Gates Reno
« Decisions, decisions... Finally, a plan »
July 12, 2006
When reality hits
So what we had been waiting for finally arrived late last week: an estimate from our contractor for the top two floors of work. Mr. Architect had been hoping that this would come in at about two-fifths of our total construction budget.
It came in at two-thirds.
Whump.
After the shock and disbelief subsided, we went into denial. This can’t be right. There must be a mistake. The contractor must have gotten us confused with someone who wanted gold-plated toilets and that new shower that releases fake-tanning spray. Then we started bargaining with Ms. Architect: if we don’t do this or this or this, how much can be sliced off of the estimate? We then started to feel guilty that we hadn’t made other plans. Perhaps we were being greedy taking all four floors for ourselves? Next came anger. Anger at our contractor. Anger at each other. Anger at a free-market economy that had us discussing numbers of this magnitude in the first place. Depression soon followed. What would we do? Would we still be able to end up in a home we'd be proud of? After a very long meeting with Ms. Architect, we were left with acceptance: we accepted that if we wanted to use our contractor, we would have to pay his prices. Or find some other contractor.
A little background on why we didn’t bid the job out. About a year ago, when we first went to look at this house, we called up a guy who had done contracting work for a number of our friends. Now, usually, when people talk about their contractor, they get a pained look on their faces and swear a lot. We personally know someone whose contractor put his reno money up his nose. So when our friends all gave us glowing reviews of this guy, we started to think that maybe this whole renovation thing wouldn’t be the nightmare we had been envisioning. We had only owned one property – the condo we were currently living in – and that had been new construction, so we hadn’t had to deal with the world of architects and contractors. We were scared.
But we met this guy, and went through the house with him, and got a really good feeling about him. He just seemed like the kind of guy that we wouldn’t merely tolerate having in our home for a year, but might actually like having around. And he just doted on our kids.
We had a couple of architects in mind as well, and we found out that they had done a ton of work with this contractor, and really liked him. They said that his prices hadn’t quite caught up to his skill level yet, so they considered him a bargain and a good buy. Everything was falling into place.
Fast forward to the estimate. We were shocked. Mr. Architect was shocked. Ms. Architect was not as shocked. She said that in the past year, this contractor had been getting so much work that he might be flexing his muscles, trying to see what prices he could command now that his reputation was solid. Did he really have to start with us?
Comments
I feel your pain. I freak out similarly every time I get an estimate from a contractor. I swear to myself that I could do the same job for much less money. Then I face the truth that it would take me ten years to do the job - when they could finish it in ten weeks. I then sign the contract. Sigh.
Posted by: Shahn Andersen at July 13, 2006 12:16 AM
get more estimates. and then when you think you're just about done, refine those estimates did I already say more estimates? having gone through this process many a times, it's my most practical philosophy that the homeowner takes total OWNERSHIP of the project. don't pass the buck to the architect, friends, or whoever else down the pipeline.
high prices shouldn't come as a surprise, especially from someone supposedly known by so many in the professions. you've done a great disservice to no one else but yourseves.
Posted by: jmc at July 13, 2006 8:38 AM
I don't understand why you don't post the numbers on this site. Seems to me that people reading this blog have a lot of experience with contractors and would be able to tell you whether the guy is trying to rip you off, is fair in his pricing or is undercharging. Correct me if I am wrong, but Mr. & Ms. Architect makes a percentage of the total construction cost (i.e incentivized to have higher construction costs). Unless you, you and you don't become painfully familiar with what reasonable prices are, you will be ripped off in this process - that's a guarantee.
Posted by: Blabber at July 13, 2006 2:43 PM
Welcome to contractor hell. I just visited there myself. Here is a list of items that I now wish I had cut back on to save money: That expensive dishwasher aint worth it, neither is the front load washer and dryer. Do ceiling fans instead of central AC. Have floors refinished instead of buying carpet for the bedrooms. It's not much, but I hope this helps.
Where am I happy with my spending? Subway tile!!!! It's cheap and looks good in both my baths and the kitchen backsplash. Also, the Lowes cabinets I got instead of going with a higher priced alternative. They look great.
Posted by: dt at July 13, 2006 5:52 PM
The reason I don't post the numbers is simple: if I post the total numbers, then I would also have to post everything that went into those numbers, and frankly, that's something that I don't have time for. I'm not going to post the spreadsheet of the estimate, so any guesses as to whether or not the numbers are valid are just that, guesses.
There are also intangibles that nobody but Omer and myself can understand for our particular situation: how well we communicate with someone; how comfortable we are being around someone's crew; how much we like or dislike examples of the contractor's work; what premium we are willing to pay to use someone who gets glowing recommendations all around.
These are things that some people may be willing to pay extra for, while for others the only consideration is the price. No one else can tell us whether or not these things are worth it for us.
Posted by: Amy at July 14, 2006 12:11 AM
That's a tough spot for you to be in. I think everyone is feeling the pinch right now. I'm pretty sure all skilled contractors raised their prices in the last few years. As well as architects and anyone else in the building trade. The Brooklyn landscape is changing by the second! We are in a building boom! I have never seen so much construction in Brooklyn as I do right now. It goes hand in hand with the record breaking real estate market. Contractors have more work than they can handle so they take the jobs that will pay the MOST for their time. Perhaps to save money we could import some skilled workers from upstate NY, in the dead of winter, or maybe that's a fantasy too?
Posted by: Rick at July 14, 2006 8:04 AM
i cant believe i am getting into a blog debate, but the whole "incentivized to have higher construction costs" is bullshit, if they signed a contract for a percentage of construction then they have to live by it. And you are welcome to come to my office where i will show you how much many projects have cost, how much it cost me to run my office and pay people to execute those projects and guess what, youll see its a pretty consistent percentage of construction cost. I dont claim to be any financial genius or master negotiator but ill take an hourly job any day of the week. If your doing a gut renovation, not only is the percentage fee method for architects totally standard, but most reasonable for the client.
Posted by: yoyo at July 14, 2006 8:52 AM
Another way to spread out the pain is to rough out what makes sense to do all at once, then leave finishing of some chunks for later. (In our case, sometimes a decade later, but we're particularly pathetic cases.) For example, we had to tear out 2 disgusting bathrooms on the same stack, one the "main" bath in our living quarters and one the upstairs 'guest' bath...we roughed in both, but didn't finish taping, painting, tiling and appliances for upstairs one til later. (OK, way later, but it kept us out of the poorhouse.) Economies of scale dictate that you do all your plumbing and as much demo as possible all at once--but you can go back and finish "territories" later and then grant them fully renovated "statehood."
It also helps to drink heavily and cry a lot...
Posted by: Brenda from Flatbush at July 14, 2006 9:35 AM
I already cry a lot, so perhaps it's time to finally take up drinking. :-)
Posted by: Amy at July 14, 2006 12:41 PM
If you have found a contractor that you are comfortable with and you trust, that is half the battle of a successful renovation.
Posted by: samandjoeshow at July 20, 2006 12:26 PM
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