Boiler Recommendations?

My 60+-yr-old oil boiler in my 140-yr-old brownstone died last Thurs and I’m interested in doing a oil-to-gas conversion to replace it as quickly as possible. Would love to get recommendations for converting to a gas system for a 4-story brownstone. More importantly, can anyone recommend some good boiler guys to do the work?

princenancy

in Boiler Repair 11 years and 6 months ago

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bxre | 9 years and 9 months ago

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Need Master Plumber to swap a gas steam boiler in zip code 10462 Bronx. Pre-war 7 Unit Walk up Residential Risers Steam Radiators. Contact me at bxreny@gmail.com Thank You in Advance Vinny

ppmcnulty | 11 years ago

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Could you send me the info on the plumber you used for your new heating system? My email is below. Thanks, Patrick ppmcnulty@gmail.com

c1876 | 11 years and 5 months ago

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Hal | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Thanks for the replies. Very helpful. Indeed today I have to order 250 gallons of smelly oil that’s going to cost me $1000.00\. Can’t wait to get this done.

eman134 | 11 years and 6 months ago

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$10,000 is way more realistic than $3,000 since it will probably entail upgrading your gas service as well as replacing the boiler, maybe putting in an indirect hot water heater as well. MP is on point regarding the oil tank…it should be removed and a certificate of removal should be issued for the fire department It is not well advised to cut corners now that everything is computerized and on the internet…it will turn around and bite you on the ass a few years from now when the paperwork on your house does not line up

Master Plvmber | 11 years and 6 months ago

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The tank should be removed, but it can also be “decommissioned” as per the City. Some plumbers do it themselves but it really should be done by professional contractors that are licensed by the DEP to handle and discard the oil. It’s like dealing with asbestos. There’s trouble to be had if it goes the wrong way. I don’t comment on prices normally, but a conversion done well often costs much closer to $10K than it does to $3K, or even $6K for that matter but there are lots of variables that affect price. Keyspan and Con Ed both offer incentives, but they’re not enough to be your motivating factor. Do it for the odorless, clean burning fuel, quiet equipment and seasonal efficiency.

Hal | 11 years and 6 months ago

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I am planning on doing this oil to gas conversion as well. Helpful thread. I wonder if the professionals participating can mention whether the typical conversion includes the removal of the old oil storage tank. Also what a ballpark figure would be for the job. Not holding anyone to a quote, of course. Assuming the job is done by licensed insured professionals installing reliable equipment. $3000? $6000? $10,000?… You get the idea. Do the gas companies offer incentives?

nalusurf | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Thanks for the detailed explanation MP. As always, you provide good information and generously share your expertise. It is appreciated.

princenancy | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Hey Master Plumber, you guys installed our water heaters, so you’ve actually seen the old beast that just died. I’m going to call your place in the morning to schedule an estimate.

princenancy | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Hey Master Plumber, you guys installed our water heaters, so you’ve actually seen the old beast that just died. I’m going to call your place in the morning to schedule an estimate.

Master Plvmber | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Honestly, Nalusurf, you’re right. Your post did prompt my entry. The reality is there’s nothing inherently wrong with firing the boiler during the summer to make hot water, but you’ve got to take that water and store it in an insulated container if it’s going to work with any acceptable degree of efficiency. The old way of making hot water was what you seem to describe, Nalusurf. You’ve got a Weil-McLain gas boiler with a tankless coil, which means you’ve got an EG-series model. The boiler has an aquastat stuck in it to tell the burner when to fire when the boiler has lost its heat. The boiler has to remain hot in order for your tankless coil (inserted into boiler) to give you hot water when you ask for it, so the boiler fires several times per hour for a short time just to maintain the aquastat setting (~150°F). This is where a great deal of fuel and money are wasted. If you take a small pump and move that hot water through the coil into a simple insulated storage tank with its own thermostat (or aquastat), the boiler never has to fire again until the tank cools down. What’s the difference? The boiler cools at 10-15 degrees per hour under average conditions. More in a drafty cellar. It takes a lot of gas to heat a boiler 10-15 degrees, not to mention a lot of wear and tear caused by the many short cycles on and off. An insulated storage tank cools at ½° per hour, or as many as 12° per an entire day. Tankless coils do make some sense in the winter when you’re firing to make heat and hot water at exactly the same time, but short of that, they force you to constantly replenish energy in water that is constantly finding its way up and out your chimney. Another option is an indirect water heater which takes that coil and inserts it into the storage tank. It’s the same “heat exchanger” technology, but done in a slightly different way that allows you to use boilers that don’t accept the inserted coil. Only Weil-McLain and maybe Slant/Fin even make a boiler that does that anymore since it’s such an outdated practice in a residential application. The storage or indirect tanks, because of their volume of water also have all but eliminated those hot-cool-hot water temperature fluctuations we NY’ers have come to accept as normal, too. There’s a lot more to talk about with how to make domestic hot water, but this is a busy time for us. Read this by the U.S. Dept of Energy. It’s written by someone who doesn’t know the difference between a boiler and furnace, but hey. Let he who is without sin…. http://energy.gov/energysaver/articles/tankless-coil-and-indirect-water-heaters

mousta | 11 years and 6 months ago

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I will let master plumber opine on the coil heating of water since he’s the pro, but this is what I had before he did my conversion. The boiler has to fire all year round to heat water on demand. This is incredibly inefficient and not only bad for the environment but will also cost you more money in the end. It’s like paying to heat your house to get hot water.

deano | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Master Plvmber did this for me, pretty much exactly two years ago. I can vouch for his crew getting it done quickly and well. Probably could have got it done for a bit cheaper, but like eye surgery and automobile brakes, a multifamily steam boiler swap is not a place to cut corners.

nalusurf | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Master P, I assume it is my entry/scenario that sparked your comment. I am interested to know more if you wouldn’t mind. I was not aware of the negative environmental impact, or that one even existed with a coil in the boiler. Please elaborate. Can the system be retrofitted with a storage tank? Thanks!

Master Plvmber | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Do the whole world a favor and don’t get a boiler with a tankless coil water heater in it unless you’re pairing it with a storage tank of some kind. Though definitely the cheapest of all, it’s an environmentally black option as a stand alone method of making hot water. No efficiency conscious designer/installer does that anymore.

nalusurf | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Just completed our oil to gas conversion a couple of weeks ago. 3 story brownstone, steam radiators. A fairly simple set up as we just could not afford a conversion to hot water. We kept the original radiators and steam pipes and installed a Weil McLain atmospheric boiler with a coil for the hot water. Also had to have the chimney lined. I used a plumber that came recommended from my neighbor who has lived in his home for 20 years and has used him throughout his brownstone renovations. I was very happy with his work, it was completed quickly and efficiently and very neat. Not a whole lot of use hours under it’s belt yet, but so far it has been great as far as hot water and we’ll see how the heating season goes. He has done some more work for us since and I am planning on replacing some radiators with one more suitably sized for the spaces they are heating as our wallet allows us and I plan to use him. If you’d like his contact info let me have your email address as I have not gotten his permission to post his info here (although I am sure he wouldn’t mind, I always like to ask first!).

catbk | 11 years and 6 months ago

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Hi. We used Aladdin a few years ago for this and we couldn’t be happier. The crew was fast and professional, they cleaned up after themselves while working here, they were knowledgable and recommended good quality materials. When one item installed broke – due to a manufacturing flaw rather than anything Aladdin did – they replaced the part without charge for the replacement item or for labor. The new gas system has worked well, and has saved us money. I know this sounds like I’m a shill, but I promise you I’m not. Aladdin Plumbing & Heating www.aladdinplumbingcorp.com 379 5th Ave, Brooklyn – (718) 768-6367

mousta | 11 years and 6 months ago

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I used gateway plumbing to do this last year. So far so good. Very tidy job and still working very well.