Experiences with Elevator in Brownstone
Ask your architect to look at installing a LULA instead of a traditional elevator. It wouldn’t Allow access to the full height of the building but the machinery takes up far less space and the maintenance and inspection requirements are more limited.
Guest User | 2 years and 2 months ago
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melissa.smith | 2 years and 2 months ago
We are moving to a brownstone which needs significant renovation. However, one of the reasons we are moving from our apartment is that my elderly parents will move in with us. Both have mobility restrictions and will be confined to the first floor unless we put in an elevator. We are not rich–but as we have to do extensive renovations, we are considering an elevator. We wanted to know about the costs from anyone with experience–both installation and annual maintenance (as well as which companies are good and which to avoid) Thank you so much for any advice you can offer, and yes, I know our architect and contractor will have opinions but I like to get a sense myself!
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 2 years and 2 months ago
Stairlifts might be a less expensive alternative, if your staircases would accommodate them.
justinromeu26 | 2 years and 2 months ago
Coming from a commercial environment, because of the safety considerations and liability concerns with these machines and the specialized and highly insured (and probably union) contractors who work on them, i suspect you will find such to be prohibitive. Some very old houses in certain areas have them. I work in all neighborhoods in this city and do not see them going in as modern retrofits. I used to manage the maintenance for elevators and the related contracts but cannot recall particulars.
Steve
Brownstonehomeinspection.com
brokelin | 2 years and 2 months ago
I knew one person who was happy when her mother-in-law moved into their garden apartment that she couldn’t access the rest of the house – some people need space from their parents. Presumably, you don’t, but think about whether you might like it in the future.
Can’t answer your questions on cost, but if you can swing it, without the elevator being too small (should be large enough for a wheelchair and attendant), or being awkwardly built into into the space (some brownstone floorplans would seem to be too small for one), there are many additional benefits to having one, not just for the elderly who need it for access. It solves many issues for the merely middle-aged and still spry as well.
It is useful for carrying large loads, furniture, laundry, babies/strollers, groceries if kitchen is not on lowest floor, can serve a dumbwaiter function if dining room is on the floor above kitchen floor, or you want to entertain on the parlor floor sometimes and kitchen and dining areas are below, useful for guests of all abilities, useful so you don’t have to move out tempor arily if you break a leg or have surgery to recover from, and makes it possible to age in place there longer yourself if you decide to do so.
brokelin | 2 years and 2 months ago
Presume you saw this post from a few years ago that addresses a lot of the questions:
https://www.brownstoner.com/interiors-renovation/elevator-brooklyn-brownstone-townhouse-renovation-tips-costs-floor-plan/
melissa.smith | 2 years and 2 months ago
thank you all so much. i know it costs a lot and i was just wondering about the upkeep. my parents may be willing to put some of their savings to it. we actually want them to be able to come up every night for dinner. they are quite old and have some conditions so while one never knows, i don’t envision more than five years, but i’d like those to be happy and they are pretty respectful. i also saw how their stairs became prohibitive and it would be nice to be able to age in place when the time comes and now worry if my knees go which seems to be a family tradition. I did see that ad and I saw a few older things in the forum. you all are very helpful! our nuclear family is only three and the top three floors offer 3000 feet of space: way more than we need so we could fit an elevator where others might have a closet. (it’s only a two family. a two-family in ruins, but a two family with the basement as a separate apartment)
Guest User | 2 years and 2 months ago
We aren’t putting an elevator in our renovated house yet, but we have prepared a space for one, in case we can no longer use the stairs. If we do get an elevator, it would be pneumatic. In my notes I have “Vision Elevators carries three pneumatic elevator models. The Vision 350 is the most compact – 30 inches in diameter and can support up to 350 pounds. The Vision 450 is 37 inches in diameter, enough for two people (dimensions for the rough opening are larger), The largest one can hold a wheelchair. I believe one is required to have a telephone installed. Somewhere I read that pneumatic elevators require less frequent inspections, but don’t take that as fact. Don’t forget electricity – I think the elevator requires something like 50 amps (again, that should be checked). I can’t vouch for them, because we haven’t actually installed an elevator, but there is more information at
https://glass-elevators.com/eo-space-needed-for-a-vacuum-elevator-in-your-home.p hp. Also I believe that at one point I spoke with a Frank Sacco at 101 Mobility, (516) 962-2765.
Good luck.
Guest User | 2 years and 2 months ago
PS, in my files I have a DOB guide to elevators. If you can’t find it, give your email address and I will send it to you. I think it makes a lot of sense for you to install an elevator.
chemosphere | 2 years and 2 months ago
Some people do them in back of the house. Check out 120 President st. You can see the shaft on google maps street view. Some people even do them in the front of the house! Check out 181 Hooper St!
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.6829476,-74.0021461,3a,37.5y,326.91h,87.43t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1s34O_3TDjZbxdwrq13XzqSA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192
https://www.google.com/maps/place/179+Hooper+St,+Brooklyn,+NY+11211/@40.7046767,-73.957544,3a,75y,315.52h,107.02t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sEqRn4Sz_diqGs-idKnDKMA!2e0!7i16384!8i8192!4m7!3m6!1s0x89c25be70bba73a5:0x4ca5a4f5271a1d8c!8m2!3d40.7047608!4d-73.9577324!10e5!16s%2Fg%2F11c4xqfbwd
randolph | 2 years and 2 months ago
> @mjervie
> We are not rich—but as we have to do extensive renovations, we are considering an elevator.
LMAO sorry, but you are rich. anyone doing extensive renovations on a Brooklyn brownstone and even considering installing an elevator is undeniably rich.
cate | 2 years and 2 months ago
Oh Randi: Retired parents splitting some real estate and renovation costs with family so they can be cared for at home.
cate | 2 years and 2 months ago
Many people aging in place in brownstones use stair lifts, as Bob mentions. Especially feasible if most of the run is straight. They are temporary and can be added and removed later as you wish.
randolph | 2 years and 2 months ago
a little googling tells me that at ages 65 – 74:
Average household retirement savings: $426,070
Median household retirement savings: $164,000
Brownstoner’s own article says the cost of installing an elevator is $200k. Do the math…
I am all for retired parents and their kids splitting the cost of a renovation, but these are rich people things (which i am also totally OK with). just saying lets not pretend this is a normal survival issue. this is 1% stuff.
RobertGMarvin
in General Discussion 2 years and 2 months ago
“Rich” is subjective. I’m “rich” by virtue of the present value of the house I bought for five figures in 1974, but it sure doesn’t feel like it.
justinromeu26 | 2 years and 2 months ago
Many working class people who spent 30 yrs paying a mortgage off and are now elderly could easily sell a home on long island for say 750 and build and elevator in a child’s house and still have plenty leftover. That would not make them rich.
brokelin | 2 years and 2 months ago
Feeling rich is subjective – there are always people richer than even the quite very rich. I I would call those who can sell their house for that 750K profit after 30 years well off. Those who have millions of equity in a house are clearly wealthy, even if they don’t feel it – if they needed funds for any purpose, say medical treatment or long-term care, they’d have it available, though they may have to sell their home to unlock it – those without equity don’t have that option. Having one’s assets not liquid, but rather in unexpected real estate appreciation, does not remove those assets from one.
People forget how poor most Americans actually are. Those who feel like they are middle class, meaning those who are not worried about being able to access basic housing, transportation, food, child care and health care when needed, or aren’t worried about being able to pay living expenses in their retirement years, even those who are of the U.S. working class variety of middle class who are in that position, are far better off than the majority of Americans.
That’s b efore even getting to the the various upper levels of “middle class” that many in brownstone Brooklyn are – yes, many are in that category, even though housing and other costs, and the grind one feels working the hours needed in many jobs to get there, can make it hard to feel it on a day to day basis. I find it useful to remember how most people in this country get by, even in periods when my work or finances have felt difficult; others find it useful to complain in the midst of plenty – to each their own coping mechanisms.
Remember, in the U.S., most people claim to be “middle class” – from the financially insecure working poor to those who are in the top 2-5% – on both ends, people have an aversion to calling ourselves anything other than “middle class” – but that doesn’t make it true.
Guest User | 2 years and 2 months ago
I am late with this, but don’t understand why Randolph wrote “lets not pretend this is a normal survival issue. this is 1% stuff.” I didn’t see anyone treating this as a “survival issue”. But to me the desire to avoid aging parents being isolated is a loving act, not the kind of thing I associate with “1% stuff”. This is what many ordinary Americans of limited means, and indeed people throughout the world, do all the time – make a home for aging parents. The elevator is an (admittedly expensive) detail.
Guest User | 2 years and 2 months ago
Rich is probably a subjective term. We are all rich beyond most of the world population’s wildest imaginations. I have also seen numerous people far wealthier than I be priced out of their own co-op in lower Manhattan. They probably didn’t feel rich at the time. Incomes and prices are mind boggling in a lot of ways in this city. The below article is a good example of that. I like the ideas of cost savings chair lift and creative preserving of shaftway space for potential elevator in future without unnecessarily saddling with expense and maintenance/compliance costs now. These are both savvy/thoughtful approaches to take in this expensive city
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2023-03-15/new-york-city-prices-make-100-000-salary-feel-like-35-000?leadSource=uverify%20wall
randolph | 2 years and 2 months ago
Glad I could spur this conversation, I agree with what everyone is saying about the subjectivity of poor/rich and I think it’s important to stay aware of one’s relative place in the world in both a micro and macro sense. The world is a lot larger than the 5 boroughs and it’s easy to forget this especially for New Yorkers.