Window bars as fire code violation?

Not all banks enforce the window bars rule. I have a few banks that I work with that don’t care. I ask all my clients now about the window bars on our first conversation as it started coming up a few years back and caused issues.  I had a previous client and architect put together guidelines from the fire code, the NY townhouse guide and landmarks dept. I made it into a pdf and I have had appraiser’s use it in their reports from time to time or sent with a letter of explanation to the lender to satisfy their concerns.  Although there are a few lenders that can not be swayed regardless of this and they will only lend if you install releases on the bars.   -Adam Dahill WCS Lending

adam_dahill

in Building Code 13 years and 8 months ago

4

Please log in, in order to post replies!

4 replies

Newest Oldest

deano | 13 years and 8 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4932 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4894 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(6) "176902"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(5) "deano"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BSJkB7.59Q//kadbm20/R638tXVvxn0"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(5) "deano"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(23) "brownstoner@vitelli.org"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(20) "/forums/users/deano/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:25:52"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(5) "deano"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(176902)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

Hoping to close on a 4-family in the coming month, and the bank is balking after the appraisal, saying that the fixed window bars that are front & back on the garden level must be removed or have “safety latches” fitted before they’ll let the deal proceed.  Quite understandable, but their message so far is a little vague — my question is this:  does anyone know if *all* fixed bars must be removed, or if code requires that only bedroom windows need this access?  Garden-level front windows with fixed bars seems a common sight, so I’m wondering what I actually need to get done here.

NeoGrec | 13 years and 8 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4933 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4934 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(4) "1741"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(7) "NeoGrec"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BOvBZSSoDDccMCffw1igzkiT0t5s1D."
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(7) "neogrec"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(21) "rparr@randomhouse.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(36) "http:///forums/users/grandarmyredux/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 13:46:16"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(7) "NeoGrec"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(1741)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

I’m hoping to refinance and Adam Dahill, a mortgage broker who often posts here, mentioned recently that some banks have an iron-clad rule insisting on no fixed window bars. Sounds like the situation you’re facing. Some people don’t want to get rid of their bars for security reasons; some can’t because of LPC regulations. Maybe you need a new bank?

BedstuyMaven | 13 years and 8 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4937 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4931 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "35721"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(12) "BedstuyMaven"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(12) "bedstuymaven"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "BedstuyMaven@gmail.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(54) "http://bstoner.wpengine.com/forums/users/bedstuymaven/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 13:49:21"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(12) "BedstuyMaven"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(35721)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

I had the same problem a few years ago.  I explained to the bank that this was a standard in NYC  and  I got a letter from the Fire Department stating the bars were ok because I had two other means of egress.

vthatcher | 13 years and 8 months ago

string(1) "1"
object(WP_User)#4932 (8) {
  ["data"]=>
  object(stdClass)#4930 (12) {
    ["ID"]=>
    string(5) "72227"
    ["user_login"]=>
    string(9) "vthatcher"
    ["user_pass"]=>
    string(34) "$P$BX2HK6HferKXkKK.a693/AIaQvqYe.0"
    ["user_nicename"]=>
    string(9) "vthatcher"
    ["user_email"]=>
    string(22) "vthatcher@athccorp.com"
    ["user_url"]=>
    string(25) "/forums/users/vditty1979/"
    ["user_registered"]=>
    string(19) "2017-08-10 14:30:00"
    ["user_activation_key"]=>
    string(0) ""
    ["user_status"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["display_name"]=>
    string(9) "vthatcher"
    ["spam"]=>
    string(1) "0"
    ["deleted"]=>
    string(1) "0"
  }
  ["ID"]=>
  int(72227)
  ["caps"]=>
  array(2) {
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["cap_key"]=>
  string(15) "wp_capabilities"
  ["roles"]=>
  array(2) {
    [0]=>
    string(10) "subscriber"
    [1]=>
    string(15) "bbp_participant"
  }
  ["allcaps"]=>
  array(4) {
    ["read"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["level_0"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["subscriber"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["bbp_participant"]=>
    bool(true)
  }
  ["filter"]=>
  NULL
  ["site_id":"WP_User":private]=>
  int(1)
}

I am a mortgage broker.  From a banks point of view, you cannot have bars on bedrooms/sleeping areas.  You can leave bars on living rooms/kitchen where there is egress, or an exit to the outside. Let say you had bars on a bedroom and people were sleeping.  Firs is outside the bedroom door.  Without a safety release latch on at least 1 window in that room- you cannot get out.  This is the reason for the release latch.  You only need 1 window per bedroom to have it.     Vanessa Thatcher _ATLANTIC HOME CAPITAL_ Tel: 631-687-3510 x106 EFax: 631-918-5222 Cell: 631-672-4113