Rats again

We got Department of health summons for rat infestation.
The rats issue is going on in spite of all our measures:
We put rat poison, we use bleach to deter rats by bleach odor.
Last year we paved our front yard completely to eliminate rat holes.
We talked to tenants ( who compalined of rat problem) several times that they can not just dump trash bags as is in front yard.
We bought new stronger containers with attached lids, add additional enforcement, so lids will stay attached, assigned each 48 gallons container to one apartement.
Separate containers for recycling.

And we have an ongoing battle – we show up, clean rat feces, por bleach everywhere, bags is still out of containers very often, each family says – it is not theirs.
Maintenance company send us videos, why they did not put trash out: dark, rat is running in front yard, trash bags out of containers.
They made video and left insted of putting garbage out.
Maintenance company send cleaning crew next day during daylight, they bag trash in new bags and leave those bugs out of containers, collection is in a cuople of days – the cycle continues.
We definetely will replace maintanance company – what they do is encouraging rats, plain stupid.
We are going to replace our maintenance company, but we can not replace our tenants.
They are nice ppl, they pay rent in time.

Yard paved, holes closed, containers are plenty and have clickable strong lids.

What else could be done to resolve rat problem?

opoddubnaya.bootsoft

in General Discussion 11 months ago

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kiltsjeremy | 11 months ago

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Seems like everyone is saying it’s not their responsibility while they are not on camera. I have been solving problems like this by installing een.com cloud based cameras lately

cate | 11 months ago

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Re containers needed, our building has five people in it. We have one city-issued brown bin for compost (food only) and one 30-gallon garbage can for regular (non food) garbage. (The rest of our stuff is non food such as two cans for recycling.)

opoddubnaya.bootsoft | 11 months ago

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thank you!
I just asked for opinions on dealing with tenants and on the trash can sizes.
Camera is badly needed, I totally agree.
We will try to install one in a next couple of weeks.

Brownstone Home Inspection | 11 months ago

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Olga, i cannot tell you how to deal with tenants but most of the professional level tenants i meet and deal with always seem to be responsible and at least most of the time look at the bigger picture. the issue we really have on this street is the renters and owner.

i cannot tell you how many trash cans you need. we usually can get away with one with three of us here but as my son left for college, i noticed the trash dropped off a lot here (if you have teens or younger adults in the house, these people eat a lot more than the older folk and they contribute disproportionately to the waste).

as you think about more containers, consider installing a camera to see if anyone is putting trash in your containers at night. it happens. it happens a lot and if you have businesses near the property know that they have to pay for collection and which incentivizes them to dispose of trash illegally. i once caught a restaurant across from where i worked dumping their trash on our pile very late at night, when they closed. it took a camera. a camera will tell you a lot about what is going on there. Any time i worked in a building and we had problems where people were denying things, the as soon as the camera went in, we always got the answers and very often the very people who told you they were not doing something wrong would turn out to be the culprits.

opoddubnaya.bootsoft | 11 months ago

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Thank you for your responses.
I am trying to feel my way on how to deal with tenants.
We did so much talking to the point that they are annoyed by us.
Still, when we saw trash bags laying out of bins, with holes from rats and we asked tenants – universal response was – it is not ours.
When we called maintenance company, maintenance company sent us video from 2 days ago, when they came to put trash out for collection:
in addition of rat running in front of the front yard we saw trash containers, 2 out of 3 overflowing with bags, lids are open.
How would you deal with your tenants?
We sent them video, they seemed to be annoyed instead of admitting.

there should be a clean simple legal way of dealing with this issues with tenants short of hiring a lawyer.
They all pay in time, they all belong to this social strata of high paid professional knowing their rights, in general the first ticket is $300, we could pay that, but still we simply do not want to have this trash problem.
BTW, do you think 48 gallons container is enough for the household if collection is done twice a week? We are a family of 4 but we generate way less then 30 gallons container.
Do you think we underestimate the size and need to get bigger containers for each family?
We are kind of limited by the size of our front yard too.

Brownstone Home Inspection | 11 months ago

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I also heard that they city was trying to make a law that would require all trash be put out in containers with lids on them. but i think they said it would take a couple of years to get that off the ground.

Brownstone Home Inspection | 11 months ago

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Hi Olga,

we are going through this here again. i am not sure if your tenants are the problem or your neighbors as you do not say, but know this, if you and your tenants are not feeding the rats, it is the neighbors who are the problem. if they are living on your property, you are giving them shelter only, this is NOT the reason they are there. it is the FAULT of the people feeding the rats. Rats and people will NOT live in a place where they do not have access to food and water.

I fault the city here because they ticket property owners or they mark your property with a yellow square on an on line rat map but they will not go after the offenders. if the neighbors are feeding the rats, the neighbors have to get tickets and the entire block has to be marked in yellow on the map.

and by the way three years ago, i spent about 1k on rat poisons and killed a bunch of them but it got to the point that they knew what the poison was and would literally walk around it or move it out of their way. you are wasting your time and effort.

after speaking to my immediate neighbors about how they were contributing to the rat situation, I resorted to pouring ammonia in their unlidded containers or on their trash bags and some of them were happy with me doing that but what annoyed me was they still made no effort. when i tired of that, i began pouring gasoline into their unlidded trash can and I told them what i was doing and they did not like the flammable product and they began cooperating. when you deal with people who are only concerned with the space their own two feet occupy, this is what you have to resort to to force responsibility on them. It worked with my immediate neighbor.

some of you know that sometimes when i watch our city make more laws without solving any problems, i write the city council. i will see if i can write the council their useless “rat tzar” about this. it is my feeling that if your neighbors are feeding the rats, they should have gotten that ticket, not you. The entire block is guilty.

(one of my neighbors texted me the other day and told me she saw a rat in my yard. I reminded her that i put my trash out in covered bins with bricks on the lids. she said “the people next to” her put it out in bags and she sees holes chewed in the bags. I asked here “why are you telling me? Go to them” and told her “i no longer want to hear about this and i am sick of dealing with it”: Olga, if they see you as responsible and see you taking action, they will continue to watch you struggle with this situation. it is like everything else in society, until you find a way to push the problem where it belongs, you will suffer the problem.

you can call me if you wish and i will tell you what i want to say to the city. email me first if you wish to talk. i can easily contact the chief of staff at my city council person’s office and he will email me back. i am willing to head something up here if people are behind me. I also personally know a community board member where i live and he will kick this around with me if i approach him.

brownstonehomeinspection.com.

cate | 11 months ago

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Hi Sounds like you are doing all the right things. You can definitely add a rider to the lease saying those things as long as the tenants sign it and it is enforced going forward. Keeping all the food trash in cans with lids at all times, even when put out on the street for collection, is key. One thing you cannot control: If there is dog waste, food trash on the streets, and areas for nesting elsewhere on the block, you will probably still see rats running around, but at least the problem will not be on your property. Good luck!

opoddubnaya.bootsoft | 11 months ago

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Also,
is it legal to add a rider to the lease that tenants have to keep their household trash in assigned container under the locked lid and are not allowed to leave bags of trash in a front yard out of the assigned container, or in assigned container if lid is not locked?

opoddubnaya.bootsoft | 11 months ago

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Sorry for typos and missing letters, can not find an edit mode that used to be there.