A Look at What Toll Bros. Wants to Redevelop
Here’s a look at the blocks in Gowanus that Toll Brothers is interested in completely redeveloping. Toll’s 605,380-square-foot development would run from the canal to Bond Street between Carroll and 2nd streets. As the photos show, most of the area in question ain’t all that pretty, but members of the community have started expressing deep…
Here’s a look at the blocks in Gowanus that Toll Brothers is interested in completely redeveloping. Toll’s 605,380-square-foot development would run from the canal to Bond Street between Carroll and 2nd streets. As the photos show, most of the area in question ain’t all that pretty, but members of the community have started expressing deep reservations about Toll’s plans. Gowanus Lounge, which broke the news of Toll’s plans, has been covering the growing opposition to the development. Among the questions being asked: 1. Why should Toll Brothers get a jump on the larger rezoning of Gowanus? 2. Hey, isn’t this development in a flood plain? 3. How will Toll clean up festering toxic soil?
Toll Brothers’ Gargantuan Gowanus Plans Revealed [Brownstoner] GMAP
New “Movement” Developing in Gowanus & Carroll Gardens? [GL]
Why waste billions to clean up an area for affordable housing when the money could develop far more affordable housing elsewhere?
ACTUAL IDEA THAT COULD WORK FOR EVERYONE
Now to an actual thing you could push for…..how about you require all who convert to a residential zoning (either through a complete rezoning or an individual action like Toll Brothers) to build 100% affordable houseing. The land valu ewill still go up for the existing owners. Just not to the insane levels if you could just do market rate. The only people who get hurt here are the developers who gambled for a different outcome and you do not change the zoning based on gambling.
Oh please 12:25 – I live in right up the block from here and I can assure you there are no prostitutes. It is so far from being some bohemiam hot spot – there are mostly yuppies who work successfully in the arts and old time italians – and a retirement home. This spot on the gowanus is ugly – and has great dance parties in the summer – but the area is hardly gritty in the old NYC sense of the word.
In any case, this area is so far gone down yuppy road, it might as well go all the way. And what heaven to have a nice, albeit small, park are on the water front. NYC is just horrible at taking advantage of water front property. Ideally Gowanus would be cleaned up and we would have bars and cafes all along it (fat chance) but decent housing with a little public park space is better than nothing.
I am pro development, I am pro AY. I favor higer density near mass transit and center city. BUT I think that the city/state is making a mistake in trying to rezone and clean up the Gowanus for RESIDENTIAL development.
It is simply a waste of time and money to try to clean this area adequately for high density residential. Look at all the problems Whole Foods is having and that isnt even a residential development.
The real fallacy here is that the land is only valuable for residential. It isnt, there is a thriving industrial/business community in this area and in fact these community would invest and expand in the area if the threat of residential development was removed (why invest when the possibility exists for conversion to a more valuable residential developer).
The city should determine which parcels (if any) are conducive for quick and cheap conversion to residential (ie.e not on the canal itself and on thru streets to “join” the neighborhoods) do a limited rezoning (if possible) and then forever (or until the next election) protect the bulk of the land for industry.
The concrete plant is a perfect example – it serves a VITAL need for fresh concrete in Manhattan, its loss will cost everyone a fortune (in increased construction costs and $ for a new nearby plant) and at the end of the day the billions spent trying o clean this sewer could be used in more efficient ways.
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I am pro development, I am pro AY. I favor higer density near mass transit and center city. BUT I think that the city/state is making a mistake in trying to rezone and clean up the Gowanus for RESIDENTIAL development.
It is simply a waste of time and money to try to clean this area adequately for high density residential. Look at all the problems Whole Foods is having and that isnt even a residential development.
The real fallacy here is that the land is only valuable for residential. It isnt, there is a thriving industrial/business community in this area and in fact these community would invest and expand in the area if the threat of residential development was removed (why invest when the possibility exists for conversion to a more valuable residential developer).
The city should determine which parcels (if any) are conducive for quick and cheap conversion to residential (ie.e not on the canal itself and on thru streets to “join” the neighborhoods) do a limited rezoning (if possible) and then forever (or until the next election) protect the bulk of the land for industry.
The concrete plant is a perfect example – it serves a VITAL need for fresh concrete in Manhattan, its loss will cost everyone a fortune (in increased construction costs and $ for a new nearby plant) and at the end of the day the billions spent trying o clean this sewer could be used in more efficient ways.
“…the “Venice” of the North East…”
That would be hot. Until next building boom…
I’d hate for that area to become gentrified. I buy my heroin down there. Now will I have to go back to the Bronx like the old days?
so lets get to the actual issue at hand becuase the cleaning of the canal is not the driving force here (many of the people saying that it is already canoe every weekend in the canal and allow their family members to have secondary contact with the water).
The real issue is that this is an urban oasis. Yes it smells, yes it is a bit dirty, yes it is a great place to get a hooker duriong certain hours, but this is what keeps everyone away enough for the artists, locals, and other cool people to enjoy it without being kicked out or infringed upon by any annoying yuppy freaks (even though everyone on this blog is probably considered a yuppy by someone somewhere).
This is that cool bar that all of a sudden gets good lighting and a hot bartender. All of a sudden it is no longer my private hangout.
I love the canal and am also afraid of change. I like this design. I think that we will see much worse designs coming down the pike (I think we have already seen worse designs).
I think that everyone shoudl use this design as a minimum standard and will probably use this example to show future developers who come with buildings that will have a 25 year shelf life (like the ones on 4th avenue).
And in case anyone hasn’t figured it out yet – they are not cleaning the canal, dredging the canal, fixing the CSO issues unless the development is actaully coming. They fix the problems they have to and right now too many people like this place the way it is and have blocked all development and maintaining the industrial wasteland that it is. As long as it is kept this way people shoudl not expect much change.
It’s not correct to cast this as a neighborhood against vs. non-Gowanus folks for argument. I’m in the neighborhood, get the Gowanus Canal in my cellar during storms, and I am for this development.
The housing is cheap here because it’s polluted. Is it fair to force someone out of their home so that a 200 year pollution problem could begin to be solved? I don’t know. I don’t live in the footprint, but I cannot say I would feel good about standing in the way of public health improvements a lot of people have been wanting for a very, very long time.
(I don’t mean to conflate Toll Brothers with the ultimate cleanup of the canal. It doesn’t stand or fall with their project. But my hope that it will be a catalyst is strong.)