"Unexpected work" during a waterproofing project
I am getting my house waterproofed and the contractors working on my place now tell me that the wood behind my house is rotten and needs to be replaced. They are telling me that this was not accounted for. Is this something that should have already been included in their original estimates? They are telling me this is something they could not foresee, however, I am waterfproofing due to water damage and mold in my basement. Part II: They want to remove the vinyl siding about 3 feet higher than expected and they want to remove ALL of the rotten wood underneath. Apparently, they tell me there used to be a termite issue with the house in addition to the large amounts of water that was coming in. They want to replace the rotten wood with new wood and then put the vinyl siding back. In addition, they want to finish the bottom portion with either cement or bricks. Has anyone done this before? What should something like this cost? I feel like we are paying them a lot of money and this came up out of no where and I don’t want to be taken advantage of. I want to know if this a normal/suggested thing to do and I would like to know approximately how much something like this goes for. I have a two-family, frame townhouse in south slope/gowanus. Any piece of advice helps. Thanks b’stoner friends.
gowanawana
in Brownstoner 13 years and 6 months ago
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10 replies
Bond | 13 years and 6 months ago
Water will wick up a masonry wall. You mention that contractor is thinking of using brick, which wicks more than concrete or block. That’s why in so many older brick homes, you see a think course of slate between the bricks every five feet or so, it’s a water barrier specifically to stop wicking. A waterproof barrier on top of the foundation wall is easy to do, it’s effective and cheap. The contractor may try to talk you out of it saying since the exterior is being sealed, it’s redundant, but what happens if the brick spalls, the foundation cracks, etc? More importantly though, I could be wrong, but looking at the latest picture you posted, it looks like the water isn’t wicking up, but dripping down, which means that even with fixing the foundation, you will still have water/rot issues.
guikazoid | 13 years and 6 months ago
additional images of the backwall fully exposed: http://imgur.com/a/oo2O7
rh | 13 years and 6 months ago
What everyone else said. But listen, I just wanna say that you should get down on your knees and thank your maker for a contractor that brought this to your attention instead of covering it up just to finish the job quickly. Definitely should have given you warning, but it would be extra charge anyway. So no, he’s not ripping you off. All of the underlying stuff is so much more important than your finished surfaces. Word.
daveinbedstuy | 13 years and 6 months ago
If there’s a cement or stone foundation, as long as the sill plate remains above ground level AND the level where water accumulates, it won’t rot in the future. The sill has to be bolted to the foundation wall. It better be pressure treated as well. make sure of this. If the walls have rotted due to water infiltration, you will also need to replace the insulation between the studs. And make sure they add a new Tyvek barrier to the new exterior before the siding.
Bond | 13 years and 6 months ago
It’s hard to see from the picture exactly what’s going on, but it looks like your biggest problem is water. The plywood is going to be rot, too much glue in it for termites. My big concern is that as both Goat and Dave pointed out, the contractor didn’t give you a heads up that at the very least, the sill plate was very probably going to be rotted and would need to be replaced. Either he or she didn’t think of it, or they thought of it, but decided to soak you down the road. Neither option says much about their professionalism. This worries me, because if they don’t now enough to predict this, are they going to know enough to make sure it doesn’t happen again? I would question them with regards to how they are going to prevent future water wicking up the foundation into the framed part of the wall. At the very least they need to put a water proof barrier between the foundation and the sill, preferably (In my mind) aluminum flashing with a foam insulation barrier on top to keep drafts out. Building a wall of masonry three feet high isn’t going to be enough. Water will eventually reach the wood. How are they going to tie the sill plate (the long horizontal piece of wood on the bottom of the wall that the studs tie into) into the new masonry foundation? I’d get a written record of the remediation planned,with specifics, work planned, and materials to be used. Don’t let them get away with generics like “replace sill”. Insist on details and if they balk, I would throw it in their face (in a nice way of course) that you already had one nasty surprise that should have been anticipated, you don’t want another. Sometimes just having to commit to paper is enough to make people hesitate about cutting corners.
daveinbedstuy | 13 years and 6 months ago
What goatcrapp said. Contractor should have warned you that it might be an issue but whenever there’s a water issue there’s most likely going to be rot.
Goatcrapp | 13 years and 6 months ago
having a clearer picture of whats going on – I will also say that it shouldn’t be that difficult… most of the work is done getting to it anyways… and the materials are dirt cheap in the grand scheme of this project.. so if you’re paying an extra arm (assuming its costing 1 arm and a leg so far) – then it shouldn’t.
guikazoid | 13 years and 6 months ago
the link wasnt properly set, here it goes: http://imgur.com/a/bNTcF
gowanawana | 13 years and 6 months ago
The wood is more rotten than the cheese you find in the back of your fridge when you realize its been years since you’ve last cleaned it. The wood is literally falling apart and turns to dust when you touch it. Here is a pic of it http://imgur.com/a/bNTcF Also, we see evidence of termites although the damage looks years old, not new (per contractors). So termite damage + massive water = no bueno 🙁 Thanks for the post. It helped.
Goatcrapp | 13 years and 6 months ago
Its hard to anticipate whats behind cover.. ie: siding, under roofing tiles, etc…therefore its hard to give a cost estimate based on unknown damage. Go look at the wood yourself – does it look rotten? If so, then the work needs doing anyway. You’re miffed because it’s unexpected, but its not like you’re at a mechanic, where they can find things wrong that you have no way of inspecting for yourself (except i usually will – but i built engines in a oprevious life – just don’t have the time anymore lol) With that said – I always ask for a what-if estimate from any contractors i deal with. ie: here’s the job requirements… thanks for the estimate. Now – what other things MIGHT have to be considered? possible rotten wood? Provide me worst case scenario estimate on that. Crumbling brick or foundation? same thing – worst case estimate. Roofing joists rotted? estimate. What i’m trying to say is that – they as the experts should have anticipated the possibility of such rot, and provided a best and worst case estimate as part of their quote… but most dojn’t unless asked… as it’s also very hard to do that accurately, especially if there’s no way to inspect the area until the work has already begun, and you’ve torn into things.