Eliminating super squeaky floors from above?

We finally have a chance to deal with a tenants super squeaky floor. It’s an old original pine plank floor over an old plank subfloor and it squeaks TERRIBLY. Like it will wake you up if someone walks in the room above.

When we had the chance years ago and were working underneath we ran resilient channel and added sound insulation between the joists. But this squeak is still terrible so now we will attack it from the top.

New carpeting and padding will be going down so we don’t care about damaging or aesthetics of the wood floor and are open to whatever it takes to get rid of the squeaking- it’s that bad.
Of course we’ll try screwing down boards, though this can be tricky over areas with no joist below.
One idea was to lay a layer of plywood over everything but I’m not sure what the best approach.
Also open to flooring guy recs if you have someone who has successful fixed this before.

Thanks for any advice, I’m sure I’m not the only one who’s dealt with this.

stickerhappy

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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yes. i would visit laying 1/2 of real subfloor plywood and figure out where the squeaks are and screw through the ply into those boards to tighten them up. use pl400 as you lay the plywood. don’t worry about sanding off old finish with the PL as you are not using it to hold the floor down but to sit between the ply and floor to bind it up and keep it from squeaking. i would use extra pl 400 where the squeaks are. this will give you a super firm floor.

i don’t think 1/4″ ply is really enough for what you are trying to do. but you might get away with it. i know, adding ply changes floor heights and transitions.

do not use anything but stuff rated as subfloor. if the wrong stuff gets wet you will have problems.

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Ok well I was wrong.
There is no subfloor, just one layer of old pine planks- that’s the only flooring.
So the lower floor has a subfloor but the second floor doesn’t.
Does this change the approach to fixing the squeaks?

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Look up toe nailing. People did it years ago to hold things in the might come off or down. I still nail heavy pieces of wood this way with my nail gun.

The reason i say toe screw as opposed to toe nailing is toe nailing with a hammer and most definitely with a nail gun will push the wood flooring pieces apart as opposed to draw them together.

If i were going to toe screw these, i might put a screw in straight to pull it all together. Then put one at an angle near by. Two inches to the side. Nailing and screwing this way makes it hard for things to pull apart. Over time. Also, i would not put any screw in perfectly straight, give it a bit of angle. A little bit. As you angle away from the direction of the pull it gets harder for it to pull out. It can’t.

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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What do you mean by “toe” screw?

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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So plywood might disperse load so the weight of a footstep is not all placed on a creaky spot.

Since you don’t care about the floor surface, i have been wondering if you can toe “screw” the boards. This should bind them together. Use old fashioned wood screws, not sheet metal screws (better chance of drawing together) But my fear is that one could back out in time if the floor wants to move or if the wood is really bad. Maybe screw them and recess deep enough to put an epoxy plug behind them.

Btw, i googled epoxy for squeaky floors and an entire list of things came up. I did not have that choice when i did this decades ago.

Keep in mind, these premixed epoxy cartridges that go in guns get pricey fast. Last year, i did the same thing as a favor (that means i am not marketing myself here, to you) for a customer and drilled small holes in the floor and used larger hyperdermic needles to inject the epoxy. I was using west system epoxy from a large container which is a lot cheaper than these gun kits.

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Does it make sense to put a layer of other material like rubber or foam down before I lay a layer of plywood over everything?

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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And no squeaks heard from below either?

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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That’s what we had in our kitchen. It looked good for years until it started wearing out (one board actually broke through—I put a plywood patch over it). We now have a second 1/2” plywood subfloor and new pre-finished oak. AND no squeaks.

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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the old plank floor is the sub floor.

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Good thought but we definitely have a subfloor

cate | 2 years and 3 months ago

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First be sure you actually have a subfloor. We don’t. Our pine boards are the subfloor.

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Understand, squeaks come from lateral movement between the finish floor and sub floor.

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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So the epoxy method is used when the squeak is between a floor and sub floor. It binds the wood together so they do not rub. Removes spongeeness.

I also had a sagging sub floor here on my bottom landing on the stairs. From people stepping on the same spot for 80 years. I ripped to oak finish floor up and cut new wood and epoxied it down over the old sub floor. It is bound together now, no sag and no squeak. Same crappy sub floor.

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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What about if the squeak is not on the joist?
How will epoxy help?

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Drill through the top wood and inject epoxy into it with an epoxy gun.

I can tell you more later. When i did it we were limited in the product and guns but with so much stuff out there, this should be easy.

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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That’s what I did. I’m not sure it’s better, but it’s certainly less expensive and worked well.

stickerhappy | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Ok that’s interesting to hear.
I assume better to just put a new layer over the existing pine floor than rip it all out down to joists and put new subfloor?

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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FWIW the only floor in my house that doesn’t squeek is the kitchen where we had a new oak floor laid over 1/2″ plywood on top of the original pine floor.