Asbestos Abatement - full or partial?

We recently found out that our house has asbestos plaster in all the original walls.

We are devastated, both because the price of abating the walls (50-70k) and replacing them with new sheetrock walls (another 50k?) is super expensive, but also because we’d be getting rid of the charming original plaster walls and moldings that make the house beautiful…

We were considering trying to be strategic and only abate about 50% of the walls, leaving some walls in the parlor with cove ceiling moldings and cutting precise holes in the plaster in those areas for new electric. But our architect and numerous contractors and electricians have said this is a bad idea as leaving any amount of asbestos is a liability issue.

I also wonder about the consequences for the value of the house when we sell it one day if it were ever to be found out that there was still asbestos in some of the walls.

In short, should we just bite the bullet and do a full abatement – or should we try to retain some of the walls and do a partial? The price difference all in all between the two options would probably be around 40k.

Any advice greatly appreciated!!

Guest User | 5 years and 11 months ago

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cate | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Squibsie, yes, I do think you could find an electrician to do it. First talk to the asbestos people and they will open up and remove the plaster with the asbestos BEFORE the electricians do their work. (As well, electricians wear masks and expect to come into contact with harmful stuff.) Bob, glad you survived the live shower curtain rod!

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 5 years and 11 months ago

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Cate: If by “tranches” you mean long channels this is not actually necessary. It’s possible to cut rather small holes and snake BX cable through the walls. I’ve done this. I worked as an electrician’s helper one summer in the early ’60s and got pretty good at snaking wires. Of course I wasn’t allowed to actually connect anything [which lead to an interesting situation several years later when I ran a new circuit in my first apartment [which the landlord foolishly OKed] and ended up with a “live” shower curtain rod–a story for another time.

Guest User | 5 years and 11 months ago

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@cate Thanks for your advice but do you think we could find an electrician who’d be willing to rewire our house given the asbestos? Even if we have asbestos contractors cut the holes, so far people seem very freaked out by the idea.

cate | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Also: When doing a whole house electrical upgrade, code dictates to an extent the number, type, and location of outlets per room. However, you should absolutely map in advance and mark with crosses of blue painters tape where you want everything to do and speak to your electrician about it as well as provide written instructions (e.g. save the medallions, put outlets for sconces next to where bed will be here, where you want GFC outlets in kitchens and bathrooms, etc.) Best to buy fixtures in advance if you can, especially bathroom and kitchen fixtures because their location may need to be exact depending on location of stove, sink, medicine cabinet, etc. Measure everything! We used temporary basement fixtures but we had selected our bathroom and kitchen fixtures and measured with the electrician there because there was no room for error because of the layout of the rooms, location of studs, and a tin ceiling in one case.

cate | 5 years and 11 months ago

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You do not have to demo all your walls to do a whole house electrical upgrade. They take out tranches of the plaster, run the electric, then close up the holes again. It is extremely messy and plaster dust will be all over the place. It would be impossible to live in the house while this work is being done, and you must cover mantels, fretwork screens, antique built-in stoves, floors, and so on while the work is being done. Why don’t you speak to an asbestos abatement firm and see if they could handle remediation of only the select portions of the walls and ceilings you need to remove, following the guide of the electrician as to where the tranches need to be cut? The procedure is similar to removing everything, it’s just you will be removing much less of it.

Guest User | 5 years and 11 months ago

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@elodie, That is interesting that you also had asbestos in your horsehair plaster… I have googled extensively and it seems it’s very rare.

@Greenthinker yes I like your idea of keeping the plaster safely in the walls by skim coating and painting — however where we run into trouble is that we need new electric. Cutting holes in the plaster and fishing wires is definitely going to be disturbing the plaster. And I’ve done research and can find almost no info on other folks who have cut precise holes in asbestos plaster and rewired a house – seems like it’s not really done?

Chris and Mat – I don’t think we have pipe insulation asbestos, but if we did we could get it abated with the plaster… Pipe insulation asbestos would be a drop in the bucket compared to the ocean of asbestos we have, sadly!

veebee

in General Discussion 5 years and 11 months ago

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This same thing happened to us. We bought a house in PLG and when the plaster was tested (the horsehair kind) it came back positive in several places. Now it was under 1 percent in most spots and didn’t technically require abatement. But in other spots it was slightly over. 1 percent. We are doing full abatement all over and are now gutting the home. I strongly disagree with anyone saying “if it’s left untouched it’s safe.” In a perfect world, yes. But what if you get a random leak or your ceiling caves in? The you have asbestos all your home and items. Old homes are not stable and it’s too risky to just let it sit lurking behind every surface. This also applies to lead paint. I know a family who followed the “if it’s left untouched it’s safe approach.” One night after dinner they came home to their apartment and the entire dining room ceiling had fallen to the ground. They unknowingly slept there that night but opened the windows. Turned out the ceiling had lead paint in it and now dust was EVERYWHERE and their children were highly exposed. They were never able to retur n to the home and lost a lot of their personal items.
If I could go back in time I would not have purchased an older home.

lkrshacmzcy | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Asbestos on pipes is a high probability if you have not worked on the pipes since the 90s or 80s. When we do an install and see Asbestos, everything is immediately stopped until it is taken care of. We actually need an ACP-5 with every LAA we file.

lkrshacmzcy | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Asbestos on pipes is a high probability if you have not worked on the pipes since the 90s or 80s. When we do an install and see Asbestos, everything is immediately stopped until it is taken care of. We actually need an ACP-5 with every LAA we file.

angelique.m.west | 5 years and 11 months ago

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You will probably find asbestos in other parts of your house, like wrapped around pipes in your basement. If the asbestos is undisturbed you don’t have to worry about it. It’s just like having lead paint on your walls. No doubt there are layers of it but it’s been covered so many times, likely by new non-lead paint, that there’s nothing to be concerned about.

GreenThinker | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Not a big deal, the asbestos itself is encapsulated and under layers of paint. Unless you cut or drill into it, it’s not going anywhere or effecting your health. And even then, that amount is not going to kill you 20-30 years down the road. You can always skim coat all the walls, which is a new 1/8 of an inch layer of compound/plaster with fiberglass mesh embedded to deal with any cracks.

Guest User | 5 years and 11 months ago

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Thanks so much for responding, resident2 and Susan…

resident2 – The house is from 1899 and has plaster lath walls with horsehair plaster. From all my research it is highly unusual to have asbestos in that kind of plaster, as you wrote – however we did do an official asbestos test at a lab and it did come back positive, to our horror… We tested multiple walls over the whole house and all the original walls seem to have it in the “brown coat” of plaster that lies over the lath. Our neighbors had the same issue in their house which is identical to ours.

Susan – Thanks for the tip about the other thread, I was the OP on that thread. 🙂

Jasperrose11 | 5 years and 11 months ago

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You may want to check out this asbestos thread from a few weeks ago. The reader has walls with an undercoat of plaster that contain just about 1.5% asbestos and was debating what to do – https://www.brownstoner.com/forum/#!/general-discussion:rewiring-a-house-with-asbes

resident2 | 5 years and 11 months ago

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From what Vintage is this house? It is most unlikely that any house from the late 1800’s or early 1900’s has asbestos in the plaster.
Who did the testing? A few years ago I got a call from someone asking for my opinion on this subject because their contractor had told them there was asbestos in the plaster. I told them to get an independent test done…. none to be found. It turned out the so called GC was actually an asbestos contractor that was running out of asbestos work!
Is the asbestos in insulation within the walls?