lender demanding deck match CofO

Recently purchased a brownstone. When lender attorney reviewed file, they complained that the deck doesn’t match the CofO. As a condition of closing, we were required to put money in escrow, and they want the issue “resolved” within 6 months (with option to extend). What are the possible outcomes of calling Dept of Buildings to have them inspect this deck? My fear is inspectors come to review the deck and find some other issues while they’re walking around opening a can of worms, causing financial headache for ensuing months. The former owner says deck was there in the 70’s when they bought it. I would believe it, it is a very solid metal 2nd story deck attached to that unit by a full standing door. It looks industrial in construction. Though the deck has a bit of rust, it is otherwise in good condition. Any thoughts? -Sean

hullsean

in Building Code 11 years and 7 months ago

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arch007 | 11 years and 7 months ago

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What needs to be done: 1) hire an architect or engineer 2) plans are filed 3) plans get approved by DOB 4) hire a contractor to take ownership of the completed work (and new work?) 5) the permit is obtained (by the architect thru the HUB system) 6) any modifications to the deck needed to match the plans are performed 7) DOB is called to inspect 8) close-out paperwork is filed and the job appears as “Signed-off” in the DOB system. DOB may want a new land survey to verify the dimensions of the deck. This would be determined in the plan exam.

hullsean | 11 years and 7 months ago

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arch007, yes I’m the buyer. That Deck Legalization doc is helpful. It appears all of those requirements are satisfied. If that’s correct, can one file a request with DOB for inspection?

arch007 | 11 years and 7 months ago

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sorry, i see you are the buyer, yes the lender wants the property clean. they are getting very picky now. Someone needs to legalize the structure, sounds like it’s too late for the seller to do it.

arch007 | 11 years and 7 months ago

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If you can get away with just giving up $1,500 that would be the easy way out. However, it sounds like the buyer’s are holding you responsible to legalize the deck. Plans must be filed and an inspection done by DOB (or an architect if Professionally Certified). Some modifications may need to be made to the deck (or balcony) please see this link for more deck legalization info http://nyc-dob.com/NYC%20Deck%20Legalization.html

dazednconfused2 | 11 years and 7 months ago

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There are a few finer points in the zoning code, but basically a deck is at the first floor above a basement. A balcony is above that. Both are limited in size when projecting into the required 30′ rear yard, the limitations on the balcony being more restrictive.

housepoor | 11 years and 7 months ago

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Out of curiosity, what differentiates a deck from a balcony? How do the DOB requirements differ from each other? Is there an advantage for one versus the other? Thanks.

daveinbedstuy | 11 years and 7 months ago

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So what are they saying they will do if you don’t resolve it? I doubt they will call in the mortgage. If it’s just that they take the $1,500 then that’s a small price to pay. Using an expeditor will cost more.

dazednconfused2 | 11 years and 7 months ago

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In terms of code implications, I mean the size of the deck/balcony. There are restrictions as to how big it can be, and how far it projects into the rear yard. Does the second story deck have stairs down to the rear yard? That’s not allowed. I’m really not trying to scare you or drum up business, but this sounds like the kind of thing you should have an architect, engineer, or code-knowledgeable expediter take a look at. Often times it’s hard to think of all of the possible issues without seeing the conditions. I’d hate to give you a checklist of things to look for, and have you determine everything is ok, only to find out later that it’s not because I didn’t think to ask about one more potential issue. You might try giving Scott Schnall a call. He’s an engineer and expediter, and very knowledgeable of the code.

hullsean | 11 years and 7 months ago

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I’m new to a lot of this, so I’m not positive, no. That said… 1\. Yes it was the land survey which tipped off the lender attorney to the presence of the deck. 2\. Yes we put some money in escrow to resolve it for the time being ($1500). Closing did proceed last week. Happy to say! 3\. I understand we have 6 months to resolve, but could get an extension. 4\. I don’t know that any CofO mentions a deck either. Could be the lender is speaking beyond their expertise here. Who knows. 5\. The former owner indicates that the deck was there in the 70’s when they bought. Looking at the deck it looks pretty old so that makes sense. So those are the 5 facts i have. Wondering how to proceed prudently. Jim to your point, what do you mean by “pursuing code implications”? I’d definitely like to avoid getting DOB involved. Thx all for comments!

BobMarvin | 11 years and 7 months ago

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But, how could a recent survey not show a deck that had existed since the ’70s?

adam_dahill | 11 years and 7 months ago

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Are you positive that they are discussing the C of O and not the survey? On purchases lenders require a survey and that will usually show the presence of a deck. You are very lucky that they will let you close with money in escrow. Many lenders won’t allow that these days. -Adam Dahill Mortgage Master adahill@mortgagemaster.com http://www.mortgagemaster.com/adahill/

dazednconfused2 | 11 years and 7 months ago

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DIBS – You’re correct. A C of O does not generally indicate the presence of a deck. I just checked two jobs where we added a floor with a balcony, and a deck at the first floor. Neither balcony nor deck are listed on the brand new C of O. That being said, decks are limited to the first story above grade, so do be careful. It may qualify for a balcony. I would suggest pursuing the code implications of deck or no deck pertaining to the sale before getting the DOB involved. I’ve never heard of them coming out for an inspection not related to a complaint or a job application. Don’t even know if they would. You could call and anonymously file a complaint against yourself if that’s the only way to get them to come, but that just sounds like asking for trouble.

daveinbedstuy | 11 years and 7 months ago

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I never knew that a C of O would contain info on a deck structure. How much did you have to put in escrow and what can they do if it is not resolved, other than take the escrow money? If it’s only $5,000 or so, it won’t be worth your trouble to resolve it. MORE IMPORTANTLY what does your attorney have to say about this? It sounds like the closing will still proceed.