cost of renovations
hi all, i wrote a while back about a brownstone we were thinking of buying that needed renovating and i wanted advice on costs….well the situation was a bit complex in the sense we found the brownstone one day as we were walking through the neighborhood and contacted the owner who was a developer. We…
hi all,
i wrote a while back about a brownstone we were thinking of buying that needed renovating and i wanted advice on costs….well the situation was a bit complex in the sense we found the brownstone one day as we were walking through the neighborhood and contacted the owner who was a developer. We proposed we would buy the house off them but we would want them to renovate the house to our taste and layout. We agreed on the price of the house “as-is” and then trusted the developer to do the plumbing,electricity, facade work…all generic work that was work that the house needed that wouldn’t affect him selling the house to another buyer if we backed out (we didn’t sign any contracts) anyway to cut a long story short, the generic work is finished and now we are going to sign and start choosing our finishes/flooring/kitchens etc. He slapped on 200k and said that would be the final sale price for the house completely finished and ready to move in.
My question is to you guys out there who have been through this…is that reasonable? It is a 4 story 3000 sq foot brownstone,the work that has been done is as follows:
– 18 new windows,
– stoop steps replaced and new iron work post thingys at the entrance to the steps
– front door stripped and painted
– new electricity, plumbing and boiler
– 1 new working fireplace
– 3 new bathrooms
– 3 new kitchens
– new flooring in one room, but re-finishing all wood floors and stairs
– stripping and re-painting all floors and ceiling
– exposing brick walls in one room
– knocking a few walls down
– restoring and insulating a sun room extension on garden
it seems reasonable to me for the amount of work but wondered if you had any advice…
we are also going to be paying 965k for this property, it’s very near the A/C subway on the border of clinton hill and bed stuy…it’s our first house and was just wondering your general thoughts on whether this is a good average price for this neighboorhood?
How did you approach the owner? It sounds like the ideal situation. I agree with you that all we’re seeing is buildings that have cheap renovations and awkward floorplans.
My mother is looking to rent an apartment.
Problem is, how does one determine ‘real crap’? The bulk of modern condominium apartments appear to be built out of absolute junk, yet command prices per sq. ft. far higher than the majority of brownstones.
Good quality in a brownstone does not have to mean original details etc.
You do make some good points regarding price and what’s out there. believe me, I know. Yes, most of the “renovated” stuff is real crap and is available at a cheaper price. There is a severe lack of anything on the market that’s good quality in Bed Stuy and by good quality I mean both beautiful intact architectural detail and a good quality restoration/renovation.
I don’t know that particular area but if you are really comfortable with it then a 4 storey house with 2 rental units for $965 might not be too high given that you believe, once the work is done, that you will have everything that you want. I know I would sell my three storey on Stuyvesant near Halsey for about $100k less than that….all nicely renovated, deck, landscaped, 5 min walk to the A train, etc. But that’s what’s intetresting about BS, it’s very large, very diverse and very hard to compare properties.
How are you renting the top and bottom while living in the middle? Internal spiral staircase?
thanks for your advice…
the finished cost of the house is 965k with ALL the work and appliances included.
It really is on the border – 5 mins from the A/C subway at Franklin avenue.
The owner is definitely not an amateur and we have seen one other house he is doing – actually before we sign i am going to ask to see one more completed so i can see the quality of finished baths,floors and kitchens.We have seen the progress of the house every 2 weeks and go to look at it with our architects. It is being changed from an SRO to 3 family so it is all above board with permits and licensed tradesmen. The total price also includes new roof and the C of O. We will be handpicking all the finishes.
What i am going to do is go there with a friend who is in real estate and get his advice as well as asking the owner to see 1 more completed house he’s done.We’re putting alot of our savings into this deposit and want to make sure we are 100 percent.
my main view is this….we have been looking at brownstones in the area which have been renovated and are definitely going for less however the developers have ruined them with cheap finishes, hideous kitchens, bad layouts and ruined original details. The beauty of this is that we have dictated the layout (we want to live on the parlour floor and 1st floor and rent out top floor and ground floor with basement) and we are going to dictate all the finishes and we have kept ALL the original details of the house.
anyway thanks readers for your advice and pls keep it coming!!!
I would echo a few previous points. You want to be assured that the work was carried out according to NYC building code, is approved by DOB (work permit) and that you get the “sign-offs” and a CO. The question of the cost is related to the quality of the finishes and workmanship. On the surface it sounds like you had a large scope of work and 200k may not be unreasonable. But if the finishes are the lowest quality, then it may be too high. worse yet, you may end up with fixtures and finishes that don’t last and would need to be replaced again in the future.
There are real estate sites like Street Easy to review comparable sales in the area.
if this “owner” a registered general contractor with nyc? or is this an owner who is fixin’ up their place to sell it and retire? in other words, is this a professional or an amateur?
http://bit.ly/f4GcIe
the finishes dictate the price. i am assuming $200k gets you a very low-mid level type of fixtures, finishes, cabinets, etc. On the surface it does not sound bad, there is just much more devil in the details than you are describing. Are the main load bearing walls being opened up and a large beam run through to enjoy the whole width of the house (i assume it is 20ft wide 3 floor @3000sf). A Kitchen could cost $40k or $140k. Skim coat or just paint over 29 coats of existing paint?
“the border of bed stuy” i take as bed stuy. So its $965 plus $200 for bed stuy? yes, that sounds pretty high to me.
I would definitely check out previous work that the developer has completed and even contact his previous references. I would also add in a clause that would allow you to hand pick the finishes (windows, walls, doors, floors, appliances etc…). Developers do tend to attempt to maximize their profits and install the cheapest/low end finishes possible. This area is also still under going gentrification and I probably wouldn’t send my kids to a school in clinton hill or bed stuy, but i would have to agree it would be a great investment down the road.