Gas vs. Heat Pump Conversion

Hello Everyone – We have a 4 story brownstone with two duplex apartments that has an ancient oil boiler. We need a new system and we are trying to decide between gas or heat pumps. For a gas conversion + removal of the old system we were quoted ~$20k and ~$45K (after rebate) for a heat pump system + removal of the old system with 10 units (5 per duplex apartment). We haven’t made any major insulation investments. Gas is certainly the cheaper route, but we’d like to move towards a more sustainable future so we are considering the electric option.

My questions are 1) does anyone have a similar sized electric heating system and would be willing to share the monthly electric costs? 2) does anyone have any experience with long term maintenance of an electric system?

We are open to the extra cost for installation, but we are concerned that we will also be paying a higher monthly energy cost AND we’ll have to spend a lot more money over time to maintain the system.

mofish

in General Discussion 3 years and 1 month ago

28

Please log in, in order to post replies!

28 replies

Newest Oldest

lkrshacmzcy | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#5080 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5068 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "209518"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(11) "lkrshacmzcy"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$Bqvt72Mt4bRnZYx4l2.8v65b1dA59S/"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(11) "lkrshacmzcy"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "artjimenez78@gmail.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2024-07-02 16:32:25"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(11) "lkrshacmzcy"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(209518)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(1) {
    [0]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

Please send your 20K Oil to Gas Conversion company this way…I have some questions for them!

lkrshacmzcy | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#5079 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5078 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "209518"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(11) "lkrshacmzcy"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$Bqvt72Mt4bRnZYx4l2.8v65b1dA59S/"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(11) "lkrshacmzcy"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "artjimenez78@gmail.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2024-07-02 16:32:25"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(11) "lkrshacmzcy"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(209518)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(1) {
    [0]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

Please send your 20K Oil to Gas Conversion company this way…I have some questions for them!

ellenlourie | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#5075 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5081 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "209451"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(11) "ellenlourie"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BW7BCPC4MhhU4md6aHcLH/64c1GhM1/"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(11) "ellenlourie"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "ellen.lourie@gmail.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2024-06-29 12:47:36"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(11) "ellenlourie"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(209451)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(1) {
    [0]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

The residential heat pump chillers would be a very good option with radiant floors. they also can be used for radiant cooling and domestic hot water generation as well. You can also set up micro CHP as an alternative, check out Enviropower, it will provide heat, domestic hot water, and electricity. But works on gas.

nyc_sport | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#5078 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5080 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "39535"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(9) "nyc_sport"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BFv.HDXnnlYzjvInY5Q64aXS/5iuhf1"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(9) "nyc_sport"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(16) "btfraw@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(24) "/forums/users/nyc_sport/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:16:50"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(45) "1716947865:$P$BBdyqKX22eBh6JksYu8L5KasH0jSlb."
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(9) "nyc_sport"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(39535)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

$20K for a full new system gas conversion in a four story, presumably multi-zoned system sounds very cheap

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "2"
object(WP_User)#5078 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5091 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(3) "779"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(13) "RobertGMarvin"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(13) "RobertGMarvin"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(40) "64df18426207ddf12f1789eba7eabd04a9c3f615"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2007-08-10 18:03:45"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(10) "Bob Marvin"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(779)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(0) {
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(0) {
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(0) {
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

It certainly has changed. Back in the ‘80s a neighbor was selling heat pumps in conjunction with some sort of ConEd pilot program. The catch was that you had to disable your gas or oil system and use electric resistance heat when the temperatures dropped too low for the heat pump to work. It was prohibitively expensive and AFAIK all the systems ended up as useless junk on the buyers’ roofs.

stevecym | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4857 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4860 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "21525"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(8) "stevecym"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(8) "stevecym"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(24) "stevecymbalsky@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(30) "/forums/users/thetinkerswagon/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:05:31"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(20) "xLyD4JX1CSeJzFu7zs4j"
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(8) "stevecym"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(21525)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

And to what i said above about heat pumps, my experience with them dates from the 1980s and early 90s. Technologically, a lot can change in 30 years. But from what people like lurker say, i do not think that is the case.

stevecym | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4856 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4858 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "21525"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(8) "stevecym"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(8) "stevecym"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(24) "stevecymbalsky@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(30) "/forums/users/thetinkerswagon/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:05:31"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(20) "xLyD4JX1CSeJzFu7zs4j"
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(8) "stevecym"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(21525)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

There has been at lot written about this on here. As to what lurker is saying, i once lived on coastal north carolina where heat pumps are quite popular. Even on cold winter nights down there, the auxiliary electric heat came on and when that was on, the electric meter spun like a fan.

There is something else i learned on this board. I turn the heat way down at night and when we are out during the day. When i had a heat pump. I was always cold. Here, i turn the steam heat on and an hour later the house is warm. Someone on here said the issue with heat pumps is they heat slowly over time and maintain. No blast of heat as with a steam radiator. No turning a heat pump on and an hour later the house or apartment is warm. I don’t miss the heat pump.

If you look back a few months you will find the other comments about the heat pump.

Lurker | 3 years and 1 month ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#5078 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5082 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "113126"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(6) "Lurker"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$Biam83uc193o8.v5qK1VChb9yjJ5vu."
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(6) "lurker"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "jcjedi_10003@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(21) "/forums/users/lurker/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2011-01-19 18:44:20"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(6) "Lurker"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(113126)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

I’m sure you’ll get many comments, but my understanding is that in our locale heat pumps tend to not be not powerful enough for the coldest weather we get, depending on your home’s insulation, windows, exposure etc. And that since nat gas is so cheap and electricity relatively expensive, at times there are some really big electricity bills. I don’t own and only have anecdotal evidence and had also looked into heat pump myself and decided against.