Building Code Issue re: Cellar
I would like know if the building code has a clear opinion about this: This is a two family, the garden floor for rental and the duplex upstairs. I want to renovate the cellar and make a direct access from the duplex to the cellar. The garden apartment wont have access to the cellar. I…
I would like know if the building code has a clear opinion about this: This is a two family, the garden floor for rental and the duplex upstairs. I want to renovate the cellar and make a direct access from the duplex to the cellar. The garden apartment wont have access to the cellar.
I would like to remove the walls enclosing the stairs. The boiler will have a brick wall room and a fire door.
Do we need any type of fire door between the cellar and the rest of the house? Again, the boiler room will be enclosed in a room with a fire door.
The idea is to make the access to the cellar as open as possible, right now with all the doors and walls is not really welcoming. What the code of the DOB is saying about that?
And yes, when I decide to do the job I will hire an architect and a licensed and insured contractor but I don’t have any of them yet to ask questions. Before hiring anybody, I would like to know the DOB limitations about walls and fire doors separating the cellar and the rest of the house.
OP – the general point of fire enclosures is to keep fire from spreading between occupant spaces. Therefore, one apartment is fire separated from another and both are fire separated from the means of egress (stair hall).
If you were to introduce a stair that wasn’t a means of egress (convenience stair) it can be open to the unit above.
The big question is this: Are the stairs far enough back from the entrance so that you can separate them from the garden apartment entrance? If all the stairs are completely within one unit (and the other unit has egress to the street) you could conceivably have the entire stair open, as it would be part of the apartment and not the stair hall.
Thats a hard concept to explain, drawing would be better!
Anyway, it depends on your hall/entry layout – I imagine your stairs being pretty close to the front door which would make that hard….
I’m sorry but maybe I’m confused:
You want to create access from the upstairs unit to the cellar, without permitting access to the garden apartment in between.
Forget about code, how would this be possible without closing off the stairs?
The stairs start at the second floor, traverse the first floor without opening up to it, and terminate in the cellar correct?
If these stairs are open, wouldn’t then the cellar be open to the first floor and therefore the second floor? Perhaps I have misread…
Anyway – the architect above is correct. Depends on the code (probably 38 in your case) the building type etc etc. Also depends on whether the stair to the cellar is a convenience stair or part of the egress system…When you hire the architect and he/she looks at the actual conditions, it should be pretty cut and dry. 2 family house code is much more flexible than Multiple dwelling (3+families)
Good luck.
ML is a traditionalist who does not like painted woodwork ;), though his caveat about digging is well founded. Why wouldn’t one want to make a space ‘welcoming?’
OP, I’m confused as to why, since you intend to do this by the book, you don’t just ask these q’s when selecting an architect. Much easier. Also, logic does not necessarily apply to building codes.
In single and two family homes a lot of the cellar construction classification and seperation requirements are much much more lenient and need not be enclosed but there are a couple of issues. It does not need to be enclosed since it is only a 2 family but you will need a fire seperation between the garden apatment and the other apartment.
Note: MDL regulations do not apply at all but egress issues may change you to your proposed reconfiguration
why do you wish to make your cellar more “welcoming”? cellars are dark, dank, uninhabitable voids that help lift the rest of the house away from the damp and provide utilitarian space for mechanical equipment. The trend of making these dungeons into rec rooms or whatever is unfortunate. They are not in any way supposed to be inhabitable. Efforts to increase the ceiling height by excavating can result in diaster like what happened at 329 MacDonnough Street. Any work like that requires a specialist contractor licensed for foundation work.
And of course you will need a door to separate the cellar from the rest of the house, and no, you cannot remove the walls around the stair.
Thanks for all the comments.
I am responding all the questions.
–The house if from 1899
–The boiler room will have fresh air, directly vented through the back of the cellar.
–The cellar will be just used by the duplex (parlor and second floor). Between the cellar and the parlor floor there is a garden floor apartment, completely separated of the cellar and the parlor floor
Again, if the boiler (gas) and hot water room is completely enclosed in a room with a fire door, do I need any other fire door between the cellar and the rest of the house. After the renovation the cellar will be a recreational room, clean and not a dusty cellar anymore.
If the boiler room is completely fireproofed, is there any DOB regulation that talks about additional walls or additional fire doors? What is the whole point about the fire door, I assume to limit the damage in case of a fire. If the boiler room, the only element that can create a fire in the cellar, is locked, what is the point about more walls and more fire doors?
First question with any existing building
1 -What code is it under? pre-code, 1938, 1968 or 2008?
2- What is the value of the work?
Before you answer those two questions, you can not answer any questions because you don’t know which code applies.
BTW, one architect speaking here with thirty years plus of NYC experience
it has been our experience that the DOB will require you to put a wall and fire rated door seperating the cellar from the rest of the house. This can be done via a wall in the cellar and not on the garden level if that is more pleasing. This also (in a one or two family house) does away with the boiler room requirent and if you do not hav ea boiler room you do not have to provide fresh air (although i still think it is a good idea.
You will have to provide fresh air to the boiler room.