements
of Housing Maintenance Code § 27-
2062.
• The bottom of any yard or other required
open space cannot be higher than six
inches below the window sill of any
required window in the room. ”
Hope this helps. I have done many successful basement renovations here in NYC but most were deemed basements in the CofO. You can see some of my basement remodels here at my website:
http://www.statenislandremodel.com
Not to be a Debbie Downer but on my own personal property the DOB did not approve the space as a habitable basement. The curb height deemed it a cellar and the DOB permitted a “Rec Room” space but I was not allowed to include any enclosures.
Good luck
Guest User | 8 years and 10 months ago
Sorry misstyped my website. Here is again www.statenislandremodel.com
JorgeF | 8 years and 10 months ago
Hire an architect a surveyor is not the one to make that determination. The architect will base their work on the survey but they will determine if it is cellar or basement.
Lilly | 8 years and 10 months ago
An additional requirement – More than half of your ceiling height must be the window height- if your ceiling is 8′ then your window height must be 4′-1″ to be a basement , if it is 3’11” high then it is a cellar- this is at the street front – it doesn’t matter if you have glass doors in the rear.
jcarch | 8 years and 10 months ago
The MDL doesn’t set the base plane – and even if it did, it wouldn’t apply here, you’re a single family dwelling, not a multiple dwelling (3 or more units). The base plane is defined in the definitions section of the zoning resolution, which you can view here:
If you’re w/in 100 feet of the street line, you can use any elevation between curb level & street wall level (the grade at the street wall). But if you use an elevation other than the curb level, there are possible restrictions (see sections a, b, and c of the base plane definitions) that may come into effect.
Lilly…I’m not familiar with a regulation that the window height must be 1/2 the ceiling height…is that from the building code, MDL, etc? If more than 1/2 of that level is above the base plane, then you have a basement. If more than 1/2 if below the base plan, you have a cellar.
jcarch
—————————
www.jcarchitecture.com
Lilly | 8 years and 10 months ago
Basement and Cellar Occupancy
Basements and cellars differ in their amount of height above curb level. A basement has at least one-half of its height above curb level, while a cellar has less than one-half of its height above curb level. Usually, if a cellar has any windows, the windows are too small for an adult to fit through.
Basements and cellars in residential properties of all sizes can NEVER be lawfully rented or occupied unless the conditions meet the minimum requirements for light, air, sanitation and egress, and have received approval by the Department of Buildings. You can check the Certificate of Occupancy on the DOB website to see if the basement you wish to rent is legal. DOB also posts Tips for Renters to help identify when an apartment is illegal.
Occupants of illegal basement and cellar apartments face potential dangers such as carbon monoxide poisoning, inadequate light and ventilation, and inadequate egress in the event of a fire. Occupants of illegal basement and cellar apartments may be ordered by the City to vacate or leave any illegal basement o r cellar apartment.
Both HPD and DOB may inspect for illegal occupancy of basements or cellars. Each agency may issue violations of the Housing Maintenance Code or Environmental Control Board. If you receive an Environmental Control Board violation for this condition, you must appear or respond to the violation or risk default penalties. For more information on ECB violations, see ECB’s webpage.
Guest User | 8 years and 10 months ago
Jorge and Lilly have very valid points. To Jorge’s point my Architect was the one who presented my property to the DOB commissioner and got an approval for the rec space. Again best of luck let me know if I can help in any way.