Hanging pictures in plaster over metal lath
Any tips in hanging pictures in 1940s apartment walls that are plaster over metal lath? It sounds pretty hollow in there, but I can’t locate any studs because the entire surface of wall is magnetic. I’ve used 3M command hooks for some lighter stuff but am leery of using them for a picture that weighs almost 5 lbs.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
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JPDA | 4 years and 11 months ago
The three-pin Ooks are great and should be fine for a 5lb picture. I didn’t see that the OP had specified the weight.
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
BTW this is the kind of hook I use for heavy pictures: [Ook Hook](//muut.com/u/brownstoner/s1/:brownstoner:gH47:ookhook.png.jpg)
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
Toggle bolts are VERY strong, but require a pretty large hole. I wouldn’t use them for a picture, no matter how heavy. Maybe to hang shelves, or something like that.
stevecym | 4 years and 11 months ago
JPDA: if toggle bolts are your choice, so be it. but to me they = antiquated and slow.
JPDA | 4 years and 11 months ago
Using toggle bolts shouldn’t be an issue with plaster and lath walls. Ook makes all kinds of hanger varieties that should work for you.
BTW I also do like the molding clips and wires if you have trim, but I would definitely use steel stranded cable, not monofilament which tends to kink and is hard to adjust.
stevecym | 4 years and 11 months ago
when i have been on old house tours, of old houses way above my or my ancestor’s pay grade, i have noticed that they often hung frames with a sort of nicely braided rope that would have some sort of flower shaped adornment at the top, where it connects with the picture molding. i know, victorians liked all this busy crap around and it is not something we would want today.
@bob, they may not have had monofilament but that had something called “catgut”. it was a string made from animal’s intestines (not cats). i checked, it was also used for guitar strings until sometime in this century.
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
True, but having visible wires xx could be part of the aesthetic—or not—it’s a subjective choice.
shahnandersen
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
But the OP’s appartment is from the 1940s (admittedly ours is a hundred years earlier)
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
I guess monofilament is OK if you’re VERY careful. If it f gets the slightest nick it can brake.
I don’t have picture rails in my house—they’re the only part of the original woodwork that a previous owner removed. However I’ve hung art in venues that do have pictures rails and I’ve always used wire. I’d do the same if picture rails remained in my home. FWIW Victorians didn’t have monofilament. .
shahnandersen
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
@Bob Marvin
The suggestion of using fishing line was made in conjunction with stevecym’s recommendation of using the picture molding to hang the paintings. In that case, several feet of the hanging wire is exposed with each painting. Stranded picture wire is simply inappropriate in those cases. I use 50 lb Test Monofilament Line which works fine as long as you use a pliers to tie the line tight onto the eyes on the picture frame. Some of my pictures have been up for over 35 years without a mishap.
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
I’ve used the Ook [and similar, but even better, Floreat] hooks in hard plaster many times, in many locations–including my own home. I’ve never had a problem. I’ve found that a battery operated electric hammer is less likely to bend the nails in hard plaster, but a regular hammer, carefully used, is fine.
The quality of Ook hooks suffered when the distributer switched from a German to a Chinese manufacturer; the Floreat hooks appear to be made by the same German company that made the original Ook version. The first Ook hooks from China, with thin nails that looked just like the German version, had nails that sometimes broke. They’ve solved the problem by making them slightly thicker. I prefer the Floreat nails , but the newest version by Ook are now OK too.
IronBalls | 4 years and 11 months ago
Do not use nails in plaster unless you don’t mind some of the plaster breaking off. First put a small piece of blue painters tape on the area where you want the hanger, and then drill a regular drywall screw directly into the plaster or through a picture hanger into the wall.
stevecym | 4 years and 11 months ago
i would be worried about putting something into hard plaster. soft ok, but hard could splay it.
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
Whoops— hardened steel NAILS
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
Steve—the Ook hooks use very thin sharp hardened steel hooks. They don’t need a pilot hole and only leave a tiny pinprick if you remove them. I’ve done many art installations for PLG Arts using these hooks and all the art in my house hangs from them. The largest Ook hooks use three nails and are rated for 100 Lbs. I’d take that ratings with a grain of salt, but wouldn’t hesitate to hang a 20 Lb. picture from one
BTW, someone suggested using fishing line to hang art—BAD IDEA! It can break without warning. Use STRANDED picture wire.
stevecym | 4 years and 11 months ago
ok bob. but wait. i am thinking about the damage we can cause putting things in walls. i am a contractor – not the weight of the object, i have to think of the “what if”.
when we sometimes drill into plaster on wood lath, we can hear the “keying” fall off the back of the plaster and tumble down in the wall. and do not think that i do not stand there and wonder if the plaster will move away from the lath (it never has). so i was wondering if the act of drilling into the plaster in metal lath would undermine the integrity of the wall. i have thought about this querry and realize that i have worked in some of the bigger buildings with metal lath and probably have hung things on metal lath and plaster walls with no issue. but it never hurts to consider the “what if”.
and never drive a nail into a plaster wall without a pilot hole. you can drive one in sheetrock and into sheetrock and into a stud – but plaster must be pre drilled with a bit a tad s maller than the nail. then put your picture hanger in.
after thinking about this, i think the plaster on metal lath is probably as strong as reinforced concrete. almost.
cate | 4 years and 11 months ago
OOK hooks are terrific. Best I’ve ever used. Won’t damage plaster, don’t need to find a stud. If you’re hanging something extremely heavy or anchoring furniture or cabinets to the wall, use plaster anchors.
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 4 years and 11 months ago
We’re talking about a little 5 pound picture. Granted the weight ratings on Ook hooks are exaggerated, but a “20 Lb. hook will be fine. The only problem would be if the nails hits the lathe, but moving it 1/8th inch would solve that problem.
stevecym | 4 years and 11 months ago
or read about hanging things on metal lath? perhaps we have drill into it unknowing? perhaps it is just like drilling into concrete and setting an anchor? i mean, what is the scratch coat in plaster made out of? maybe this is better than wood lath?
sorry, i can only pose the questions on this one but as a contractor that is the process we go through when we come up against something we have not seen before.