Help! Churches and Noise
We bought a house in Flatbush about two years ago now and have been haunted ever since by the church next door. We expected there would be music/noise during service hours, but this church allows LIVE BANDS to reherse all at night throughout the week. In a room with no sound proofing that’s right next…
We bought a house in Flatbush about two years ago now and have been haunted ever since by the church next door. We expected there would be music/noise during service hours, but this church allows LIVE BANDS to reherse all at night throughout the week. In a room with no sound proofing that’s right next to our living room (and wall of windows).
Sometimes the rehersals go late into the night. More often, they start around 8:00 pm and go right until 11:00. It’s driving us crazy…never mind that the music is terrible (not church music, it’s more like bad, loud jazz): we can’t just hang out in our living room a few nights a week. Forget about summer evenings when the windows are open.
We’ve spoken to the pastor several times–he maintained they were here before us (yes, gentrification plays a role here) and have never bothered anyone before us. He also insisted they aren’t breaking any laws. We had one police officer out who said they had to limit music to service times…and told them so. But then last night a precinct officier called us (after a desperate 311 call) and told us the church isn’t violating any codes or laws.
Could this be true? Could churches be subject to other noise codes than the rest of us? Could it really be legal to have live bands playing loudly a few times a week?
Any advice would be MUCH appreciated. In addition to our sanity, we’re worried about losing our tenant who lives in a small apartment in the back of the house, even closer to the church.
Thanks.
It only cost us $1,000 to have a lawyer write a letter, invisible. Paying for a soundproofed room is a lot more money than that. Tens of thousands.
Rob, there are very few bullets in Bushwick ever. Great loud music though.
Posted by: mopar at March 24, 2010 2:55 PM
Always good to know people’s point of reference of “very few”. Only 25 instances reported according to spotcrime in the last 12mos, not double counting a double homicide. But hey, who’s counting. Having lived in neighborhoods like this, you can count on total shots fired over 3x this.
In regards to the OP, you have your work cut out for you on this one. If you’re looking at spending money to hire a lawyer, why not consider offering to split the cost of making a soundproofed band practice room. You might even be able to write off the costs (donation), and get some church members to kick in labor.
OP here. Whew, clearly this issue struck a chord. Thanks for all the great ideas. Many of them we’ve tried (311, etc) But many of them we haven’t. I think the community board and then a lawyer might be the way to go.
Everyone who mentioned the need for allies is right on. It’s at the heart of the problem: we’re the only house neighboring the church (it’s half on a busy, commercial-ish street, and half on the side street where we are). So some of our neighbors have been sympathetic; one even offered to call 311 on our behalf. But they don’t hear the music (our house buffers it for them). Same problem with the block association, which we helped start. It doesn’t affect others like us so we feel bad about pushing the issue.
I guess what really irks us is the church’s holier than thou attitude. Like they don’t have to respect us because we aren’t members of the congregation, etc. It just blows my mind: as several people suggested, we’ve thought about blasting our own music–my husband’s 1980s industrial collection could come in handy here–but we just wouldn’t intrude on others’ space like that…even as a retaliation.
So the community board and then a lawyer seem like the best next steps. Thanks again for some great ideas.
(And I won’t even waste my time responding to all the crazy accusations that we’re whiny, skinny white kids…which we aren’t. Or that we should have done our homework before buying. Please…).
Call ACORN!
It’s very very hard living near constant noise — that’s why it’s used as a form of torture.
That said, I second UnprotectedWreck’s advice: start with the carrot, then move to the stick. But you can’t fight this alone — you need allies. Try to get to know your neighbors. Now’s a good time of year to do that. Start chatting people up who are out on their stoop or when you see them walking the dog or putting out the garbage. Find out if there’s a block association or listserv. Are any of your neighbors congregants of the church? Is anyone else similarly bothered by the noise? When it’s not just you alone, then it might be possible to approach the minister again and see if you can come to some kind of tolerable compromise.
And if it turns out to be The Church of No, then start a protracted and well-documented program of calling 311, DEP, your local City Council person, the Community Board, the Ombudsman, and the police. Keep a log, write down the names of everyone you talk to, and follow up with letters.
Good luck.
Rob, there are very few bullets in Bushwick ever. Great loud music though.
I live on a very sleepy all residential (almost all single family even) little street in Windsor Terrace and there are at least 4 bands that practice at night in these single family houses, full on amplified bands. They all stop by 11 pm and it is just life in the city, from what I understand. And yes, one of them is my wall-sharing neighbor (though his jazz quartet is pretty good). The other night I read to the background of bad renditions of Creedence Clearwater Revival.
To add to what others are advising I can tell you what I know from our own experience moving into a house where we too were apparently the first residents to care about a good quality of life in our own home — the NYPD are useless in noise complaints. The mayor makes this big announcement a couple years ago about how the city is strengthening the noise code (which they did) like it will make a big difference in our lives, but apparently the NYPD didn’t get the memo. If the cops come out they’ll lie and say the noise is fine because the local precinct cares more about relations with the neighborhood not enforcing quality-of-life laws. So you need to pursue this yourself hiring your own noise expert and attorney. The noise expert to measure the noise, the attorney to simply write a letter to the church telling them they ARE in violation of what’s allowed for noise. And they are from what you say, no question of it. On top of all that you do need to call 311 each time, every time there’s noise so you have a record of it. Supposedly after several calls the city will send their own guy to measure the noise but I’ve heard there’s a long wait for that.
quote:
Whoa nellie, who the f–k is butterfly/rob and what are “marshmaellows” spelled wrong mine you? Bitter man, those is fighting words!
“marshmellows” are what the cops call skinny white kids who move into predominantly minority neighborhoods and then whine about everything that isnt like where they came from in the suburbs.
8rob*