Consider buying a house with no certificate of occupancy?

Hi everyone,

I’m currently considering purchasing a house in Queens that was built in 1901 and is being advertised as a 2-family home. However, I’ve noticed that the property doesn’t have a certificate of occupancy, which has raised some concerns for me.

From my research, I’ve learned that some houses built before 1935 may not require a certificate of occupancy. However, this house has undergone significant renovations and it appears to have originally been a single-family home.

I’m wondering if anyone knows whether this house requires the issuance of a retroactive certificate of occupancy. I understand that an inspector or lawyer should catch any issues during the purchase process, but I want to make sure that I’m not missing any major red flags before moving forward.

Any insights or advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you!

mreisbaum

in Dept. of Buildings (DOB) 1 year and 1 month ago

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justinromeu26 | 1 year and 1 month ago

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Cate, i looked at the title and mortgage docs on file. I mean the summaries. I think a mortgage bank put 2 fam but something does not smell right here.

Op has to walk into dob office in queens and pull the file and ask.

I am not sure if you can just walk in anymore.

cate | 1 year and 1 month ago

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PropertyShark has it as a B3, aka a “two family converted from one.” HPD has it as one. DOF has it as two. Applications for renovation permits filed with DOB claim it is an existing two-family, but that doesn’t necessarily mean anything. Having two meters or adding a second meter doesn’t turn a single-family into a legal two-family. The existing Alt-2 renovation permits were issued but don’t appear to have been closed and signed off on. It had an electrical upgrade, completed in 2021, and it is having electrical work done now. It last sold for $1.35 million in 2019. Unusual that it would be asking less now. The basement level is full and above grade, so it is legal living space (although sometimes there are restrictions in the sense that it must be accessory to a unit on the first floor, but I don’t know the details).

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 1 month ago

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Saved another article. Someone else, a broker, said that this happens all the time. That you can go to the dob and check the file and talk to them about a letter of no objection.

Someone else said if they look the title up on an older building during the search it will show it as a one family and this may not be accurate if the change was done recently.

And the broker said what said yesterday. Talk to an expeditor.

I would do some of this leg work and go to the dob before talking to an atty. You may find your answer or you will be able to tell the atty what was in the folder.

If you email me i will send you links to what i found.

Also, if you are buying it as a 2 and its not, the bank will not issue a mortgage. Which might mean seller will have to get letter of no ob.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 1 month ago

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I found an article that was written in 2015 that states if there is no cert of occupancy for a building and it was built before 1938, you (or the owner) can apply for a letter of no objection from the city.

Someone on this forum said that con ed will provide a second meter for a legal two. That post was from 2011.

I will keep reading. I saved the first article.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 1 month ago

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You need a lawyer. A good one or someone who could tell you how to spot the application for the change. That is why i said to tell them to apply for a c of o. Everything will have to be on the up and up.

I will read tonight and see if i can point you.

mreisbaum | 1 year and 1 month ago

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@homeinspector..all the records are online now. Perhaps not old icards. But new records should be and this one has no record of it being a formally “legal 2 fam”

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Have you gone to the queens dob and asked to see the file on that house? Years ago we could do that. Not sure anymore.

justinromeu26 | 1 year and 1 month ago

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Ok. I have admitted i am guessing anyway because i don’t own a 2 fam. I know of people who have gotten screwed in these situations. You have to find a lawyer who deals with multi family. I would get the name of one and ask for a face to face. Pay them. They might be able to tell you what to look at if they don’t know.

I have not looked at that link but be careful about sharing tmi on net. If you had emailed me and i was working in a customer’s house i could ask, i would do so. But i am not in that set up this week.
I don’t mind researching some of this to learn and will read tonight. But remember, free advice is worth what you pay for it. The best you can hope for from a layperson is that they find something that says its not 2 family but for you to buy it on someone on here’s word that it is or is not would be wrong. You need someone who has been through this.

I am not sure if the 2nd meter means anything. Who approves that permit? I asked myself “what would happen if i applied for a second meter for my business that is in my house?”

I cannot call that expeditor i mentioned because i have not spoken to him in years.

mreisbaum | 1 year and 1 month ago

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Based on previous sales and listing, it appears it was a single family and converted to a 2 fam house. They have 2 meters and a permit to install 2 meter. I am not sure if all these permits make it “legal 2 family”. I will have a lawyer but to be honest, I know of friends whose lawyers missed these things so I just want to make sure I do my dd.
here is a linkt to the dob https://a810-bisweb.nyc.gov/bisweb/PropertyProfileOverviewServlet?boro=4&houseno=12-14&street=30+dr&go2=+GO+&requestid=0