remove fire escape, install sprinklers?
Although this topic has been discussed many times before, I’m still not clear on the fire escape vs. sprinkler issue. This is my situation: I have a legal 3 family brick multiple dwelling. The building was gut renovated in the late 30’s and brought up to the multiple dwelling code at the time. It has…
Although this topic has been discussed many times before, I’m still not clear on the fire escape vs. sprinkler issue.
This is my situation:
I have a legal 3 family brick multiple dwelling. The building was gut renovated in the late 30’s and brought up to the multiple dwelling code at the time. It has self closing metal doors, metal stairs with marble treads, and a metal ladder to the roof-hatch.
There is a first escape in the front of the building. For aesthetic and security reasons I would like to remove the fire escape and was wondering if I can simply spinkler the hallway?
Wouldn’t that mean only one means of egress? Or does a hallway sprinkler override that requirement?
thanks!
OP here. Thanks again for the replies, but I’m still as confused as I was before.
guest 10:12AM, I will review the section 27-120 of the NYC Building Code (link):
http://www.nyc.gov/html/dob/downloads/bldgs_code/bc27s1.pdf
I realize finding the right architect is probably the best thing to do, but for the sake of sharing information I think this topic may be helpful for others in the future.
I’m curious to know how a Class A Multiple Dwelling is different from a Converted Multiple Dwelling? I assume both meet code requirements, but only a Converted MD can have sprinklers and just one exit?
Renovations to pre-1968 buildings are permitted under the 1938 code within cost limitations. The 1968 code permits alterations to multiple dwellings without regard to cost. The 1968 code also permits conversions of existing buildings to multiple dwellings under the 1938 code. Current codes do not apply. For reference purposes, this is section 27-120 of the NYC Building Code.
A converted multiple dwelling is a house that was converted to a multiple dwelling.If the CO says it is converted, it is. Otherwise, you need two exits from the floor.
Almost everyone on this posting needs to get an architect who is familiar with the 1938 building code, 1968 building code, NYS Multiple Dwelling Law and NYC Housing Maintenace Code. If they aren’t and they don’t know the above mentioned section, they either need to learn very fast or should stick to their area of expertise.
Signed
Been there, done that, have the c.o.’s to show for it!
I just did this on my condo conversion of my 3 family. My architect said that if its a complete reno u must have sprinkler system in the stairwell leading out of the house, thats it. I got rid of my fire escape completely. Figure 3000 per floor two heads each. Thats about what I paid. Then thier is the tow inch watermain to be installed and new meter figure 5K more
this would cost tons of money. as it stands consider yourself lucky that you’re grandfathered with the sprinkler. unless you want to spend lots of money, tearing up your house and the sidewalk in front to put in a required new waterline.
Fire escapes are no longer allowed in current code. You’d need a fully sprinklered stairway, and as you point out the stair must be non-combustible.
thanks the replies!
My 1938 CO indicates:
Total Three (3) families
Class A Multiple Dwelling
What confuses me is that there are many posts stating you would need a fire escape OR a sprinklered hallway if you are converting from a 1-2 family to a 3+.
Why is this different when working with an existing multiple dwelling? What is “converted” vs. not?
Also, I think my building is a bit more fire resistant with the metal doors, metal stairs, marble treads, etc then a converted building which I assume would have the usual wooden stairs, treads and doors. But I suppose this may help my case when reviewed by the Borough Commissioner.
You could consider removing the fire escape if the main means of egress were properly sprinklered. You would need to apply for a preconsideration from the DoB for this though because it’s done on a case by case basis, and is at the discretion of the Borough Commissioner.
See your certificate of occupancy. If you are classified as a converted multiple dwelling. If you are not classified as such, enjoy your fire escape because it must be there. If you are a converted multiple dwelling, see your architect.