Relative value of upper vs lower duplex in 4-story brownstone

We are looking at buying a brownstone with another couple. For those of you out there who have done this, I have a question. We are planning on dividing a 4-story brownstone into an upper and lower duplex. How did you decide on the relative value of upper to lower duplex when you bought? In our case, the whole building needs a lot of work, which we will split costs on and we are also planning on both apts eventually having access to the garden. The bottom duplex will have exclusive use of an unfinished basement. The parlor floor has 12ft ceilings, compared to 9ft ceilings on 3rd and 4th floors. We plan to covert to condos. How have other people decided on relative value of each unit? Any advice is appreciated.

branchanna

in Garden 11 years and 11 months ago

8

Please log in, in order to post replies!

8 replies

Newest Oldest

mukti | 10 years and 9 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4929 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4917 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "182724"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(5) "mukti"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BWrCl0sic9jQIWcyGsrpJB5Iufs.Vh."
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(5) "mukti"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(18) "sumibiz@icloud.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 13:48:20"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(5) "mukti"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(182724)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(1) {
    [0]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(1) {
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

branchanna, I have the same question. How did this work out for you? How did you end up dividing the relative value of the two halves? In our case the lower half is clearly worth more, with high ceilings, all period detail, two working marble fireplaces, deck, garden access, access to cellars. We’re thinking 2/5 (upper) : 3/5 (lower) or even 1/3 (upper) to 2/3 (lower). What did you decide on?

winelover | 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4928 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4927 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "12941"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(9) "winelover"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BBQKMD6PqHr6LtzRlbs2Iwx.Ef7VT1."
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(14) "wine-lover-2-2"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(21) "wiscofactor@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(47) "http://bstoner.wpengine.com/forums/users/north/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-17 21:40:30"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(20) "UD1JpVmkVOzvhCeYKXUj"
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(10) "wine lover"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(12941)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

i have never done this, but having owned buildings, if you have one with a true basement, make it a shared storage space for things only in rubber containers (or similar for waterproofing) and have them stored on shelves.  share it also for bikes.  you can integrate the hatch with a ramp for getting in and out. i’d give exclusive use of the garden to the lower duplex, and roof rights (can they build up too if allowed?) to the upper duplex.  there are flooding issues in NYC, and a true basement works best for waterproofed storage.  also, consider adding sump pumps for that reason.

slopegirl | 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4924 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4930 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "34682"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(9) "slopegirl"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BmPjvLLXxuJIHCzkqN9h9/FLl7akcD."
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(9) "slopegirl"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(21) "sarah_11215@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(24) "/forums/users/slopegirl/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 13:49:17"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(9) "slopegirl"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(34682)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

I would agree in legal documents ASSIGN the garden to one unit, and invite the others over as long as you want… one day someone might want to move out and then I’d think you’ll be glad of having everything clear at the outset. My logic would have it that garden duplex gets the garden.

shahnandersen

in Garden 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "2"
object(WP_User)#137690 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#5123 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(1) "6"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(13) "shahnandersen"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(13) "shahnandersen"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(31) "brownstoner@brownstoner.com.old"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(27) "brownstoner.com/renovation1"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2006-09-08 20:12:54"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(6)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(0) {
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(0) {
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(0) {
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

They parlor floor in a brownstone is usually the most attractive, with the highest ceilings, especially if you can preserve some of the details.  Thays why most in most owner occupied four story two family homes, the owner takes the parlor floor (lower duplex, upper triplex).  If you throw in exclusive cellar access, I’d say that the lower duplex would be worth more, even with shared garden access.

dorkofwindsor | 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#137692 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#137693 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "176774"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(13) "dorkofwindsor"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$Bov.472kQmY8OGlKN.dDXa5nt5gnOG0"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(13) "dorkofwindsor"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(23) "dorkofwindsor@yahoo.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(28) "/forums/users/dorkofwindsor/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:25:48"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(13) "dorkofwindsor"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(176774)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

have someone appraise it.  that’s what any competent business dealing, which is exactly what this is, needs to happen.  I would also see if i could get a brokers opinion as well (a busy one), since they are closest to the market.

needmtg | 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#137691 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#137694 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "42472"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(7) "needmtg"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(7) "needmtg"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(23) "cmurthi@seeinggreen.net"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(18) "/forums/users/cmu/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 13:51:22"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(7) "needmtg"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(42472)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

briank, did you  read that they’re actually BUYING a place with another couple? And you think sharing a garden would do ’em in? To OP: when I was thinking about doing this, I just assigned arbitrary values to amenites: garden (but if shared that’s irrevant,) deck on parlor floor vs roof deck (but the latter is so much more expensive to build,) better light on the top floors vs higher a/c costs,easier access for bikes to the lower (but again if you share the hallway this is moot,) etc. It pretty much wound up even-to-10% bias to the lower duplex imo.

briank | 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#137690 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#137695 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "176782"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(6) "briank"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BYm9U7BPmwsu0Wj1xUfPKg7/bRYGEN0"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(6) "briank"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "licensedarch@gmail.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(28) "http:///forums/users/briank/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:25:48"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(6) "briank"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(176782)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

the link did not show up corrcetly, here it is again: http://www.kadievstudio.com/sisco-68-main.html

briank | 11 years and 11 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#137692 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#137696 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "176782"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(6) "briank"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BYm9U7BPmwsu0Wj1xUfPKg7/bRYGEN0"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(6) "briank"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "licensedarch@gmail.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(28) "http:///forums/users/briank/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:25:48"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(6) "briank"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(176782)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

Hmmm, I have done something very similar in Manhattan few years ago: http://www.kadievstudio.com/sisco-68-main.html The great draw to the lower apartment was the way the cellar would be integrated and it became in fact a triplex. I have to warn you though, against giving them both access to the garden-it will create all sort of problems down the road, sharing only sounds good in principle 🙂 It’s better to give the garden to the lower duplex and a roof terrace to the upper one. Good luck!