Steam Heat on Top Floor
Please help figure out my steam-heat system. If you, or someone you know of someone who can help solve this problem, please send them my way. Situation: 3rd floor of a 3-story building gets little heat. Steam heat. Radiators on each floor. Thermostat is on 1st floor. Thermostat on first floor is set to 74…
Please help figure out my steam-heat system. If you, or someone you know of someone who can help solve this problem, please send them my way.
Situation:
3rd floor of a 3-story building gets little heat.
Steam heat.
Radiators on each floor.
Thermostat is on 1st floor.
Thermostat on first floor is set to 74 degrees, and the 1st and 2nd floors get to that temperature very quickly.
The 3rd floor only goes to 70 degrees after about an hour or more. The 1st floor needs to keep a door opened to let in cold air (even in the most freezing times of winter) to keep the thermostat thinking its cold inside so that the heat stays on so that the 3rd floor gets heat!
This is a waste of heat and money.
After some research, (I think that) the issues to (perhaps) consider include:
Should the risers be insulated?
How much water needs to be in the boiler?
Why would moving the thermostat to the 3rd floor help? It would still burn the same amount of gas to get the proper heat on the 3rd floor, right? Explain please why this would make proper sense.
Why are there two pressuretrols on my boiler? (are they both necessary or did someone else do a bad job on the installation?)
I’ve been told the pressure on the boiler should be low. But exactly what should the pressure be on a steam heat system (in PSI) and what should the differential be in PSI?
Should I remove a radiator or two from the first floor?
Thank you to all of you who have called thus far (I had this posted elsewhere). I have had perhaps half a dozen plumbers and heating ‘experts’ call me and tell me to just play with and change the valves on the radiators.
‘Playing with the valves’ is not the answer, however. The valves are clean, and of the correct sizing on each floor.
Nor is increasing the pressure on the pressuretrol(s). The pressure is low as it should be. Making it higher is not the solution as far as I know. The pressure has been increased before to no avail.
Thank you so much.
Dave
seven one eight – three one two – nine four seven one
Sizing the boiler to the system has a lot to do with how well the whole thing will work in the future.
I had similiar problems and installed vari-valves in an attempt to get the top floor warm without overheating the lower floors. It was slightly better but not great. Finally after the external gas igniter (it was an oil boiler converted to gas)died, my plumber suggested changed the boiler which I did. I had mistakenly assumed that the boiler is merely a large pot of water and really didn’t need replacing. Was I wrong! After the new boiler the qaulity of the heat was so much improved. No more spikes between too cold and too hot – quick repsonse time – more even heat and better distribution. The top floor is still not as warm as the lower floors but it is a vast improvement. There is also no more clanking as the rising steam fights with the condensate going down.
Thanks, MasterP…..
-SteamMan
Replace the air vents at the bottom of your risers with Gorton Air Eliminators (don’t let their cartoonish size scare you), and replace the valves on your third floor with Varivalves – they blow the doors off of even the biggest Gorton vents for getting steam to far away places. If you want to get fancy, and/or you have issues with one side of the house getting too hot due to sun exposure, consider Danfoss adjustable vents for the lower floors, which have a control knob with numbers which makes it easy to adjust on the fly.
You may want to have masterplvmer come by to make sure there is nothing ridiculous going on, but eventually the only way to get it right is by changing up the valves yourself until the balance is just so – and it takes time to work it out so that it’s stable over a variety of outside temps.
Sounds to me like the biggest issue is the size of the openings on the vents (which is probably what was meant by “playing with the vents” – not cleaning them. If you have vents with smaller openings on the lower floors and bigger openings on higher floors (or just farther from the boiler), that should serve to even out the heat. The steam is essentially pulled toward the bigger escape openings. The less expensive vents out there have a fixed size opening, but there are some variable sized opening vents on the market. If you get the variable ones, you can play around with how big the openings are until you get the optimal balance.
Good luck.
So, if my guys came and did something that didn’t solve the problem, why didn’t you call and state that? Balancing is a often a process and there is rarely ever a quick fix, as I said.
Anyway, you’ve called a lot of plumbers and are asking for more because you prefer not to wait a week. I strongly suggest you pick a heating contractor you trust and give him some room to do his thing.
For the record, we’ve got a lot of people calling with no heat/hot water or need boiler replacements now before it gets too cold. We have to prioritize them over balancing and maintenance issues.
Thanks for calling.
Give Hlad a call. He helped me. My issue now relates to drafty skylights I think… It’s always something…
Master Plumber,
I called to schedule an appointment. The earliest Gateway can come is exactly a week from now; good in that it shows that your company is busy, bad in that its a week from now.
I’ve used Gateway before, (last year) and as I recall a few men came and inspected the valves and put in new ones. This did NOT solve the problem unfortunately, but I presume was a start.
If you know of a way to get someone trustworthy and knowledgeable onsite sooner, please assist.
Thank you.
Dave
My phone is seven one eight-312-9471
like mp said, you are probably short cycling, i.e. the boiler is meeting pressure before the steam has a chance to meet the top floor’s needs…you probably need to resize the vents on all floors… i would highly recommend gateway, since they are a really knowledgeable outfit, or i can take a look for a pro bono consultation..if interested email me @ errol832000@yahoo.com