I'm working on my godfathers kitchen floor. I pulled up the pine floor and in front of the wall which had the stove on top of it has bricks underneath it. Are they structural?
http://cdn.brownstoner.com/4f15892879934-.jpg
I found this under the floor. What was its function and can I remove it. It’s in front of a brick wall in what was the kitchen. It is arched going away from the wall. My God father says the stove was in front of the wall in 1940.
uther88
in Brownstoner Renovation 13 years and 6 months ago
8
Please log in, in order to post replies!
8 replies
dazednconfused2 | 13 years and 6 months ago
P3: A hearth needs to be supported by non-combustible structure. Combustible structure protected by stone (or other material) is not code compliant. I think part of the reasoning is that by separating the wood floor framing from the masonry, you ensure that if there is a big fire, the floor structure can fall without pulling down the masonry walls or chimney, leaving the remaining structure intact. That’s also why wood joists are fire-cut into masonry walls and are not allowed to bear on the chimney masonry at all. I’ve never seen a masonry arch being used for a bathroom floor. I’ve seen smaller sections of joists with a mesh (like you’d see on a plaster wall) laid on top of the joists and filled with cement for a mud set tile, but not masonry arches. But just because I haven’t seen it, doesn’t mean it doesn’t exist. We see all sorts of things we’d never expect to see when we open up walls and floors. It’s one of the most interesting parts of working with old homes. You never know what you’re gonna get, kind of like a box of chocolates.
pigthree | 13 years and 6 months ago
Jim, I ask because I thought the same as you mentioned but recently have heard another theory. Having seen similar (original) brick barrel in the bathroom – it was suggested that this was used to allow a two to four inch mortar bed to allow tile to be laid flush with the finished floor. I know its not relevant to the OP’s situation, but I find the other theory kinda possible
uther88 | 13 years and 6 months ago
This is what I thought it was. Thank you so much for the info. I’m off to pick up the lumber now since there is no fireplace or hearth.
dazednconfused2 | 13 years and 6 months ago
DIBS and Eric are correct. It’s the support for the old hearth stone. It’s a structural brick barrel vault because the hearth is not allowed to sit on top of wood framing for fire safety. It’s standard construction. If there’s no more fireplace and hearth, then you can get rid of it and fill in the gap with wood framing.
eric3872 | 13 years and 6 months ago
It is the hearth base. My house has something similar. You can see it in the cellar underneath the fireplaces. In my case it’s completely shot and the structural integrity of that part of the floor is questionable. Your idea of removing it and adding joists is probably wise but if it is in front of an active stove or fireplace you will need to put down fire rated sheathing over the joists instead of plywood.
uther88 | 13 years and 6 months ago
From the basement you cant see anything but lathe. I’d like to remove it because I’d like to put in joists for the floor. Plus I’m not entirely sure the ceiling below it could take the extra weight of the mortar. Thank you so much for the info. I’m pretty sure it’s a hearth base.
daveinbedstuy | 13 years and 6 months ago
Probably a hearth base. Obviously if there’s nothing above it there; and there isn’t, it isn’t supporting anything and it can be removed. Why bother to remove it if it isn’t protruding? Just level it with mortar.
Townie | 13 years and 6 months ago
You say it is arched? What does it look like from the cellar? Could actually be supporting the chimney in some way. A good mason or engineer would be able to answer your question.