303 Park Pl: If You Don't Like Old Houses, Don't Buy One!
You’d think that people who have no appreciation for older architecture could find a house that’s already missing its original details when it comes time for them to buy something. Instead, some people (like the new owners of 303 Park Place) buy a gorgeous historic home and proceed to strip it to the bone. Here’s…
You’d think that people who have no appreciation for older architecture could find a house that’s already missing its original details when it comes time for them to buy something. Instead, some people (like the new owners of 303 Park Place) buy a gorgeous historic home and proceed to strip it to the bone. Here’s what the Craigslist ad (which expired over the weekend) said:
Due to remodeling of a 100-year old Prospect Heights 1-family brownstone, we are offering selected antique Victorian architectural items. This is a one-time chance to improve your home with gorgeous authentic details that are seldom on the market. Items include Victorian oak fireplace mantels, redwood staircase complete with 3 stair runs, curving railings, balusters, Tiffany-style stained glass window panels, Victorian solid gingerbread entrance doors, antique tin ceiling tiles, ornate glass ceiling chandeliers, hinges and doorknobs and more.
Can any neighbors let us know what the couple plans to do with this place? Ugh.
House of the Day: 303 Park Place [Brownstoner] GMAP P*Shark
Victorian Antique Architectural Items [Craigslist]
10:16 – Your comments sound snobby and more than a bit fascistic. And I love old buildings. Lighten up. IT’S NOT YOUR HOUSE.
To the architect @ 12:34:
you write “The Owner bought it, dripping with detail. The house needed much repair structurally after many years of neglect. We sripped it of everything…brought it down to its skeleton.”
If you did indeed strip all the original dripping detail you describe, that is ridiculous. Maybe you’re just unclearly describing the process, but restoration is one thing, stripping and recreating from new is another. Restoration is much harder and costlier, and is what these old houses “dripping in detail” deserve. Not some uber-rich UWS trophy house makeover that has zero respect for history.
I have a feeling some of the anti-Brownstoner posts are just multiple postings by the same person. You can look at the first few and see they are posted sometimes a minute apart.
It’s lame to see someone do this kind of thing to try to lend credence to an argument, which they themselves know is hard to defend and very unpopular.
It’s pretty simple: If you are buying a house of this age, it’s your responsibility to fix it up, or if you can’t or don’t want to, buy somewhere else. Period. Owning a historically valuable house like this comes with responsibilities and it’s a crime to see some yahoos or nouveau-rich people with poor taste come in an irrepairably damage a house by tearing all this stuff out and “modernizing” it. If you have the millions to dump on a house, buy a modern apartment or house in the suburbs.
What these new owners are doing is just so sad, and Mr. Brownstoner has every right to call them out on it.
Why the heck buy this house in the first place? Their so-called “renovation” is completely non-sensical. Why not buy a shell?
This shows that they are, at a minimum, poor business-people.
Although in my humble opinion they are, more directly, ignorant fools.
I am the owner of 303 Park Place. I am also a long time reader of this blog and I love it (btw thanks for this title, Jon). I have to say, I am not offended by this discussion, on the contrary, I find it kind of constructive, with a good balance of both sides (learned that this is Edwardian, not Victorian). I love Brooklyn and its historic neighborhoods (been living in the Slope for a long time) and can’t wait for PH to be added to it – “[PH] is at the top of the list of [potential historic] districts that we’re looking at.â€â€” Mary Beth Betts, New York City Landmarks Preservation Commission
http://bstoner.wpengine.com/brownstoner/archives/2007/09/lpc_prospect_he.php
Let me give you my side of the story, if I may (it’s a blog, after all). First of all, I mentioned in the posting (that’s only up for 7 days) that there are only selected items for sale. The house has indeed a lot of details, but not all are as well preserved as the pics show. We’re going to work items into the design and keep other items in storage (or sell them, if we find a home, no salvaging co’s). Second, the current layout is very constricted and creates a lot of dark spaces, narrow hallways and corners, not very pleasant, esp. on the garden floor. Third, since the house is 100 year old, the electricity and plumbing need serious overhaul, so a TLC is at order.
There are some great details on the parlor floor, which we’ll carefully remove by a wood craftsman and preserve – those will be brought back into the renovation. What we’ll do is to bring in some contemporary elements along with some Asian influence into this classic Victorian (Edwardian) setting. It’s going to be a very interesting space and we hired a great architect who’s able to do this for us. Actually, the previous owner inspired us by this NY Times article
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/07/12/garden/12mesh.html
The entire project will prob. take the most part of next year. It’s a beautiful house and a great hood and we’ll turn this into something even more incredible that it is now. Some items will have to go, others will merge into something new, and others will contrast with the contemporary. The end result will hopefully be a preservation of the old (incl the facade and gaslight) but with a nice influence of contemporary elements.
I guess if you don’t realize why people are upset you are right and you don’t have much in common with readers of this blog.
I am a big fan of this site but this post crosses a line for me.
We’ve no idea why these owners are selling these things, and I find it rude and intrusive to include their address with this post. Why should anyone care so much? It doesn’t matter to me whether these folks posted their address on Craigslist, or that these items are rare. It’s really none of our business, and Brownstoner is jumping to several conclusions here.
Or maybe the larger issue for me is, after having recently settled my own real estate issues for the foreseeable future, that I am realizing that I don’t have much else in common with the core readers of this blog.
I am an architect working on a townhouse on the upper West Side, 5-story. The Owner bought it, dripping with detail. The house needed much repair structurally after many years of neglect. We sripped it of everything…brought it down to its skeleton. Did repairs to the sturcture, adding an elevator, new stairs, brought it into the 21st century with new plumbing, elec. wiring, etc. and are now recreating all the details of the ‘old world charm’ that you all talk about. We are creating a classical home that looks better than it could have been restored with all the modern amenities.
Not everybody stripped these homes to create modern bare spaces…some strip them to to update and recreate it…which costs a heck of alot more.
I am an architect working on a townhouse on the upper West Side, 5-story. The Owner bought it, dripping with detail. The house needed much repair structurally after many years of neglect. We sripped it of everything…brought it down to its skeleton. Did repairs to the sturcture, adding an elevator, new stairs, brought it into the 21st century with new plumbing, elec. wiring, etc. and are now recreating all the details of the ‘old world charm’ that you all talk about. We are creating a classical home that looks better than it could have been restored with all the modern amenities.
Not everybody stripped these homes to create modern bare spaces…some strip them to to update and recreate it…which costs a heck of alot more.