DOF inspection

Can anyone share their experience with a DOF inspection. Did it help or hurt? Can you tell the DOF you do not want an inspection?

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Guest User | 4 years and 3 months ago

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@augustiner “renovation cost will be added to assessed value 1 to 1 ” So a 50K renovation increases assessed value by 50,000 in the few years after renovation? I haven’t seen that happening but maybe i misunderstood.

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Agree developers are doing it by the book. Developers also get tax abatements and deductions that homeowners don’t get. I don’t know how people get away with not pulling permits as you take a big risk if someone calls DOB. There are a lot of empty apts right now due to the pandemic and recent changes in rent regulations and capital improvements. Developers can’t deduct as much with improvements so they aren’t doing that work and letting apts lie empty.

hkapstein | 4 years and 4 months ago

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I hear what you’re saying, but I think the bigger picture is that people doing work by the books are often developers building 100 million dollar condos, and people who have lived in a home since 1990 could have there taxes go up 10x and their equity wiped out so that developers like trump can make an extra 20% on their next job. Doesn’t sound like a great policy to me. By the way, I do pull permits in my jobs, so I’m taking this hit too.

But here I think we may find common ground. I think that taxes for non principle residences or commuter taxes make more sense. Why does moving to Hoboken save a banker 100k in taxes that gets made up by folks like you? Why not increase taxes on empty apts owned by foreign investors, and let our prices move to market value over the next 30 years?

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Very sad that the people doing things by the book are the ones getting punished. Ha ha love the tile example….People who have a design sense can make cheap look good. It should be based on sq footage, condition of mechanicals and any additional aspects like roof deck etc. Finishes can add value. However the DOF assessments seem inappropriately slanted towards aesthetics. You could have someone slap on finishes and have old plumbing/electric and the city would tax them more than someone who upgraded mechanicals but the finish is not as good.

Augustiner | 4 years and 4 months ago

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It favors people and investors who do shoddy renovations without filing for permits, and punishes the ones who code-compliant upgrades. It also subsidized tax abated new construction.
If the argument is that the value of a house or tripled after a renovation I would argue that‘s not true.
I don’t see he point why a house that has nice tiles vs cheap tiles has to be taxed differently. Maybe I bought the nice tiles for cheap or I made them myself in pottery class. If I pay 100k to put in a new sprinkler system, that should not add to my taxes. It makes my neighbors house safe. But the main point is: no one knows, no one understands

Taxation by sqf with a discount for owner occupants or seniors that would make sense. And clear formulas for different type of C of O discounts or sucharges. Just something that fits on 2 pages and that is transparent

hkapstein | 4 years and 4 months ago

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I suppose if they fixed the system it would less heavily tax people who did extravagant renovations relative to those who lived in their homes since 1970 without doing any work. I don’t know though, I think it might favor investors and developers over homeowners in the long term.

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Glad to hear a positive outcome and glad your tax was reduced. It can go either way which makes me nervous. They did say I could skip it if i wanted to. Sometimes the tax won’t go up but they still increase your market value . This then means it goes up a lot the following year. If they just fixed the system they would make the same amount of money without unfairly taxing some people over others.

Arkady | 4 years and 4 months ago

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I had my building inspected (the inspector was not the sharpest knife in the drawer) & there was no change. I still felt the tax was too high so I asked again the following year (at the recommendation of a DoF guy at one of the annual seminars given by the city) & the tax was actually reduced.

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Thank you augustiner. My architect entered exactly what was in the contract. Problem is some work was not done. The DOF doesn’t know that however. And not everything is visible when they do the inspection so not sure how they will see issues behind the walls.

Augustiner | 4 years and 4 months ago

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renovation cost will be added to assessed value 1 to 1 (what the DOF estimates the real reno cost is, not the lowball number everyone enters), So if your reno cost is actually lower and you can prove that with receipts you can object to it

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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My PW3 costs were not all that much so it is part of the equation. You can see the PW3 on DOB . However it is not a consolidated view of accruals.

cobblehillhome | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Any general guidance or personal anecdotes on how much one can expect property taxes to go up after an Alt-2 gut reno? Today they are $3,200 and I imagine next year they will jump significantly. Our neighbors had a similar reno 3 years ago, and today they taxes are $5.2k (went to $4.5 post reno) – hoping ours will be similar and not jump to $18k 🙁 (Sorry to hear this was your case, Augustiner!)

Is there a consolidated view to see the PW3 costs total? We bought from a developers so I wasn’t involved in the original filings

cobblehillhome | 4 years and 4 months ago

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Is there a consolidated view to see the PW3 costs total? We bought from a developers so I wasn’t involved in the original filings

resident2 | 4 years and 4 months ago

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If you have challenged your assessment, they can request that it inspected inspected. DOF inspectors are NOT DOB inspectors, so it can be rather arbitrary. If they like your housekeeping it is obviously worth more….
You need to make it look as un-renovated (poor) as possible. They re-assess on improvements. They also want to see that the house is being used as the class (occupancy) it is being assessed for.
Makes no sense …. but what in the City does? NYC “Market” Value, Assessed Value & Real Value have little to do with it. If it was taxed on real market value, none would live in the City.

Augustiner | 4 years and 4 months ago

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It was an alt-1 job.
I think if you convert from SRO or Church to 3 family you get hit harder than a 1 fam to 2 family c of O change.
Funny aspect is that I couldn’t wait for the tax assessment because I thought it would lower my taxes from 8,000. I called for a review. They came by and bumped it to 18k. Didn’t even have to go inside. And now every year my taxes raise 1,000 every year.

No doubt about it, this random way of taxation is will kill people. It makes buildings less safe because it encourages illegal construction

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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All true and correct.

krobertson

in General Discussion 4 years and 4 months ago

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From what I’m aware of, DOF reviews the PW3 cost statements that your architect files with the DOB for all renovations filed. Unless the PW3 was a very minor amount they will reassess your taxes based on the cost stated in the PW3. Lost of people won’t notice it since it hits a year or 2 after the renovation and its buried as part of the annual property notice. I got hit a year after my renovation. Increased my property taxes an extra just under 1% of the total cost on the PW3. This probably another reason why a lot of folks reno without permits.

Guest User | 4 years and 4 months ago

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@Housefix, same reason as Augustiner I expect. Renovation took longer than expected. DOB informs DOF and even when there is no physical improvement and the taxes go up Taxation is all over the place. Some people in the area pay 8k and others pay 14k for almost exactly the same houses. Augustiner’s tax is excessive for his area. There needs to be some collective adjustment.

krobertson

in General Discussion 4 years and 4 months ago

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@janedrew I’m curious what prompted DoF to reassess your property to the higher rate in the first place?

@Augustiner $20k for a 3 fam brownstone is definitely on the higher end. Sounds like you are probably probably paying close to the full uncapped property tax rate either because your brownstone is a newer construction or someone filed an Alt-1 renovation / CO change on your property some time ago? There’s an article the Times about it a few years back.

Lots of people are either paying artificially low property taxes due to the 6% annual cap combined with rapid gentrification or are alternatively paying the the full tax rate due to a major renovation (CO change) or they are a new construction without a tax abatement. Also, many old condo and coops also have artificially low tax rates due to how DOF estimates the monthly rental potential of a $2MM condo/coop as $1500 a month because nearby rent stabilized comparable rent for only that much.

I know someone owns a new construction $1.4MM condo in in Harlem that pays $300 a year a taxes due to the 25year 421a tax ab atement on the property. On the flip side commercial tax rates in the city can be quite insane. I also knew someone who inherited a 1 story ~2000 sqft warehouse in Queens who said his annual property tax was $50k. I didn’t believe it until I saw myself online. He ended up selling it as he said the property tax bill took out too big of a bite of annual rental income.

DOF inspection

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DOF inspection

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