How long for a gut renov?
We are considering buying a 4 story brownstone in Brooklyn. The details of the house remain in tact, but the house needs a ton of work. For example, it needs all new plumbing and electrical. How long would it take (realistically) to put in new plumbing/electrical? Additionally, we would be putting in new kitchens (triplex…
We are considering buying a 4 story brownstone in Brooklyn. The details of the house remain in tact, but the house needs a ton of work. For example, it needs all new plumbing and electrical. How long would it take (realistically) to put in new plumbing/electrical? Additionally, we would be putting in new kitchens (triplex and in ground floor rental) and redoing the bathrooms. We are wondering how long it would be until we could move into the house. We are not talking about the house being completed. Rather, simply livable (ie the plumbing works and the electrical has been redone). Then, when the contrators work on the kitchens/bathrooms and whatever else we want/need done, we would be in the house.
Also, total cost of redoing plumbing/electrical (disregarding the cost of renovating/adding kitchens/bathrooms).
Lastly, the house has “forced hot air” (and thus extensive ductwork). Is it possible to utilize these ducts for central air conditioning? If so, what is the cost to add central air?
thanks!
To Anonymous 12:57,
The OP was talking about buying the place for $2.0 mm and putting in $400K. Add in soft costs (paying the mortgage for a year before you move in) and you’re talking about a $2.5 million house. At that price point, you don’t have much choice other than to go top of the lien on the reno.
From my past experience on the architecture/design side of this type of work, here’s my take on your project:
TIME-I would allow 10-12 months for construction. I am assuming you are planning to replace all the electrical/plumbing risers and branch lines along with associated architectural wall framing, finishes, lighting , etc.
MONEY-especially for projects dealing with the inherent systems of the building (electrical,plumbing, HVAC) I would count on spending 150$-200$/sf s a baseline cost. Admittedly, simple wall/sheetrock work is not very expensive, but kitchen/bath areas with associated plumbing/electrical work will certainly soak up more funds.
LIVABILITY- I would advise not moving in until work is complete if at all possible. It will save you some stress and allow workers to generally move quicker. At the most, I would limit work being dome while you are in the house to minor finish work; door trim,baseboard, touch up painting, lighting fixture installation, in general “non-dust-creating” work if possible.
AC-a little hard to say with certainty you can re-use the existing ductwork without seeing it, but I expect you could add a condenser and air handler to get some AC. I would allow 25-30K. Incidentally, is the ductwork exposed or in the existing ceiling space? Just another consideration in terms of cost with the reno if you need to re-route some lines based on new partition layout.
Hope this helps. If you are interested, I could arrange to see the house with you along with a contractor I have worked with who could give some more detailed input on project cost, and possibly find some ways to economize the process.
Best of luck!
People on this forum will tell you differently, but 500,000 should be more than enough to do the work you mention. It depends on whether you need top of the line stuff, or just good quality that will last without being anything fancy (and that won’t impress your neighbors). The cost of renovating bathrooms really varies — if you are simply keeping the fixtures in more or less the same place and re-tiling and painting, it’s much cheaper than building from scratch. And takes much less time.
9 months for a gut reno sounds to short and $300k would handle about 1/2 to 2/3rd’s of what you’re proposing unless you’re doing a lot of it yourself. If you’re in a lnadmark neighborhood, add on another 3-4 months.
Well, it is me again. I must refer you to a wonderful man, Norman Calvo, of Universal Mortgage -(212) 401-0840 . He would be happy to discuss how you could do the financing. In my case, it was 2 years ago and I was fortunate enough (truly..who knew this would happen, really…) that the house appreciated in a year without a real move in interest rates so I could refinance and get money for the renovation but depending on your situation and the house, there could be other options.
Norman is a very intelligent, very good person, relentlessly cheerful and helped me do a number of things. I am sure he will be happy to just talk; he is a mortgage banker, by the way, not just a broker so he can originate loans himself.
Good luck to you.
Original Poster here – fair enough. I was just trying to save paying rent in the interim, but if we that doesn’t make sense, then we can’t do that. Another question – what is the best way to finance a gut renovation? Suppose total cost of renovation will be $500K (is that doable for all elect/plumbing, redoing 2 kitchens and 3 bathrooms?) Also, suppose price = $2Million and we have $400K cash to put down. What is the best way (factoring in tax deductions and interest rates, etc…) to buy the house and pay for renovations?
thanks
Oh, to the original poster…. As a person who also tried — briefly, like 3 weeks — to live in a construction site, let me tell you this is definately not a good idea. At one point I was trying to live on the ground floor while the place was being worked on (Parlor floor and other things being worked on simultaneously) and I was covered in plaster dust constantly, I was breathing it, coughing and let’s just say dressing for success was a challenge. I was a walking plaster cloud. Dust goes everywhere. You really can’t live in a place until you have a functioning kitchen, either. You can try, but you will miss civilization. My tenants (living in top apartment while the rest of the building was being renovated) were always on the verge of staging a revolt. Suffice it to say, you need to get a place nearby, small and cheap is fine and better than trying to live in it. You could go nuts. I am not a primadonna either, I don’t mind camping. I lived in a number of campsites during my renovation, just living in the midst of it is not recommended.
If you are planning an extensive renovation, you are really better off just waiting until the entire house is completed, instead of trying to move in as soon as possible. The 3 or 4 months, if that, of extra rent is well worth it. It will take more time to do the renovation if workers are working around living space, and the mess will be constant. It may be possible to have work in the rental apt. continue while you live in the triplex, however, but most contractors will work on the whole building at the same time.
The 9 months is a good estimate, to be safe. The process can certainly be dragged out much longer, so alot depends on you being fast and firm with decisions, and the contractor finding no major “surprises” as walls are opened up.
Dear Anon 11:36. This is no joke. Please tell me your contractor. 9 months is FAST. 300,000 for a 9 month gut reno is amazing. I did things on the cheap, and with tenants in my 3 family, ultimately gut renovating 3 out of 4 floors and it cost me less but just the duplex took close to a year. Admittedly, getting a relatively inexpensive contractor means more mistakes for the inexperienced owner (God, did I learn…), but 9 months is amazingly fast amount of time to rip apart a building, put in all new plumbing, kitchens, floors?, bathrooms.
Like I said, please let me know your contractor. I want to buy another place (if we ever get this real estate bust everyone has been predicting….). Thanks