acting as own general contractor
My husband and I are now hoping to buy a 2-family house that needs a gut renovation and turn it into a 1-family home (perhaps keeping it officially as 2-family); we just sent in the deposit and are waiting for the seller to sign the contract. We are not now in NYC but hoping eventually to move there to be closer to children (and urban attractions). Closing will probably not be before next January, as it’s a complicated sale involving courts in two states. I was hoping we could do planning (with an architect) next year and be ready for actual work next spring. Would it be legally possible for us to act as our own general contractor? I think I read that the main thing one needs is insurance. My husband will have a sabbatic next year; we could rent an apartment while supervising work. We have a relative in NYC, a retired contractor, whom we could hire as a consultant. My husband has done plumbing and some electricity plus carpentry and tiling; he laid two tongue-and-grove hardwood floors in our house in Ithaca. Of course we would need licensed electricians, plumbe rs, etc. We would need some beams to replace support walls, and we would need professionals for that. I guess I really have two questions: 1. Could he legally be our general contractor, and if. so, what are the requirements? 2. Is this a crazy idea? He would enjoy being involved with the work, even doing some (tiling, floors) himself.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
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JPDA | 4 years and 11 months ago
Pre-closing walkthroughs are definitely recommended. I would also suggest you get a building engineer to inspect and report for peace of mind. Feel free to reach out to us for some suggestions and to schedule a time to meet if you’d like.
jcarch | 4 years and 11 months ago
I agree with Maggie O, see if you can get access for a half day, you could make appointments with several potential architects to walk through the house. Walk throughs typically take 45-60 minutes.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
Thanks, but when we meet with architects we would want to be able to poke at various nooks and crannies and strange structures to see what can be taken down, and the seller’s agent is very strict. So we will have to wait.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
it seems like this might be a more complex closing situation than most but i’ve definitely heard of folks doing walkthroughs with architects and contractors prior to closing.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
it seems like this might be a more complex closing situation than most but i’ve definitely heard of folks doing walkthroughs with architects and contractors prior to closing.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
That’s very helpful; I can see we have our work cut out for us, even if we use a GC. We definitely need an architect. Once we close, one of the first things we will do is talk to architects. I don’t think we can do that before we close, because we’d like the architects to see the house.
jcarch | 4 years and 11 months ago
You’ll want/need an architect, which is required to get the project approved by the DOB. Some arch’s just do a very minimal set of drawings, enough to get approval, and then you’re on your own. The risk with this is that there’s lots of room for the vagueness you’re worried about, which means that the bids aren’t really worth much, as the actual scope of work may vary by a lot from what a contractor assumes. My office does full drawings/details/specs, so that GC bids are accurate and complete. We’re also present throughout construction, making sure that the GC’s doing thing as planned, heading off potential problems before they will cost $ to deal with, etc.
FYI, clients often purchase high value items, like appliances, themselves, so that there’s no mark up on appliances, lighting, etc. Even when they do this, we give the GC the specs, so that they can’t later claim that there’s an upcharge because of the particulars on items that the owner buys.
Choosing finishes prior to construction is a bit daunting, but it’s not any easier to make the exact same set of decis ions during construction. Often under pressure from the contractor that they need x “right now” or there will be delays, added costs, etc., all of which leads to the “we just had to run to Home Depot and get what was in stock” look that is not what anyone was imagining when the project started.
JPDA | 4 years and 11 months ago
You absolutely will need all of the exact details and specifications for every component, fixture, finish and assembly in order to get meaningful bids that can be compared and used as the basis for a fixed-fee contract. Your architect will work with you to develop all of this based on your preferences. I am happy to walk you through the process, look for JPDA in the Architects section under Find a Pro on the Brownstoner menu bar.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
Thanks very much, cate and jcarch. Still waiting for the seller to sign. If we do go the “hire a GC” route, I am confused about how bids actually work. I can imagine the proposed job saying something like “make the first floor level” , leaving the details of how that is to be accomplished vague. But in presenting a proposed job to general contractors, is one supposed to specify the manufacturer and model number of every kitchen appliance? Every window? The precise tile to be used in a bathroom floor? Which particular toilets? We want to make those choices, but making them all before the job is even bid seems daunting. How do people handle that?
jcarch | 4 years and 11 months ago
Congrats on the new home, it sound like quite an adventure getting to this point.
My understanding is that DOB had/has a path for homeowners to GC their own project. But in 25 years, we’ve never had a client go that way, and I strongly suspect it’s intended for more minor renovations. You could visit the borough office of the DOB to ask about your situation, or if needed you can submit a PER-11 form requesting a meeting w/ DOB staff to go over your questions (if you google “nyc dob per-11” the form and instructions should be the first links that show up).
Assuming you can, the pro’s of doing this are: that you can be more hands on, laying floors if you want to lay floors, and do other work, saving $ on those things. You’ll also avoid the GC’s 10%-20% markup on the work.
But I think the con’s will outweigh the benefits: you’re unlikely to lay your own floor as quickly as a flooring contractor with a crew of 4 guys will do it. And you’re much more likely to be taken advantage of by subs. To the electrician (with the great references) you hire, you’re a one time cl ient. When he’s over-booked, he’s going to go to the job sites of the GC’s who repeatedly hire him, as he wants them to keep hiring him for future jobs. Same thing with change orders from subs. as you’re a one-off client, they’re not going to absorb any costs, even if they should because they made an error in pricing the work.
And you’re much more likely to run afoul of the DOB, DOT, etc, as a good GC will be more familiar w/ all the regs that they’re supposed to follow for site safety, which permits they need to get, etc. So your odds of getting violations and stop work orders goes up significantly.
My guess is that in the end, you’ll pay at least as much (in violations, change orders, and extra rent paid on the place you stay in during construction) on your own as you would with a GC, and the project will take 1.5 to 2x longer to build. That assumes you hire a competent GC. Some of this may be offset by your relative if he’s got an address book full of reliable subs that he’s worked with for years, knows what DOT permits will be needed to put a container on the street in front of the house, and where to get them from, etc.
As Cate points out, you can maintain control over a traditional GC in a number of ways, and review/approve key sub’s based on their experience, or even break out certain work that you’ll hire subs for directly or do yourself.
Good luck with the project, if you’d like to chat off-line in more detail, feel free to reach out to me at jpc (at) jcarchitecture.com
JPDA | 4 years and 11 months ago
I would definitely recommend against acting as your own GC on a project of this scope. Beyond the insurance and building permit challenges, I would also agree with Cate that your lack of familiarity with NYC subs and suppliers will be a substantial burden to getting things done. Radiant floor is actually really easy and if that is your biggest concern then making sure your architect knows your performance needs during design will ensure that the proper specs are included in the contract documents. I can’t emphasize enough that the GC premium is well worth it, and so easy to exceed in your own costs for delays, lack of trades/work/deliveries coordination, loss and damages and other unforeseen circumstances that will become your sole responsibility to bear.
cate | 4 years and 11 months ago
When you’re working with a GC, you can always specify you want to work with specific people or specialists for certain tasks, such as stripping, plaster repair, or whatever is important to you. I’d avoid doing it with the standard/regular subs such as plumbers and electricians and I wouldn’t do it for everything — you want to be easy to work with. If questions about quality develop down the line, it can cause issues and drama, and likely you will have to take responsibility for any problems since you hired the person. Ask your architect about how this might work with something like HVAC or radiant floor heat.
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
We haven’t talked yet to my husband’s cousin; I want to wait until the seller actually signs the contract, which should be soon
. (We originally were going to close on the house in April 2019, but it turned out the seller did not have clear title. Then we were going to close in April 2020, but the seller wasn’t ready, and we got out with our deposit. Now we are getting the house for slightly less money than our original bid.) Whether he (the cousin) has connections to good subcontractors is indeed a concern. One appeal of being our own GC is having more control. For instance, we want radiant floor heat, and want to be sure whoever does that work is really experienced; would a GC necessarily know how to choose the right people?
cate | 4 years and 11 months ago
What does your relative say? One of the biggest challenges of working in the NYC area is knowing good people and being able to get them to work for you. Anyone who’s good is very, very busy and can pick and choose projects and who they want to work with. If you don’t have connections and an in, forget it. If you were, say, undertaking a renovation where you need only electrical, plumbing, wood stripping and refinishing, and plaster skim coating, I would say, yes act as your own GC, because those are all specialized trades a GC can’t do. (That was our approach for our renovation, which has lasted 10 years and counting.) But you’re working with an architect and filing an Alt-2, so you will need a GC anyway at least for some things. One of the advantages of working with an architect is they know GCs who are good and reliable and can bid out to three of them. I do know someone, an artist, who did the tiling work on one kitchen in their home during an Alt-2 with an architect and a general contractor. How that came about I am not sure, but it was not part of the plan in the be ginning. I’d say in the long run you will save money, and an immense amount of time and aggravation if you let a GC do their thing and handle the whole job. (And I wouldn’t mention past experience when bidding out the job.) You will have plenty to do checking up on their work every day — believe me!
Guest User | 4 years and 11 months ago
we are hoping for alt2
chemosphere | 4 years and 11 months ago
my recommendation:
act as a GC for a renovation job needing no permits = yes.
Act as GC for a Reno job with Alt 1 permits = maybe.
Act as GC for a gut Reno with Alt 1 permits = no.
yudashasom | 4 years and 11 months ago
Bad idea
patrickburnsjr | 4 years and 11 months ago
OMG
stevecym | 4 years and 11 months ago
i can tell you who probably would know a lot about what i just wrote and either answer some unanswered questions or correct me if i am wrong – it would be DIBS. he has the right balance of construction know how and white collar knowledge (and he is always right with the construction questions – though we don’t need to puff his head up anymore by telling him that). but he is the kind of guy who is never around when you need him. he peeped on here briefly to taunt me a bit the other day and has since disappeared. he must be on a quiet island someplace sipping a margarita.
for those of you reading what i wrote above and questioning my experience (you are correct to and do your own research; the point of what i wrote was to “raise” questions, not “answer” them) and wondering what i might mean by working on a property as a “field person” or i might see something as a “third party”; i was a supervisory person in these positions. what that meant was, i might be in the office when someone (the manager) was having the conversation with an insurance agent but it also me ant that i was ALWAYS the guy leading the insurance adjuster around after a flood or sadly, fire.
for what its worth as to what i am saying above, i have always maintained insurance in my own business, including workmen’s comp when i have employees.
for the OP or anyone else considering any of these questions, it helps to read the policy and i bet you can get a copy of one before purchasing the products. a lot of policies are uniform across carriers and i still recall my boss telling condo owners “it does not matter what company you have, you should have a policy coded as HO-? for protection on a condo here”. i bet a lot of builder’s policies are designed the same only with different limits of coverage – which will be important in NYC verses East Bunny Hole, Iowa.