StreetLevel: Papa John's Takes a Slice of Sunset Park
Let the Sunset Park pie wars begin. This Friday, a Papa John’s franchise will open on 5th Avenue between 58th and 59th streets, right next door to neighborhood fixture Johnny’s Pizza and within a few blocks of two other mom-and-pop pizza joints. The Times chronicled community backlash to the new business in an August article;…
Let the Sunset Park pie wars begin. This Friday, a Papa John’s franchise will open on 5th Avenue between 58th and 59th streets, right next door to neighborhood fixture Johnny’s Pizza and within a few blocks of two other mom-and-pop pizza joints. The Times chronicled community backlash to the new business in an August article; as of then, 2,200 people had signed a petition that sought to stop the Papa John’s from opening. One of the Papa John’s opponents went so far as to say that the chain eatery had planted itself right in the face of everything that is Sunset Park. There goes the neighborhood? GMAP
i think what papa john did is wrong.rigth next door? i wonder why not next door to domino?
and to the person who made a comment about price fixing you missed the point (when pizza prices go up … they go up everywhere)
The anti papa johns is due to the fact that they opened RIGHT NEXT DOOR.
Papa John’s will charge like 7.99 for a large pizza.
Mom and Pops more like 15 bucks for a large.
Sure it tastes better than Propa John’s, but this area of town has young people who will recognize the Papa name and order it for delivery because its cheap.
To 3:17 and others: the downside to increased numbers of customers with more money to spend in these improving neighborhoods, will be the arrival of new competition. Face that fact and get over it. The old timer businesses can either whine about it, or adjust their business to the new arrivals and become even more successful. They can choose to see the changes in the neighborhood as an opportunity. At least the smart ones can. I’ve seen a lot of longtime businesses do this. Expand their seating area, expand their menu. To their great benefit.
Sadly though, we see a lot of entitled whining in NYC. Way more than I’ve ever seen in any other city I’ve lived in.
3:17, So immigrants can only compete with other immigrants, but not “longtime members of the community”? Sounds like you’re the big jerk.
Capitalism is about competition, period. And if you don’t effectively compete, yes… you go out of business, regardless of how long you’ve been in a community.
sure 3:04 pm and to add to that just because someone mighht be an immigrant to this country trying to make it, doesn’t also mean they aren’t a big jerk trying to put a longtime member of the community out of business.
@:34 I must disagree I find it is ‘newcomers’ who tend to be more upset about the opening of national retail stores – but either way
1st as previously stated this is most likely a franchise (5x more francise stores then co owned) – so in reality this is “mom & pop”, and as a franchisee likely has less ability to cut prices than the non-chain because franchisees must buy from ‘preferred suppliers’ that are mandated by the parent co. Additionally there are all sorts of fees, promotions and costs that dont effect a non-chain pizzeria.
Next the franchisee has the same costs that any non-chain has – labor, fuel, rent etc… and the franchisee doesnt have any deeper pockets (often shallower) to sustain losses then anyone else.
Finally the most important part is that (thankfully) an item like Pizza isn’t purely a commodity product (i.e. price is only one factor in buying decision). And besides the fact that Papa Johns stinks, the non-chain can compete on taste, service, decor and by being able to adjust his product mix and introduce new products in a much faster and ‘localized’ way then any franchise or chain ever could.
The reason why people know this is no big deal is b/c NYC Pizza is amazing and even if Papa John offered better prices, they just can’t compete on taste.
The perfect example of this is Lassen & Hennings on Montague St. They have withstood Burger King, Blimpies, Subway and I am sure more to come. Why? Because rather then competing on price they compete with taste service and selection – and they keep winning.
10pm is right, this is a franchise and as a franchise it IS owned by a mom and pop. It’s probably someone newly emigrated from another country who didn’t know better. Certain immigrant groups love the big chain franchises because it seems like a sure success. But chains are not successful in every neighborhood. They didn’t do the research and they didn’t ask successful business people nearby for their opinions on the idea. Both huge mistakes, because a boycott even a small one, can be enough to put a new place under.
The only people who think it isn’t a big deal about Papa John’s moving in are people who have no concept of how chain stores like this one chip away at a neighborhood’s identity. Why do you think more than 2,200 members of the community signed the petition? It used to be that you’d never see a chain store in Brooklyn– now they are everywhere. And the only people who don’t care are the people who grew up elsewhere– places where strip malls and IHOPS were the norm, not mom and pop businesses. Johnny’s is on my corner, and I definitely don’t want a Papa John’s there.