tenant problem

Sexist, no, and I ain’t a dude. It’s all potentially there in what she wrote. At least two of us (we aren’t the same person) came to the same question completely independently (the second comment was posted before the first comment appeared.)

Let’s see, “I did paint before he moved in,” but “right after he and the Ex moved in, I was fixing something in their kitchen and noticed how crappy the paint looked.”

Basically, the paint job you did, or had done, was crappy, as you yourself said. “I offered to repaint their kitchen, more than once, and they kept saying “No, we want to paint ourselves”. I’d guess that your work was such that they didn’t trust you to do any better job the second time.

“I did agree to let him paint because he assured me that he had painting experience, would let me approve the colors, and would do a good job.” “So when he asked me about buying the paint, why would I assume anything but that he wanted to paint himself?”

Why indeed? – because you offered “many times” to repaint the crappy job you did (presumably with you paying for the paint), but they didn’t trust you to do any better job than you did the first time. He was going to paint, but it was at best ambiguous at this point who would be paying for the paint, as you say yourself, “I see now that things should have been discussed more clearly.”

“I do buy my own supplies,” but “I painted his bedroom myself,” and, since this was after he bought the paint, after you agreed to let him paint, presumably you applied the paint that he bought to the walls in the bedroom. So you didn’t buy your own supplies, or if you did, then you didn’t reimburse him for buying them for you.

Ok, maybe I have some of this wrong, but remember, while “perhaps you should get the facts before commenting,”…”I don’t have time to post all of the details.” (So I only know what you’ve told us. Given that you say “this is a complicated situation and I don’t have time to post all of the details,”
I can’t help but wonder what exactly “I’ve been too friendly with the tenants” means. I did think it was odd that you referred to his girlfriend as the “Ex.” Hmmm…)

Yes, you pissed me off, because I posted some very sympathetic and supportive comments above, but then after you let out more and more facts, it became clear that the simple picture you painted with your first post was far from simple (or accurate.) I can see that you need to manipulate the facts here so as to get sympathy (it worked), but it became clear that you are just not upfront or a square dealer, either in your posts here or in dealing with your tenant.

You stared out with “one of my tenants decided that he wanted to paint his apartment and bought paint last winter,” with no mention of the admittedly crappy paint job you did just before he moved in, of your offer “many times” to repaint, or your then agreement to let him paint and to approve the colors, or that “I have told him that I will paint his apartment, on my own schedule, and have not made any promises.” (Huh? “I have told him that I will paint his apartment” sounds like a promise to me…)

I’ve never had a landlord who raised my rent by a big chunk – ever. (And thus certainly never because they wanted me to move out.) Your “normally I raise the rents $50 per year, except when need to make a market adjustment, or I want a tenant to move” says it all. No one “has” to make a market adjustment on an existing tenant – that just means is that as the landlord, you can get more now, so you will. That’s your choice, but *smart* landlords do the big jumps *between* tenants, so as to keep their existing tenants happy.

I always moved because I was ready to move on to a bigger or better place. I was a good tenant when I rented, because I *do* have some skills – I can see that when someone gets angry at me, there is usually some cause to it – I’m not stupid enough to believe it is all them and not me, not the interaction that exists between the two of us. You can’t see that it is a two-way dynamic – no, it is all his fault, as you keep insisting, over and over again, in your posts.

All I’m saying, is given all you’ve said, it is very obvious to me why your tenant is angry with you (even without knowing what else went on between you). A reasonable paint job is not an unreasonable expectation from a market-rate tenant. You didn’t provide it. You muddied up the painting thing terribly, then decided it was all his fault.

You told us “I decided to go month to month rather than give him another lease.” Then you say “I didn’t refuse to give him a lease, just didn’t give him one, and he didn’t ask for one” – as if that matters, when you had already *decided* not to give him one, and made that clear by not giving him one.

I’m not excusing any of his behavior that was inappropriate, and I do think you will have to end his tenancy – but then why not just do it? Why mess around with more poor communication by raising his rent instead? Especially when he sounds like he can afford the increase? No wonder you keep escalating things with your letters to him – you can’t bring yourself to just come out and directly end his tenancy. Why not? (Because you aren’t willing to give up his rent, I suspect. At the very least, the place would remain empty for a few days because you clearly need to paint.)

And if you can’t see that you are a part of what happened, then you do lack certain communication skills. Keep manipulating the facts to get sympathy from people without all the facts, and you’ll never learn any.

Yes, you aren’t required to paint – not ever, I don’t think, in a non-stabilized unit, unless there is lead paint peeling off the walls. That doesn’t mean it isn’t smart to give market rate tenants a decent paint job before they move in. If you can’t do a good job yourself, why don’t you pay someone? Are you too cheap? (I know you are getting estimates now, but 2 years later? A little late, given all the water under the bridge.) Besides, you want him to move. What are you going to do, raise his rent $350 every month until he does? Oh, that’s real smart.

You do have all the power here – you don’t have to paint, you don’t have to give him a renewal lease, you can raise his rent as much as you want, as often as you want (OK, every 30 days), and you can end his tenancy any time on 30 days notice. You should at least recognize, as good landlords do, that you have all the power here, and deal more clearly and directly with your tenant. After saying you’d paint, and then saying “I have not made any promises,” you aren’t being clear or even-handed with him.

Oh, and then there’s “the building is actually losing money because of major improvements I made.” My guess is that these improvements benefit you far more than your tenant, as you won’t even pay for a decent paint job in his apartment. You are taking in rent and using it to improve your building – the building is not losing money, you are reinvesting the money you earn on it in improvements. (Oh, poor me, I’m fixing up my place and I’m losing money!)

Flora- so sorry you get to deal with the flamers. And it was probably best to get your info from housing court- they’re the experts. Of course as a tenant my advice is probably not helpful but for what its worth- give the guy 30 days notice and be rid of him. He sounds off the wall, and out of control. I don’t see him being able to ratchet it down despite his being completely in the wrong. His girlfriend may have had a good reason for leaving. Once they start making threats, you’re done. No one has the right to threaten you or harass or try to frighten you- especially not in your own home. I’m sure you won’t have any problem finding another, and better tenant.

guest at July 8, 2008 1:22 AM: The issues are far too complicated to explain here, and since you have some kind of problem with artists, you probably wouldn’t listen anyway. Let’s just say you don’t get it and leave it at that.

guest at July 8, 2008 1:35 AM: I raised his rent AFTER the nasty phone calls, nasty emails, threats and harassment, not before. Perhaps you should get the facts before commenting

vanburenproud at July 8, 2008 8:04 AM: Thanks for your input, you do seem to know more about this landlording business than anyone else.
As far as my personality though, I have often been accused of being too direct and blunt, not ambiguous. It might seem that way on this blog though because this is a complicated situation and I don’t have time to post all of the details.

bxgrl at July 8, 2008 9:39 AM: I raised his rent after the nasty phone calls, nasty emails, threats and harassment. His girlfriend moved out last fall, so I don’t think that’s the reason for his current rage, he may have gotten dumped again, but I don’t really know.

guest at July 8, 2008 11:35 AM: I’ve been a landlord for 12 years and never had a situation like this so I have to say your judgmental and hostile post is also completely wrong, without bothering to address the rest of your insults, except to say I *totally* agree that you lack the needed skills to be a landlord.

guest at July 8, 2008 12:05 PM: I’m noticing that all the real jerks sign in as “guest”.
I. I did paint before he moved in.
2.I do buy my own supplies.
3.Oh yes there can be “just one mouse”,there was only one in 12 years, I caught it in a sticky trap and there has not been a single mouse in the building since then, over a year ago.
4. I didn’t refuse to give him a lease, just didn’t give him one, and he didn’t ask for one. Thank god didn’t, it would be much harder to get him out if he had a lease.
5. Normally I raise the rents $50 per year, except when need to make a market adjustment, or I want a tenant to move.
6. I never said they did.
7. You haven’t seen the apartment, for the most part it looks fine and I am totally willing to repaint the areas that need it, but the tenant has to cooperate, which he does not.
8. You really do not know what you’re talking about.
9. Ditto. I’m laughing out loud at this one, Just because I’m lucky enough to have work that I love doesn’t mean I don’t have to work for a living, I work very hard.

guest at July 8, 2008 12:14 PM: You’ve never had a landlord as good as me, ever.

guest at July 8, 2008 12:51 PM: You take things out of context and twist the truth.

guest at July 8, 2008 1:08 PM: agreed

bxgrl at July 8, 2008 1:31 PM: Good points.

guest at July 8, 2008 1:47 PM: Wrong again. I have tried to talk to the tenant, when I do, he yells. gets right in my face in a threatening way, insults me, makes b.s. accusations and threats. So I stopped. I have told him I’d be happy to talk to him if he can be reasonably calm and civil, but he can’t.
And you’re totally wrong about my source of income, the building is actually losing money because of major improvements I made. My art is my source of income.

bxgrl at July 8, 2008 1:53 PM: right again

guest at July 8, 2008 2:41 PM: So pathetic that when you disagree with someone and basically have nothing at all useful to say, you just resort to name calling.

Okay, kids, I’m done here. My original question, can the tenant deduct this money from his rent, was not answered here, but by the housing court.
And my second question, what would you landlords do if you had a nasty tenant who refused to pay rent, was never answered by anyone.
I realize that these forums are infested with flamers like the rest of the internet so I expected a lot of stupid, pointless insulting posts, and I was not disappointed.
But I also heard some thoughtful responses from people and I thank you all.