Kitchen design fees

What do you think of this: an individual we contacted to build some cabinets wants $1200 just to come out to the house to discuss the kitchen and draw up some plans. Non refundable if we do not hire him.

Some of the people we contacted charge anywhere from $500 to $1200 to make drawings or computer models, but they were willing to come out to the house and talk to us first, and if they did not get the job the fee would be at least partially refunded. We have even found a few who do it for free before signing a contract. (Ikea of course but not only Ikea).

Is asking for design fees upfront something new? The old way is that if someone wanted your business they would have the burden of proving to you that they were competent, would take measurements, give you an estimate, bring sample cabinet doors and show you lots of photos of their work or provide checkable references.

markwalker

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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If one person was charging just to visit, i would probably think that company was wrong and would ignore them. All of them?

I am wondering if these people use people to sell who are not company principals but whose only job is to sell and design and that is how they get paid, job or no job.

This industry has changed. Years ago guys like me went into this and made the boxes and doors. Small operations. Then other people moved in with more money to invest and from the get go they had better machinery to do things faster and “they” never ran a machine or got their hands dirty. It became about selling and production. Now the cabinets might come from someplace else (across the country) and the guy you meet knows nothing about hanging a cabinet and nothing about running a machine to make one and does not step inside a place where they are made. He makes money charging for customer visits.

Where are these cabinet people based? Where is the shop located? Are the manufacturer and the installer one and the same? Is the sales person an employee of one of those entities? A contractor (1099) for one of those entities? Or a fully self employed person who gets sent out on leads?

Its not a system i like either. I mean from the worker’s standpoint.

markwalker | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Charging for a design is more than fair. Asking someone to pay to look at a prospective job is super unusual.

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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So this is the way it is for these guys and it has been for some time: they charge for the design. That way if you find someone who can produce the cabinets for less money, you own the drawings and can go to them without any obligation to the person making the drawings. Its really nicer that way.

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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Good point, but until anything more than a nominal charge becomes common I think looking at a project might be considered a normal business expense, for which payment should be built into a person’s regular fees.

Master Plvmber | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Why wouldn’t a person want to get paid for leaving their home to come to yours and giving you their professional insight on something that you want? Crowd sourcing on the legitimacy of this becoming-common business practice is not an amazing idea since everyone thinks everyone is looking to rip everyone off, always.
Meanwhile, we’re all insisting we raise the standard waitstaff tip percentage to 25%-30% in restaurants. Our society has an odd way of valuing skills.

Guest User | 2 years and 3 months ago

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I have a good handyman who I like for cabinetry. Give me a call in afternoon if you want to discuss 646-326-8795
I’m swamped at work this morn

markwalker | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Thank you Jeremy. We have the design already. We need the carpenter, someone who won’t overload us with fees and extra costs and who will make what we want them to make, not what they will impose on us.

Guest User | 2 years and 3 months ago

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Jazzy (334) 538-0424 of the Jazzy Project has been great to work with and has been reasonably priced. This is a recent kitchen rendering she worked out for me in Manhattan. She has also worked in BK for us. Worth a call at least [A01493-1](//muut.com/u/brownstoner/s3/:brownstoner:bdFg:a014931.jpg.jpg)

justinromeu26 | 2 years and 3 months ago

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I have a good friend who has moved to a southern state. He used to do the design work for free and about 15 years ago he realized some people were taking the design work elsewhere to have the work done. This is for custom cabinet work. He began charging $300.

I know this up front fee looks wrong. I never charged for a quote myself but i am also very careful to talk at length on the phone with customers who want doors done to be sure they are realistic about cost. Because most people do doors 4 years after they buy a home and have had a lot of other stuff done, including cabinets, before they call me to do doors, they no longer suffer sticker shock. My easiest sale is someone who has renovated an entire house. Cabinet people probably have a lot of people call who have no idea what stuff costs and they themselves have not figured out how to broach the topic of money during the first call. So they may suffer more home visits selling jobs that don’t pan out.

putting a kitchen desigh together will take more time on site and more desk work and obviously these fo lks have to get paid for this. Here is where i see the problem: if they take 50% of the design charge to do the drawings, how do they get the other 50%? All is ok if the customer moves forward, they will get it. But a lot of customers do not move forward for very valid reasons and not only can contractors not chase people for $300 or $400 – they don’t have the time- it is wrong to chase people who don’t move forward because sometimes things go wrong in people’s lives and what contractor wants to bother someone confronting a job loss or family illness over $300? It is better up front.

this might sound wrong, but sometimes these people do charge high up front fees to scare off people who either don’t have deep enough pockets or don’t have long enough arms to reach into them. It works and i wonder if you are seeing some of that-

markwalker | 2 years and 3 months ago

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I agree, Cate and was surprised to be asked to pay for a visit. This is something new to me and it’s possible, a home visit might, in this age of online purchasing, be considered an extra service by the tradesperson or artisan involved. After all there are people out there who get paid for color consultancy, such as a certain paint company, or expertise (such as a structural engineer) .But this is stated upfront.

cate | 2 years and 3 months ago

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    ["delete_private_feed_templates"]=>
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    ["edit_published_feed_templates"]=>
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    ["edit_feed_template_terms"]=>
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    ["read_shortcoder"]=>
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    ["delete_shortcoder"]=>
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    ["edit_others_shortcoders"]=>
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    ["publish_shortcoders"]=>
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    ["delete_shortcoders"]=>
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    ["delete_published_shortcoders"]=>
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    ["delete_others_shortcoders"]=>
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    ["edit_published_shortcoders"]=>
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    ["aioseo_manage_seo"]=>
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    ["aioseo_page_analysis"]=>
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    ["aioseo_page_general_settings"]=>
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    ["aioseo_page_schema_settings"]=>
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    ["aioseo_page_social_settings"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["rank_math_edit_htaccess"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["rank_math_titles"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["rank_math_general"]=>
    bool(true)
    ["rank_math_sitemap"]=>
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    ["rank_math_404_monitor"]=>
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    ["rank_math_content_ai"]=>
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    ["srm_manage_redirects"]=>
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    ["SPF Manage Analytics"]=>
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    ["administrator"]=>
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    ["editor"]=>
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Definitely check references first.

cate | 2 years and 3 months ago

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    ["srm_manage_redirects"]=>
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    ["administrator"]=>
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Coming out to look at and discuss the job is not something you pay for. Taking measurements or drawing up plans you do pay for. After you decide to give him/her the job. (I once paid a stove repair person to come out and test my stove and he found nothing wrong and I insisted on paying him for his time, but that was different.)

Guest User | 2 years and 3 months ago

string(1) "3"
string(6) "202864"

I don’t think someone is going to take a survey without compensation, but they should be able to provide references and work samples.

RobertGMarvin

in General Discussion 2 years and 3 months ago

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If the people who’ll speak with you first seem good you might not want to bother with the person charging the large upfront fee—I wouldn’t.