the chicken's Profile
- the chicken
- not yet
- 2007
- Manhattan
- Victorian Flatbush
- Rental
- Male
- 35
Author's Posts
August 17, 2009
Renovation on the cheap
Regular readers will know that I am a Brit living in Brooklyn (kind of) but I also still have a modest house in London. Even regularer readers will also know that I am shocked by estimates that are bandied about for renovation in NY. For example, people talk about $20-30,000 just for a kitchen where nothing needs to be moved. I’m particularly shocked because I consider London to be fairly comparable to NYC in cost for many things – there are differences but it broadly comes out in the wash. This is not like Thailand where you can get an entire house built for $20k. Labour rates and materials should not be that different between these two cities.
Here’s a summary of work I’m getting done that’s nearly finished – for $35k at the current exchange rate. All of the workers have been English and legal (no cheating with illegal cheap Polish labour or skirting the authorities). The brief was “high-end of budget but with good quality finishes for a nice effect” (think maybe one notch above Ikea, which I do think is decent quality if put together properly and excellent value for money).
Obviously, going with higher end materials would have added to the cost but would not be in keeping with the type of house and area it is in. All this work is being done to help to sell the property but if it doesn’t sell or I decide to keep it, I wanted it to of a standard that I would be happy living with. The purists will not be happy with the non-original styling but I’m blending practicality and pragmatism – plus originality costs! There’s also enough original detail in the rest of the house.
If I was even remotely organised, I would have taken some “before” pictures so you could see the comparison. But I’m not so you can’t….so there!
Kitchen
http://imgur.com/oVqez.jpg
The kitchen occupies the same physical space as the old kitchen but with a different layout. The doorway is where a large window used to be. The hole you can just see to the left used to be the entrance to the kitchen but the lower half has been blocked off to create a serving hatch to the dining room. The hole on the right under the counter to the left of the sink is for the dishwasher (which I never use but seems to be a perquisite these days). The countertop is rustic beech – one of the cheaper woods but has a real quality look and feel in the thicker option.
Here’s a closer look at the sink http://imgur.com/dF3ie.jpg with freshly oiled worktop. It doesn’t show up very well in the picture but the tiles have a slightly bevelled edge. I love the look of these tiles so they are the ones I would go for regardless of price so it’s a bonus that they are one of the cheapest ones out there. I went with a more expensive sink and tap unit because I think it is something stands out in a kitchen - $500 of the budget went on this.
Conservatory
http://imgur.com/bdJjj.jpg
This was originally outside the house with the wall on the left being the boundary wall for the garden. Before I bought the house, it had a cheap plastic roof put on so it could be used as a laundry room. The doorway at the end was originally the window for the room at the end. Because I was doing it on the cheap, the opening for this and the kitchen on the right were only done to the width of the windows so as to not have to change the lintels. The left wall had to be insulated, sheetrocked and skim plastered. The floor in the conservatory had to be raised to the height of the adjacent rooms with boards and self-levelling concrete before the tiles could go down. Floor tiles really eat into a budget if you’ve got a large area to cover. These ones were the cheapest I found that didn’t look cheap but the overall floor area meant that $650 of the budget went on this.
Next, we have the real killer expense for the whole reno – the roof. http://imgur.com/HS5uY.jpg Because of the large glass area and the easterly aspect, the room would get very warm during the day. To counter this, we used double-glazed argon-filled panels (the house is also near an airport so sound-proofing is important). That’s $6,000 of glass panels right there.
Bathroom
http://imgur.com/uES3m.jpg
The house is a turn of the century Victorian and originally did not have an indoor bathroom at all. There was a downstairs bathroom when we bought it but none upstairs where the bedrooms are – not ideal for a family house and really puts potential buyers off. The master bedroom at the front of the house was very large by London standards so we carved out about a third of it for the bathroom. The room was boxed in, sheetrocked and plastered. The bath is an enamelled steel one – plastic ones, which are fairly popular over here, really are a false economy. Because this was not a bathroom before, all new plumbing had to be installed from the boiler at the back of the house (behind the camera in the conservatory picture) to the front of the house where this is – no small job in itself. I went with the same tiles as for the kitchen which somehow give a very different feeling when it covers the whole wall (these are very versatile tiles!). Here’s a picture of the sink http://imgur.com/kKrgu.jpg (mirrored cabinet and vanity light to come) and the towel rail http://imgur.com/Q86pR.jpg . Not really much more I can say about bathrooms really – I’m not an aficionado and if it does the job then it’s fine for me.
Because the other bathroom is at the back of the house and this one is at the front, we had to install a new soil pipe. Fortunately we didn’t have to go outside my boundary line to access the central sewer line or there’d be a whole load of extra work and paperwork but it was still no walk in the park – the earth piled up against the wall is what had to come out of the ground. http://imgur.com/I95Pd.jpg
So that’s it basically. I can’t claim that it’s the best kitchen and bathroom reno in the world but I’m happy with it and the price is right!
January 30, 2009
ICF houses?
Have you, or anyone you know, built a house out of ICF (insulated concrete form) in NY or Brooklyn? I stumbled across a website, found the idea fascinating, and kicking a few ideas around in my head.
I’d heard of poured concrete houses in post-war Britain and had negative associations with it but this sounds like a different kettle of fish. Apparently 8% of US houses are built with this method so hopefully someone has come across it.
I like the idea of building a classic Victorian design but with the modern benefits you’d get from ICF (quick and solid construction, flexibility, energy efficiency, etc).
I’m interested in hearing people’s thoughts on prices for build plus any pros and cons (especially the cons as the websites tout all the benefits!)
Thanks in advance.
The Chicken
August 12, 2008
Just curious - cost of rebuild
hello everybody - long time lurker, first time poster.
We've just moved to NY and looking to buy a house in Flatbush in the next year or so.
I'm curious as to the cost to build one of these houses from scratch. ie get an idea of what the underlying land is valued at.
eg What would be a ballpark to build one of these to the same specification? http://www.bhsbrooklyn.com/detail.asp?id=719448
(no particular reason for choosing that one, just that its got a floorplan and okay pictures)
I appreciate it's one of those "how long is a piece of string" type questions but any comments would be appreciated.
On the other forums I frequent, it is customary for the newbie to buy a round at the virtual bar - so what are yo having?
Author's Comments
nobody home?
Posted by: the chicken at November 20, 2009 9:24 AM in response to Open Thread
stevieb, I have no sympathy for flippers but I equally have no animosity towards them. If they are good at what they do (in terms of renovating, spotting the opportunity and correctly timing the market) then they make money. If not then they don't.
I do object to people being able to walk away once their equity is wiped out though. Those debts should follow them until fully paid off.
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 1:33 PM in response to 150 Bond Finally Sells—For a Loss
Legion,
here's round 1. Click on the user's other videos for the other rounds (kind of gives the game away when you see how many videos there are but I guess you know the result already!)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0S0yKsiD5Vc&feature=channel
Blowfish,
I don't watch UFC - is it any good?
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 1:14 PM in response to Open Thread
DIBS, I agree that the evidence points to an original intention of staying there so it's the sale shortly after that marks it out as a flip to me.
Flips and forced sales are not mutually exclusive and the extreme leverage and seat-of-the-pants financing that often accompanies it means that unsuccessful flips end up being forced sales anyway.
I guess the overriding issue is a general negative view towards flippers, which I disagree with.
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 1:09 PM in response to 150 Bond Finally Sells—For a Loss
"Legion, I watched the Pacquiao Cotto fight on Saturday. Was a great throwdown but Pacquiao obvi kicked ass.
Posted by: Kensingtonian at November 19, 2009 12:37 PM"
I saw the fight on youtube - cracking fight! Big respect to Cotto for taking it like he did.
I've been following a young fighter called David Lemieux on youtube as well - this kid can't be stopped and is probably going to be a champ one day.
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 12:55 PM in response to Open Thread
I would define a flipper as someone who buys a property and then sells it relatively soon after in the hopes of making a profit.
Renovation does not have to take place for it to be a flip. I bought a house a few years back that I expected to be subject to a compulsory purchase order by the local authority to turn the area into a shopping centre. I didn't do anything to the property apart from a tidy up and a lick of paint because I didn't think it would justify itself in any higher price that would be offered.
So, to me, a flip can only be determined after the fact. If someone buys a house with the intention of flipping it but then decides to live in it for 20 years then that is not a flip. If someone buys a house with the intention to live in it for 20 years but then decides to put it on the market after 1 then that (to me) is a flip.
So (to me) the biggest area of subjectivity is how long the property needs to be owned in order for it not to be a flip.
In this instance, it looks to me like a flip.
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 12:51 PM in response to 150 Bond Finally Sells—For a Loss
sadly not brokedeveloper (think we're going to have to shorten that to BD) - it's chess and only chess.
No other chess-playing PLUSAs?
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 12:17 PM in response to Open Thread
Kens, different strokes for different folks.
I would never contemplate a remodel without funds in cash in my account but I definitely err on the side of caution.
When the credit tap was flowing freely, I could certainly understand others putting the bill onto whatever credit cards they hadn't maxed out before getting a refi.
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 12:13 PM in response to 150 Bond Finally Sells—For a Loss
"What's Gameknot? Is that like Balloon Knot?
Posted by: Biff Champion at November 19, 2009 11:47 AM"
http://tinyurl.com/ykryc69
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 11:57 AM in response to Open Thread
7) the chicken
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 11:51 AM in response to 150 Bond Finally Sells—For a Loss
mmmmm.....squishy.....
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 11:40 AM in response to Inside Third & Bond: Week 109
Morning PLUSAs!
Brokedeveloper, are you on Gameknot?
Posted by: the chicken at November 19, 2009 11:38 AM in response to Open Thread
Have I plugged my friend's book on Brownstoner yet? If so, here it is again.
http://mercuryfalls.net/
You can download the first 12 chapters for free to see if you like it and the full novel is as cheap as $2 for the kindle.
If you like Douglas Adams or Chris Moore then you'll like this.
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 1:54 PM in response to Open Thread
here's a nice little ditty I found on youtube that is NY appropriate
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYbK_cBOm0w
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 1:40 PM in response to Open Thread
Snappy, what do you talk about when you do get together then? I would have thought awkward silences would be enough to give the hint?
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 12:10 PM in response to Open Thread
Pete, it's not that I don't have bad memories, it's just that I don't have bad memories of high school!
I'm fairly sure that I'm famous for my bad memory but I can't remember....
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 12:08 PM in response to Open Thread
No DIBS, that nickname only came in my 20's.
In our school, nicknames weren't very imaginative - generally surname + "y". eg Smithy, Jonesy, etc.
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 12:07 PM in response to Open Thread
I don't really have any bad memories of high school Cobby. Maybe I repressed them!
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 11:58 AM in response to Open Thread
As a student, we always used to just not pay the last month's rent and leave them the security deposit. Since we always left the places in decent condition we never had anyone chase us up.
Not sure how I would feel about it if I were in the landlord's shoes but it's at least a way to help your cashflow if you're switching apartments.
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 11:53 AM in response to Open Thread
blowfish, not awkward at all. We got on fantastically when we were in school just our lives went in very different directions. The old expression "out of sight, out of mind" is very true for forgotten friends.
I am terrible at keeping in touch in general and Facebook has really helped me to reconnect with old friends.
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 11:50 AM in response to Open Thread
I had a coffee this morning with a guy I went to high school with - not seen each other for 20 years!
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 11:41 AM in response to Open Thread
you bought a house mopar? I missed that news. Congratulations!
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 10:13 AM in response to Open Thread
"OKAY!! Can we please stop with the Shitty jokes!
Posted by: Expert Textpert at November 18, 2009 10:05 AM"
Oh crap...
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 10:07 AM in response to Open Thread
"I guess you should know!!
Posted by: daveinbedstuy at November 18, 2009 9:36 AM"
I am on intimate terms with an ass wipe
"Asses were invented in China.
Posted by: Expert Textpert at November 18, 2009 9:37 AM"
The whole entire human body was invented in China too
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 9:39 AM in response to Open Thread
these are the ones that you need Rob.
http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11489346&whse=BC&Ne=4000000&eCat=BC|48022|56098&N=4040783&Mo=17&No=6&Nr=P_CatalogName:BC&cat=56098&Ns=P_Price|1||P_SignDesc1&lang=en-US&Sp=C&topnav=
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 9:37 AM in response to Open Thread
ass wipes were invented in China too
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 9:34 AM in response to Open Thread
Hi Benson, hope they aren't working you too hard!
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 9:26 AM in response to Open Thread
I fell asleep on the OT last night. How embarrassing...
Posted by: the chicken at November 18, 2009 9:19 AM in response to Open Thread
Snappy, "Don't look back in anger" would be my second fave on that album I think
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:58 PM in response to Open Thread
"chicken, So you had perfectly cooked chips whenever you wanted! Lucky dog! I mean chicken!
Posted by: cobblehiller at November 17, 2009 5:53 PM"
Well I just made them myself. It explains why I'm such a fat b@$#ard!
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:56 PM in response to Open Thread
"Chicken, did the Chinese invent fish and chips too?
Posted by: Biff Champion at November 17, 2009 5:46 PM"
Of course!
"But Chicken, Champagne Super Nova is so much better! Both great songs though.
Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at November 17, 2009 5:47 PM"
Nope - Wonderwall much better. Don't make me come over there young lady!
"chicken, Your folks had a restaurant?!
Posted by: cobblehiller at November 17, 2009 5:47 PM"
No, a takeaway/fish & chip shop. You need a different licence to eat in.
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:50 PM in response to Open Thread
"Adult wipes are very effective for getting fish and chip grease off one's face.
Posted by: Biff Champion at November 17, 2009 5:44 PM"
So are baby wipes
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:47 PM in response to Open Thread
no, no Snappy - go with your first reaction!
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:45 PM in response to Open Thread
I know the Godfather well (corner of Mauldeth Rd & Kingsway) - I used to get the bus to school right outside that place. Our place was at the top of Mauldeth Rd on Burnage Lane.
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:44 PM in response to Open Thread
hmmmm....I wonder if cobby is short for "cob shop"?
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:40 PM in response to Open Thread
There were three chippys in Burnage etson (home of Oasis)
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:37 PM in response to Open Thread
Cobby, chippy = english chip shop
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:35 PM in response to Open Thread
LOL. Sorry Biff, Snappy's comeback was...well....snappier!
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:33 PM in response to Open Thread
I'm with etson on the correct chip protocol - I should know, I grew up in a chippy!
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:27 PM in response to Open Thread
"just 11217 fighting with himself as miss muffett in the brooklyns most overpriced houses thread. he doesnt even TRY to hide the fact that it's him.
*rob*
Posted by: Butterfly at November 17, 2009 4:40 PM"
Wait.....11217 is Miss Muffett?!
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:26 PM in response to Open Thread
stevieb, you're in DP?
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 5:24 PM in response to Last Week's Biggest Sales
Rob, one of my friends had a miscarriage recently too.
All you can do is be there for them if they want to talk.
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 9:43 AM in response to Open Thread
I'm surprised that the verdict came back "negligent" rather than "fraudulent"
Posted by: the chicken at November 17, 2009 9:25 AM in response to Corcoran Found Negligent in Park Slope Condo Sale
pa-pa-pa-pa-pa-pa-poker face....
Saw her in Nobu once - she's weird looking.
Posted by: the chicken at November 16, 2009 1:18 PM in response to Open Thread
$3,500 in interest-only payments, $4,900 including the maintenance.
What would this rent for?
Posted by: the chicken at November 16, 2009 1:16 PM in response to Co-op of the Day: 130 8th Avenue, #7C
somebody reverse-engineering my dna?
Posted by: the chicken at November 16, 2009 12:43 PM in response to Open Thread
(pssst...I never knew what "TKOTD" stood for...)
Posted by: the chicken at November 16, 2009 10:44 AM in response to Open Thread
Archi, if only we see those prices again then I'll be in quick sharpish
Posted by: the chicken at November 16, 2009 10:36 AM in response to Ditmas Park Gets the 'Living In' Treatment
"wtf? im trying to get free tickets for the wendy williams show, and in order to get tickets you are required to upload a picture of yourself and also say something interesting about yourself. all i want are some damn tickets!
*rob*
Posted by: Butterfly at November 16, 2009 10:03 AM"
Rob, when I think of people I know that might have a hard time fulfilling the second part of the request, you definitely do not spring to mind.
Posted by: the chicken at November 16, 2009 10:10 AM in response to Open Thread
give it a rest stevieb...
Posted by: the chicken at November 20, 2009 10:13 AM in response to Open Thread