Building code in an old building: grandfathered? Must renovations comply?

Hi, when planning a cosmetic renovation (replacing appliances, cabinetry, & floor/wall tile) — so my contractor is not filing permits — in a walk-up co-op built in 1910, is it necessary to check building code compliance for the layout? I’m planning on using the same functional footprint as what has existed since I bought 10 years ago. Is there a requirement for me to deal with any code issues (electrical and plumbing are fine, I’m told)?

carolynhaft

in Dept. of Buildings (DOB) 5 months ago

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davidjonson | 1 month ago

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If you’re only doing a cosmetic renovation replacing finishes, appliances, cabinets, and tiles
and not changing any structural, plumbing, or electrical layouts, then you generally don’t have to bring the entire space up to current code. The existing conditions are typically “grandfathered” under the code that was in effect when the building (or last permitted renovation) was done.

That said, once you start opening walls or moving utilities, inspectors can require updates to current standards especially things like GFCI outlets, shutoff valves, or ventilation. Even without a permit, it’s smart to have your contractor make sure everything meets basic safety code, since co-ops and insurers can sometimes ask for compliance documentation later.

So: no need for full code upgrades for surface-level work, but don’t cut corners on safety or hidden systems.

cate | 1 month ago

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As long as you are not moving mechanicals, wet rooms, or walls, you do not need an architect or engineer to file a renovation permit. If you are, say, replacing a sink in the same place, you do not need a licensed plumber. But if you are adding a sink where there was none before, adding new electrical points, or upgrading the electrical system, your licensed plumber or electrician should file what is known as a mechanics’ permit with the DOB.

chrispetriplumbing | 1 month ago

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I always tell my clients to walk with caution.
Even when you shouldn’t need a permit, the city can find reasons to give you a problem.
How does the city find out? That one time you forgot to waive to your neighbor and now they called the DOB on you.

davidjonson | 1 month ago

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Good questionif you’re not changing the layout or moving plumbing/electrical, most co-ops treat it as a “like-for-like” replacement. Still it’s smart to confirm with your management or board, since older buildings can have hidden code quirks.

Brownstone Home Inspection | 5 months ago

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so first things first. really, any questions like this are best directed to an architect and best not answered by any of us on here, including architects. Second. you use the word “grandfathered”. NOTHING is grandfathered unless it was done legally (built or renovated) and to code under the code the work was done under at the time (so if the the condo had a reno done in 1980 under the 1938 code and it was done legally and all work was done as specified and to code, then the work is grandfathered). If something was done illegally in the past, that could become a problem later if you ever file for a permit or the DOB has reason to enter. The work you are proposing to do now does not “sound” like it requires a permit (generally moving walls, changing window size and location, and egress requires a permit; finish work, including cabinets, does not require a permit). that was a question for an architect, but i think i got it pretty close.

i am a former contractor and have worked in these condos. if you are not moving walls nor moving plumbing fixtures, you “should” not need a permit. If you are changing sinks and faucets but not moving the rough-in in the wall, you “should” be ok. Any plumbing moves further than changing fixtures where they sit now must be directed to a licensed plumber. I would direct questions about any electric to a licensed electrician. know that home improvement contractors (that is what i was) cannot move plumbing fixtures NOR can we do ANY electric work (this includes changing outlets and switches).

by what you say you are doing, you should be fine.

Anyone needed me to review contracts for details, i am starting to do some of that for people. Many of the contracts written by Home Improvement Contractors are lacking detail and the lacking detail allows the contractors an “out” if you end up in court.

Steve
brownstonehomeinspection.com