Another Church on Fulton (As If It Needs One)
Fulton Street already has its fair share of churches, though many of them are of the storefront variety. Now just feet from one of the highest traffic prostitution corners in Brownstone Brooklyn, the Universal Church is erecting this large new home. (Check out the excavation underway on the jump.) Frankly, we can’t see why the…
Fulton Street already has its fair share of churches, though many of them are of the storefront variety. Now just feet from one of the highest traffic prostitution corners in Brownstone Brooklyn, the Universal Church is erecting this large new home. (Check out the excavation underway on the jump.) Frankly, we can’t see why the area needs a new church when beautiful old churches like St. Bartholomew are having such a difficult time remaining solvent. GMAP
You raise very good points “Black, Educated, Clinton Hill Resident.” I do not assert that the church is the savior of the black community. I couldn’t agree more about the state of crisis with respect to the black family and the fact that the black church has been under-concerned and under-involved. I am by no means a bible thumper or naive enough to think that simply praying to Jesus (or any other diety) will solve very deep and complex problems on a personal or societal level.
My point was less about defending the church as an institution and more about defending the rights of the residents of our (still primarily black) community to express themselves and worship in a way THEY see fit, in THEIR neighborhoods whether or not these Becky/Bob-come-latelies perceive the building as architecturally acceptable by their standards. (Mind you, this is the same board whose posters complain about tearing down a dilapidated brownstone that could have been potentially sold for 1mil+ to some pseudo-wealthy individual in order to provide affordable, mid-income housing for many).
Whether or not any of us personally agree with how others choose to worship or obtain the inspiration/ support they need to survive is immaterial. However, what we can not deny is that the church has historically, and continues to have, major significance in the black community. It irks me to hear such shallow dialogue about how churches happen to inconvenience new comers because of the noise and parking issues. Go somewhere else then dammit!…Save up and move to Park Slope, or better yet Manhattan. What about the lives churches save by offering a sense of hope, purpose, and recovery to those who attend? What about the political empowerment they have afforded by being a voice of the black community? Yes, there is hypocrisy and MUCH opportunity to improve, but it’s the closest thing to a collective voice and community of support that we’ve got!
In sum, I’m not making an all-good or all-bad argument, but to have no appreciation for the significance the church has to your neighbors and to trivialize their desire and right to build houses of worship that suit their needs is just plain ignorant. If you choose to call my expression “playing the race card,†so be it and I feel for you. If we are to co-exist in this wonderful community of Fort Greene/Clinton Hill/BedStuy, we need to respect each other and not turn our noses up at each other’s values and cultural practices because they are “inconvenient”.
Dear Race Card Sister Shawna,
Be serious. BECR is completely right. These churches are doing next to nothing to influence the neighborhood in a positive way, so why should we want them to build enormous temples to failure in OUR neighborhood. I have my own issues with the local churches. I have actually been heckled by crowds of people milling outside of more than one local church. Once for being white, once for being gay, another time for “standing in the wrong place.” These were church-going people, dressed to please the preacher, and dropping a “bless God” left and right. So, Race Card Sister Shawna, be serious.
If the Church is such a pillar in the black community why is it that: (1) double parent households comprise a meager 25% of all black households; (2) there are more black men between the ages of 18 and 22 in jail then in college; (3) 1 out of 4 black men between the age of 18 and 35 is confined to the penal system, whether they’re incarcerated, waiting trail, on probation or on parole; (4) 75% of all black children are born to unwed mothers; (5) the unemployment rate for black males in NYC is 60%; (6) only 40% of all black high school students graduate on time; (7) blacks make up only 10% of the US pop. size yet comprise 38% of the US. jail pop….etc…?
Don’t pull the race card, sister. Everyone in the black community knows that the church has failed OUR community! Black self-love starts with objective self-analysis and critic. Yes, the church was indeed the pillar of the black community but that was like 50 years ago. Back then 83% of all black households were comprised of duel parent families.
How can you assert the significant influence of the church in the black community but lay witness to the complete destruction of the black family nucleus in 50 fifty years? When did the church stop promoting the institution of marriage in the black community? We went from 83% to 25% double parent households in fifty years and yet we wonder why black people lag behind in almost everyone single socio-economic indicator. How the heck did this happen and what the heck our WE going to do about it? Obviously, going to Church and romanticizing the past is not the solution.
Sincerely,
Black, Educated, Clinton Hill Resident
I have been a silent reader of Brownstoner for several months and the nonsense contained in this post (and some of the replies) compels me to respond. The tone of racism, arrogance, and snobbery underlying these comments is truly disturbing! One post mentioned that the owners of many of the buildings are “old, ETHNIC, men”… what exactly does that mean? So what there is another church going up on Fulton that doesn’t meet your bland Eurocentric tastes and sensibilities??? Such churches, (even if they are of the storefront variety) reflect the culture and beliefs of many of the current residents (much to the dismay of gentrifiers like yourselves). The Church is the cornerstone of the Black Community (where you happen to reside). If you don’t like it, move your asses to Bayridge. I don’t have the time, patience, or energy to respond with the full level of insight and intensity that these silly comments deserve. Your ignorance appalls me.
Sincerely,
A highly-educated, church-going, African-American Clinton Hill resident with a good job (I throw that in there because one poster mentioned that primarily low SES people go to church)
Babs:
I think once you begin to conflate support or opposition to Ratnerville with a discussion or whether or not religion is an opiate of the masses you are bound to insult people. While I may not agree with them, many ministers and other community leaders made the decision that Atlantic Yards was happening and decided to get their piece of the pie for their organizations and congregants. (I can’t imagine you actually think Rev Daughtry accepted money for himself personally). The disrespect you so easily share about churches and their leaders isn’t likely to win you many supporters in the fight your evidently hold most dear. For you to suggest that a class action lawsuit will somehow be more effective than the sense of community, faith, and purpose that was born out of and continues to be born out of religious communities is remarkable sterile and narrow. In that context your list of acceptable churches feels as cynical as the list which Ratner composed. Your continued insistence that you are concerned for lower-economic people who spend too much time in church rather than working for real change in the world makes me wonder how you feel about upper economic people who worry about how many zones of a/c or the right solid surface countertop to put in their homes. Reading the New York Times on Sunday at Chez Oscar or Tillies isn’t quite manning the barricades either.
Lynn, and others, I’m not talking about people who attend “established” churches, usually one morning a weekend and perhaps once at night during the week. I’m talking about people who attend (primarily) storefront churches, where the sermons go on all day (and sometimes lat into the night), and who are told to respond to every problem and attack on their rights with a prayer to Jesus.
I’m not talking about making donations to a church, I’m talking about required contributions in order to remain active in the church, regardless of one’s financial circumstances.
I’m talking about people who get on the 2 train in the morning or at night and preach about Jesus all the way to or from Atlantic Avenue and how he will solve all the injustice in the world, when maybe some concrete action, like a class action lawsuit (or the threat thereof), would be more effective.
I have nothing against churches in general, or prayer, I just think that too often religion is used as a means of keeping people down and that some churches, even those headed by once-militant activists, like the Reverend Hubert Daughtry and his House of the Lord Pentecostal Church, are corrupt and have sold out their congregations in exchange for money (Rev Daughtry accepted $50,000 from FCR to sign the CBA on the Atlantic Yards).
Other churches have voiced their opposition to the project, including:
Church of the Open Door (Rev. Mark V.C. Taylor)
Brooklyn Christian Center (Rev. Dennis Dillon)
Brown Memorial Baptist Church (Rev. Clinton Miller)
Emmanuel Baptist Church (Rev. Anthony L. Trufant)
Hanson Place Central United Methodist Church (Rev. Patrick Perrin)
Lafayette Avenue Presbyterian Church (Rev. David Dyson)
Old First Reformed Church (Rev Daniel Meeter)
so my comment was not meant to imply that all churches are bad, or that all people who spend time in church are misguided, or anything like that, merely that I find it extremely frustrating when I see neighbors and acquaintances of mine struggling with the day-to-day issues of social injustice that many people face in corporate America and the only advice they get from their family and friends is to pray, when I know that no “better off” people would stand for such treatment. I didn’t say that ONLY people of lower socio-economic groups attend church, but that they seem to spend more time in churches than people of higher socio-economic levels.
So I think you missed my point, and I’m sorry if I offended you. Religion can be a great source of support for many people; I’m just concerned that at times it’s used to prevent people from taking the steps they should to defend their constitutional rights.
babs,
did you conduct a formal study of who spends time in church and why? also did your survey include a tally of which churches “support” Ratner? Maybe you NEED to go to church – you certainly need prayer.
i’m not a member of the lowest socio-economic group by a long shot. I live in clinton hill. I attend a large church in the area. Members socio-economic status ranges. I’m a real estate agent who DOES NOT support the Ratner project and I attend church as often as I can, by scheduling my appts around it. i guess all that PRAYER works. I actually am having a fabulous year. i’ve been known to do nutty things like donate $$ to the church, it’s always nice to have the electricity and heat on when i sit down to Sunday service. These “Donations” cover the basics of operating a bldg, paying staff, phones, etc.,as well as the many outreach programs for people of all ages.
here’s some USEFUL information:
Dear Fellow New Yorker,
Before the end of November, New York State’s Public Authorities Control Board (PACB) is expected to be asked to give final approval to the proposed â€Atlantic Yards†Nets arena and high-rise project.
However, on October 26th, a number of homeowners, tenants and business owners in the footprint of the proposed “Atlantic Yards†project filed a federal lawsuit challenging the use of eminent domain to evict them from their properties.
I’ve just sent a letter to New York State’s Public Authorities Control Board, asking them to postpone any vote on the fate of the proposed “Atlantic Yards†project until the State’s courts have ruled on the project’s use of eminent domain.
It took me just a minute to send the letter using Develop Don’t Destroy Brooklyn’s handy letter-writing mechanism — one minute that could go a long way to stopping or significantly altering Forest City Ratner’s plan to build a massive arena and high-rise complex smack in the middle of historic brownstone neighborhoods.
If built as proposed, the “Atlantic Yards†would:
–be the biggest private development in Brooklyn’s history
–cost taxpayers at least $1.6 billion
–misuse eminent domain to seize the private property of homeowners and businesses
–irrevocably alter the low-rise character of Prospect Heights, Fort Greene, Clinton Hill and Park Slope
–create a nightmare of traffic, noise, pollution and other negative environmental effects.
Won’t you please take ONE MINUTE and join me in sending a letter? Visit http://dddb.net/php/PACBLetter.php
And please pass this email on; it’s critical that the PACB hear from as many of us as possible by November 15th, because they may be asked to vote before the end of the month.
Thanks for helping to make a difference!
Visit http://dddb.net/php/PACBLetter.php
Many churches do hve development corporations which build housing. I believe that the Nehemiah housing boom was religiously based. Not sure how to respond to all the church-haters posting above. Myself, I attend a left-wing church in the East Village (Middle Collegiate), altho I know others who have found Lafayette Avenue Presbeterian to be nice. Actually when people ask me why I attend I say that I think it is important that my son grow up hearing people talk about things other than movies, pop stars, and, er, real estate.