Reglazing a tub

Anyone recommend someone for the Brooklyn area to reglaze a tub?

trini73diva

in General Discussion 1 year and 4 months ago

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RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 1 year and 4 months ago

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FWIW I stand by my recommendation. The Painted Otter must do the prep work correctly as their work had held up for neighbors who had work done years before us.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 4 months ago

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to cate’s point, is something like epoxy or even paint crosses from one component to another without something to stabilize it, it will crack. and when it cracks water gets in. this is why when people use polyester resin (fiberglass resin) to tape seams on a boat or tape seams on drywall or patch a roof, a cloth woven fabric is used. a paint or epoxy or polyester resin will not bridge a gap on it’s own.

cate | 1 year and 4 months ago

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Here is a story we recently published about how to reglaze a sink: https://www.brownstoner.com/interiors-renovation/how-to-reglaze-sink-porcelain-antique-salvage-tips/

cate | 1 year and 4 months ago

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In-place refinishing can also fail where paint meets metal, for example at drains and faucets. If you already have cracks and rusting, which you probably do, it’s going to be difficult to fully mask the metal. Ideally you would move the metal but this is not always possible, as around drains. Also even if you do a fine job with the overflow hole(s) they will typically continue to rust out. But moving a tub to reglaze off site is not often even an option, and has its own difficulties. For example, will the drain hardware still fit in the drain hole after reglazing? Off site reglazing is also done with modern epoxies and polymers and heat these days but it’s a much longer process and many times more durable than on site refinishing. Don’t know of any factories currently capable of baking on a true glass enamel finish in a kiln.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 4 months ago

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i just read more. i have not cut into the directions on any of these products and might not. but i just read that these tubs can be done in a few hours and if that is the case, the epoxies are fast curing and it seems if a coat has to be sanded and another added, it can be done in a day. that is my thought from my experience from using other fast curing epoxy products in other situations.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 4 months ago

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850MPH, and i did check and pretty much everything i said above stands. MOST failures occur due to poor surface preparation and failure to let product cure. It seems the finish used is an epoxy (at least on one or two systems i looked at). Epoxy must cure. also, if epoxy is recoated with epoxy, the first coat must be sanded. Because most of my work is hidden, when i use epoxy i sand the substrate with heavy paper. you cannot do that on a recoat and the people doing this will have to follow the manufacturer’s directions to the letter in so far as thorough sanding to the proper grit (heavier is better but at some point the sanding lines show through the top coat).

they stated that another reason these fail is over-catalyzation or under-catalyzation. over catalyzing makes epoxy dry faster. it also makes the cured epoxy coat harder and susceptible to cracking. Read what i say above about many of the people doing the work today: they want to move through it as fast as possible to get to the next job (many of the people working at this level underbid the com petition and then to survive they have to move faster; it hurts the consumer). So over catalyzing the hardener might be something these folks will do to move a job along faster (i am not sure, i am not sure how fast the product sets and if say adding too much catalyst might allow them to put a second coat on in a day; i plan on overnight cures with all of my epoxy work).

under catalyzation leaves epoxy softer and there are reason for doing this in some circumstances but no in a tub or sink.

there is more i know about these products but initially going into to something like this that people want to last 15 years, the manufacturer’s instructions must be followed to the letter. Failure to do that will lead to premature product failure.

cate | 1 year and 4 months ago

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Sorry, some words are missing up in my comment above. I meant to say reglazing in place means removing the original enamel finish on the cast iron.

jrs84o | 1 year and 4 months ago

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GREAT info here, Thnx!

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 1 year and 4 months ago

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The finish does need to be babied somewhat. You can’t use scouring powder, but Softscrub is fine.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 4 months ago

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Cate, i think it means removing a glazing and then spraying something on. the cast iron is the structural base of the tub.

I have not done any reglazing but without even reading about it, I can share a few things about finishing and why one might encounter issues such as peeling and i can tell you that it is in the workmanship. First, back in the day, when i was coming up in this, i was taught that MOST of the work (the time and energy expended) in any finishing job is the prep work (my mother taught me the basics of this in our house; my eighty-year-old mother knows more about doing this sort of work than some of the “professionals” doing it today in Brooklyn). As someone who has done a lot of finishing, including on automobiles and other metals but mostly on wood, i can attest that I spend more time sanding and prepping than anything else. Putting the paint or whatever on is easy; a monkey can do it (except a monkey might put it on too thick and it would peel). KNOW this, with a lot of people today, the mindset has shifted away from spending time on the prep and allowing things to cure, to moving through the job to get paid. with this mindset, we see failure. Peeling is one of the issues we commonly see from failure to prep (to sand to the proper grit; over sanding can lead to peeling as in sanding to say 220 grit for the prime coat; i do not know the grits for glazing but 220 is too fine for wood).

850MPH states that there are a couple different “techniques” to the glazing. Let us be sure not to confuse the word “technique” with “process”. Technique is how one might handle a paint brush or spray gun or roll a piece of sandpaper over an edge when sanding a surface. “Process” is something different. As someone who has coated things with oil and water base paints and primers, lacquers, epoxies, varnishes, waxes, shellacs, and enamels made by over a score of different manufacturers, i can tell you that for the most part, the processes for prepping surfaces and applying finishes is pretty much the same between products and substrates and manufacturers. What might change are the grits, washes, primers, and top coats and whether we brush, spray, or roll – but the process remains the same (and most products that are brushed can be sprayed).

if i were to read about the “processes” between the manufacturers of the glazing products and compare them among each other and even against the work that i do on wood or metal, i would be willing to bet that there is not a lot of variation between them. When we see change in “process” between people who do this work, it is often not an approved change done in consultation with the manufacturer or some other expert for the benefit of the customer, but it is more often a change made out of laziness or to save money or to move through a job faster. Very simply they are not following the manufacturer’s directions and are often skipping a step in the process. This is why jobs fail (i said it above – over or under sanding. but also applying too thick of a coat or failing to allow coats to dry properly between coats).

I might read a little about the application of some of these products and the reasons for failure and compare them but without even doing that, i can tell you finish failure has to do with a failure to follow the recommended process.

cate | 1 year and 4 months ago

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“Reglazing” in place means removing the cast iron and spraying on a paint. It must be babied or it will peel. I’m impressed Bob’s has lasted so long.

jrs84o | 1 year and 4 months ago

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If I remember correctly… it was $700 to have the guy come and spray the tub WITHOUT moving it out of the bathroom, which had been demo’d down to the wall studs for a remodel.

It did take the guy 5 or 6 hours.. taping up the environment, moving big jugs of whatever they use around and upstairs, lots of pumps and sprayer-type stuff— so I thought the price, which included materials was about right…??..?

I have a TOC cast-iron double sink I need to do as well as the tub again this Spring.

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 1 year and 4 months ago

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What painted Otter did to my tub was indeed a spray, but they prepared the surface very well. I don’t expect it to last 5–100 years, but 15–20 years seems to be a reasonable expectation.

jrs84o | 1 year and 4 months ago

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I should mention… the technique that was used on my tub was to simply spray a 1mm soft-ish glaze over the entire tub…. I don’t think the original, chipping/peeling glaze was sanded off fully (or perhaps correctly) in the bad areas.

It looked fantastic for the first two years until it started to peel in the exact same areas which had been problem areas we were trying to repair.

I don’t know if this is coincidence, or simply use-based wear… But I have heard this new peeling should not have happened and there are techniques which should rebuild the glaze to last for 50-100 years.

jrs84o | 1 year and 4 months ago

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Buyer BEWARE:

There are a couple of reglazing techniques… We had our turn of the century claw foot tub done about 5 years ago, and it started peeling in several large areas on the interior within 2 years.

My bad, as I did not (and still have not) researched the 2 or 3 glazing methods.

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 1 year and 4 months ago

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Painted Otter website: https://paintedotter.com/

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 1 year and 4 months ago

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We had our 1899 claw foot tub reglazed a few years ago by the Painted Otter, a company recommended by neighbors. It’s held up quite well, so far.