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October 16, 2009
Temperature in Apt.
I'd like to ask all the landlords out there, any input will be appreciated. The question is simple. What is the temperature you keep in the tenants apartments? The reason I'm asking is that my new tenants called and complained yesterday that it was too chilly in their apt. during the day. I keep temp. at 71 till 11:00 at night and 68 during the night. I think it's preaty dicent. They are good tenants and I want to keep them comfortable but I politely refused to turn the temp. up.
Comments
Tell them to put a sweater on.
Are their windows sealed properly? Do they have drafts coming in from fireplaces or doors that you could take care of? There is a lot that can be done to make a place more comfortable besides turning up the heat.
Posted by: Schultz at October 16, 2009 10:04 AM
Speaking as a tenant, that temp should be fine. Schultz is right. The windows may be drafty, or chill coming in through the fireplace or doorways. How does it seem in your own part of the house?
Posted by: bxgrl at October 16, 2009 10:07 AM
We keep the same temp. in our apt. Their apt. is insulated preaty good, except the AC they still didn't remove from one one the windows. It might leak some warmth but still the temp. is 71 in the apt.
Posted by: gale at October 16, 2009 10:26 AM
If the temperature in their apartment is actually 71°, you are well within NYC's requirements for "heat season," which runs from Oct. 1 to May 31. Temperatures can vary drastically from one brownstone unit to another, so it's not always sufficient to rely on the thermostat reading in the owner's unit. I agree that you should check for drafts, weatherstrip where necessary, and insist that your tenants remove their air conditioner.
The specific NYC requirements follow. I prefer things on the cool side and find the daytime temp really comfortable, but the evening minimum miserly and chilly: between the hours of 6:00 AM and 10:00 PM, if the outside temperature falls below 55 degrees, the inside temperature is required to be at least 68 degrees Fahrenheit; and, between the hours of 10:00 PM and 6:00 AM, if the temperature outside falls below 40 degrees, the inside temperature is required to be at least 55 degrees Fahrenheit. You can read a little more at: http://www.nyc.gov/html/hpd/html/tenants/heat-and-hot-water.shtml
Posted by: vinca at October 16, 2009 11:28 AM
The real question you should be asking is where is the theromostat reader?
If the thermostat is in your apt, the heat will come up, warm your apt to 68 degrees and then shut off before it has a chace to warm up the tenant's apt. This was a problem in my former coop. We had to move the thermostat reader into the known coldest apt. (mine) so that all the apts would be heated to a comfortable 68.
Our apt. was on the top floor and even the people in the lower apt would comment how much colder it was when they came to visit. Moving the termostat solved the problem for the most part.
The people on the first floor said they were now roasting but were willing to open windows to keep them and us comfortable. How's that for COOPerative?
Posted by: italiana71 at October 16, 2009 11:40 AM
The thermostat in the tenants apt., reading is accurate. I know all about the regulations. The temps. we keep is above the regs. That's not the question. I'm wondering what are the average temps. landlord in PS keep in the tenants apt.
Posted by: gale at October 16, 2009 11:45 AM
We keep ours at 68--for us and the tenants.
Posted by: tinarina at October 16, 2009 12:03 PM
I would suggest that you make noticeable effort to show that you're diligent about sealing possible air leaks. Continue to ask if it's getting better. Make sure they continue to pay with no needless nuisance. Followed by giving them a degree or two. High quality tenants are hard to find, no need to take a vacancy if they pay - you'll recoup in the next rent increase.
Posted by: boerumite at October 16, 2009 12:18 PM
Does it really matter what temperature other landlords keep their rental units at? If your tenants spend the winter cold, they'll be looking for a new place for next winter. Although 71 may be comfortable for many people, not everyone is comfortable at the same temperature.
Posted by: snowbunny at October 16, 2009 12:35 PM
The NYC regulation is:
October 1 to May 31:
6 am - 10 pm - if outside temp is below 55, inside temp must be maintained at least at 68
10 pm - 6 am - if outside temp is below 40, inside temp must be maintained at least at 55
Posted by: christopher at October 16, 2009 12:38 PM
Snowbunny, it does matter. First: Because I pay for heating and second: if other landlords keep apx. the same temps. than they can look for the new place all they want but will end up, probably, in even colder apt.
"Although 71 may be comfortable for many people, not everyone is comfortable at the same temperature".
What if the comfy temp. for somebody is 80? Should I keep it 80?
Posted by: gale at October 16, 2009 1:08 PM
That's a great point snowbunny. Do you really need someone else's input about people that pay YOU rent? Lol. Because the point is if they are cold, they are cold. When you're cold...do you consult others? Or do you turn the heat up? This post points to your character flaw. You know the law, but you are asking the law...you're asking for approval. If they are "good" tenants like you state, why risk losing them over heat season. Sounds like you're treating them like girls.
Posted by: cillmylandlord_again at October 16, 2009 1:12 PM
71/68 is pretty standard.
Posted by: henrycurtis at October 16, 2009 1:25 PM
character flaw? how judgmental! The law is 68/55. That is what they signed up for when they got the lease. Cranking the heat up to 80 is both expensive and wasteful(not very green of you). I have mine set at 70 6-11 and 60 thereafter, It rarely even comes on at night.
When I am cold or damp I put on a sweater.
Thank goodness you don't have to pay for their air conditioning. Get a thermometer and check if its more than 68 I would say sorry that is what is required. It was damp yesterday when its cold damp cold feels worse. Check for air leaks but if its none of the above and they pay for their own electric, they do have a way to get in their own range.
Posted by: smeyer418 at October 16, 2009 1:32 PM
opps I left off I am from Vulcan and prefer it at 105....
Posted by: smeyer418 at October 16, 2009 1:36 PM
Yes...judgemental. Guilty as charged. Hmmm...When you write a post asking for advice on what OTHER PEOPLE THINK of you not turning up the heat...you are asking for their judgement on your situation. Let's not get all crazy.
Yeah...I think you should take the sweater advice. Tell your tenants to "PUT ON A SWEATER". That should go over really well:).
Posted by: cillmylandlord_again at October 16, 2009 1:38 PM
there is somewhat a difference between using your judgment and saying someone has a character flaw....which you clearly do have. I am a landlord not responsible for every part of your comfort. I responsible to provide a habitable apartment with you have the right of quiet enjoyment. If the apartment is at 70 degrees or more as to heat I have met my obligation completely. If that means the tenant wants to move out at the end of the lease, I would rather have them move then expect something unreasonable from me.
Posted by: smeyer418 at October 16, 2009 1:44 PM
My tenants have their own boilers so i don't know what temperature they set their apartments. I keep my apartment at 71 degrees during the day and 62 at night. But even though I have it set at 71 in the daytime, i tend to bump it up a couple of degrees when i'm home because i find it too cold (and yes, i wear sweaters). A couple of degrees seem to make a big difference though. So i'd suggest you bump it up to 72 or 73 and then maybe you can make up for the difference by lowering it starting at 10pm instead of 11 or lowering it to 66 at night.
Posted by: newhomer at October 16, 2009 1:48 PM
I love your use of standard lease words like "quiet enjoyment". Yes, I used the words "character flaw"...although, I was really talking to you smeyer. Maybe you can direct your angsty-ness elsewhere.
Posted by: cillmylandlord_again at October 16, 2009 1:53 PM
I was not talking to you...
Posted by: cillmylandlord_again at October 16, 2009 1:55 PM
when you post on an open board you are talking to everyone. You don't control the answers. You can control if you read them by not reading them. I know you are not talking to me its one of your character flaws to think you can control all the conversation.
Posted by: smeyer418 at October 16, 2009 2:04 PM
Wow...all of that, lol.
Posted by: cillmylandlord_again at October 16, 2009 2:15 PM
Just turn it up a degree or two, you stingy ass landlord. I'm sure it's not as warm as you think it is.
Posted by: MAT at October 16, 2009 2:31 PM
Hit send before I was able to say -from the homeowner who keeps his own heat at around 64. lol!)
Posted by: MAT at October 16, 2009 2:35 PM
One degree actually could make all the diffence in the world.
Maybe you could meet your tenant half way.
Posted by: italiana71 at October 16, 2009 2:37 PM
"The people on the first floor said they were now roasting but were willing to open windows to keep them and us comfortable. How's that for COOPerative?"
No, how's that for insane?! Why don't you get the system balanced, it's not that expensive and you'd be doing the whole world a favor.
Posted by: cmu at October 16, 2009 3:17 PM
I had a tenant constantly complaining about how cold it was. I would turn the heat up and turn it up, but finally the heat was so high I was afraid it was dangerous, so I went upstairs to see if there was some other problem.
The tenant (she was originally from Texas) was parading around in underpants and an undershirt. It was January, about 17 degrees outside. I reminded her she was living in North America in the winter and to put some clothes on and stop bitching, then I lowered the heat.
Posted by: Stonergut at October 16, 2009 4:43 PM
You're already keeping it toastier than required. 68 degrees daytime and 55 at night (which is pretty chilly) I believe is required only in 3 or more family dwellings. If it's a two family it's probably whatever your lease says.
Check on weatherproofing opportunities, then ask your tenants if they'd be willing to renegotiate the lease and pay an extra 100 bucks a month for turning it up to a sauna-like 75.
Whiney bitter renters :-)
Posted by: Bklnite at October 16, 2009 5:11 PM
You are keeping it warm enough. I had a similiar experience to stonergut except my guy was from Georgia, it was February and when I went up to check the apartment he answered the door barefoot, wearing gym shorts and a tee shirt. I told him to put some clothes on.
I inform tenants that it is their responsibility to remove ac's and lock the windows (which completes the seal). I had a tenant with an ac installed and a window open (not just unlocked, but open 4") complain about being cold. Not my problem.
Echo poster above who said it is not the landlords responsibility to accommodate the tenant's every desire.
The tenant has the option to purchase an electric radiator to supplement the 70-72 degrees that I supply. In 26 years that happened once - and she didn't move, she stayed 5 years.
Posted by: jfss at October 16, 2009 6:16 PM
I think this is a subject that always bothers tenants and landlords. Tenants feel they should have perfect comfort for them and landlords are running a business. No doubt all landlords will run into this at some time. Most tenants really don't care about the fact you're running a business, after all, it's really easy to spend other peoples money. Once this issue bugged me so much I thought getting over weight tenants would be a good idea. That didn't work either. I came to understand people have very different ideas about what temperature keeps them comfortable. What I ended up doing is getting the rentals to be in the 68-70 range and put the information in their lease. Doing my best at getting along with them is a plus too.
Posted by: Rick at October 18, 2009 8:39 AM
Op I'm having the same issue with a forced air system. 70 degrees wont please all.
I plan on installing a temperature sensor in the cold apt and wire it to the thermostat in the hall to help me balance the heat.
Posted by: jack slade at October 18, 2009 11:01 PM
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