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October 6, 2009
Advice on Rental Market
I have owned a brownstone in a very good location in North Park Slope right near the park for almost eight years. Until late last year all I had to do was put one ad on craigslist,I got an enormous response and had the apartment rented.
Well, no more. The market has flipped. It's incredible. I rented a couple of apartments a few months ago although it took a couple of weeks. Now it seems worse. After advertising for a week I've gotten a total of two people to look at the apt. May get a couple more this week. The rent is already about $100 below what it would have gone for last year ($1400 vs. $1500). It will be vacated at the end of this month so I'm under pressure to get it rented now.
My question is this. I'm considering lowering it by $100 from what I thought was already a relatively low rent. But I'm wondering how much of an effect that would have. There just seem to be so few people out there. Any advice besides lowering the rent?
Comments
Since fewer people will see the place, you have to do more to make them want it.
Aside from lowering rent:
give more information rather than less in your craigslist ad -- state the actual block rather than just 'north slope', if it is the 4th floor of a walk up, say so
make sure it is clean and in good repair; fix broken outlets, recaulk the tub, put in a new toilet seat if needed, make sure the walls are painted and clean, get the light covers back on after painting, recaulk the tub, clean up the paint that splattered where it shouldn't have, recaulk the tub, clean the windows, and, just to be clear here, recaulk the tub -- no one who sees grimy caulk around a tub thinks "ooooh, yeah! I want to live here!!"
outside the apartment, make sure the public space in the building is clean, cut the grass/weeds out front, make sure the yard is respectable and that the trash/recycling areas are orderly
be flexible about move in dates
Posted by: northsloperenter at October 6, 2009 9:56 AM
It is difficult to rent this time of the year. Maybe try a 6 month lease with an option to renew for another 6 months at the same rate.
Posted by: Ysabelle at October 6, 2009 10:06 AM
I was in the same situation two months ago. I couldn't rent my apt. till tenants were still there. As soon as they moved out and I cleaned and repaired the place it rented in a few days for the same rent.
It seems that when it's occupied with all the tenants junk and clatter, it tough to rent. I don't think you have to lower rent even more if you feel your price is reasonable. Do some research, go see similar apts that are on the market and than you'll know if your price is market or above. That's what I did. You don't have to get desperate, yes, less people are looking for the apts. right now, but prices are not that much lower than 1-2 years ago, may be 10%.
Posted by: gale at October 6, 2009 10:14 AM
there are so many ads on craiglist it could easily get lost.
Are you advertising it as NO FEE, by owner? that would help.
Posted by: Petebklyn at October 6, 2009 10:19 AM
If you post a link to your ad maybe ppl here will have some constructive comments.
Posted by: setancre at October 6, 2009 10:20 AM
I have just spent a week looking at Craigs list trying to find a Brooklyn Sublet for my 90 day artist residency..did I miss you? Eventually going through an agent for bijoux apartment in brooklyn heights
I really wanted to AVOID agents and have been on craigs list loads even before I arrived 2 weeks ago
The responses to my emails was VERY POOR with only about 15% responding.
Maybe TRY different vehicles, there is now something like caravan.com and also a local brooklyn site for artists which i discovered too late
Posted by: rachelsopher at October 6, 2009 10:43 AM
Thanks for the advice. I think the ad already includes the recommendations that some people have made.
http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/abo/1406939702.html
Yea, it could use some sprucing up. Haven't needed to rent it in 5 years. Can't do anything about the current tenant's stuff cluttering the place.
Posted by: starfish1948 at October 6, 2009 10:47 AM
I think including some more flattering photos of the place might help. It looks to get nice light but b/c of that light coming in, the interiors look very dark. If you have a friend who knows about photography, that would help.
I know you have a tenant in there so its a hard subject to bring up but it looks like a mess in there so that is not helping. A little styling would help too.
Posted by: Mrs. Limestone at October 6, 2009 10:50 AM
Also, ads on Craigslist get buried very quickly. Edit your ad daily so it will reappear for that day. I don't think many folks go back into the listings for more than a few days.
I agree with Gale in that you might have more success by skipping a month of income and sprucing the place up when the place is vacant--unless the current tenants are super-clean and have excellent taste and give you easy access.
Posted by: tinarina at October 6, 2009 10:51 AM
If you re-take the pictures with a flash they should come out better (your camera probably didn't want to use a flash due to all the sunlight).
I'd drop the "340 sq. ft." from the ad. It may be big for a studio, but it doesn't sound big...
It may be tough to rent before the tenant moves.
I saw a bunch of apartments recently, and while I did rent one that I saw while a tenant was occupying it (because even though it was grimy and messy it was obviously a good space for me), overall the places that I saw while they were empty and clean made a much better impression on me.
The location is going to appeal to a lot of people, so I suspect you'll find someone. I'm not sure about pricing on studios in the area, but check craigslist to see if you are in the right ballpark.
I know for a 850-1000 sq. ft. 2 bedroom in that location on that floor I would be expecting something around $2500-$2800.
Posted by: northsloperenter at October 6, 2009 11:05 AM
is it just me or does $1400 for a 340 sq ft studio doesn't sound like such a great deal. Not saying it's a bad deal just not great deal - ie the rent isn't so cheap that it stands out above the other listings
Posted by: more4less at October 6, 2009 11:08 AM
1400 for a 340 sft studio in Park Slope? I am going to be the honest one here and tell you that its priced to high. Its better to price low and have your choice of who will be renting from you. Dont forget you are now competing with all the new construction studios that are going for around 1500 a month for 400 sft and offer pools and doormen. I would price it around 1250 if I were you and see what happens
Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at October 6, 2009 11:23 AM
$1250?? I don't think so.
I would say $1350.
I would totally live here.
Posted by: infinitejester at October 6, 2009 11:53 AM
It's funny - I've been scouring Craigslist the past week or so for apartments in that price range - and yours seems to have gotten lost in the shuffle. There seems to be alot of inventory in the Slope right now.
Posted by: dirty_hipster at October 6, 2009 11:54 AM
Also - from what I've been seeing, $1,400 sounds like a fair price. There isn't much of anything in a 'prime' neighborhood for less than $1,400
Posted by: dirty_hipster at October 6, 2009 12:01 PM
Well, looking at craigslist, I haven't seen anything in that part of north Park Slope for under 1400. One just posted today on the same block for 1475. Some in that area are a lot higher, but they may be renovated.
But I will lower it to about 1300 if I have to.
Posted by: starfish1948 at October 6, 2009 12:15 PM
my game plan has always been to always have the apt. filled with a renter and to adjust the price fast if the current ask is not getting any action. To me if the place is not collecting rent for more then 2 weeks I am the fool. 1400 may seem like a fair price but its not moving it now is it? Maybe there are 4 other places like that on the market for 1400 but only one person looking for a 340 sft studio in Park Slope. The first person to lower the price will win the renter and the others will continue to lose revenue.
Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at October 6, 2009 12:17 PM
I would remove the sf # immediately from your ad. At least that way, people will call and make appointments. Right now you have taken all the guess work out. And I suggest taking photo at an angle that doesn't show the sofa. It looks monsterous and claustrophobic.
Posted by: bowl of dicks at October 6, 2009 12:23 PM
I just did a quick search on craigslist and there already is a 1250 studio on the market in Park Slope. So Infinitejester here you go.
http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/abo/1408782147.html
Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at October 6, 2009 12:28 PM
and even though this is not tech. in park slope its only a couple of blocks away and you are competing with them its 1295. They will get the next renter before you.
http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/nfb/1407036744.html
Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at October 6, 2009 12:34 PM
Starfish, your location is premium. I second the idea of getting the current tenant out, cleaning the place up and painting, and supplying excellent photos for your Craig's list post. I don't think your price is way off. We're near you but on 7th Ave. and just rented a similar studio for $1,500. Current tenants can make a rental or sale impossible.
I once tried to sell a lovely 3 family with a pit/lab and a baby that screamed in the presence of strangers in one apartment and hoarders in another. I couldn't move it until both groups were gone.
Posted by: bessie2 at October 6, 2009 12:42 PM
That $1250 apt is at 17th street. That's 20 blocks south of this apartment with only F/G train service. Vs express train B/Q and 2/3 train service for the OP's apt. Not even comparable in my book. It actually supports charging $1400 for the OP's apt.
Do some updates definitely. Renters have the new condo buildings to choose from now that aren't selling so developers are turning them into rentals so there are brand new places available to them. It raises the bar for owners of old apts. You should clean thoroughly, a total scrubbing; switch out the drop-in sinks, faucets and knobs in both bath and kitchen; and fill in nasty or missing grout everywhere. Those updates are not a lot, it's not expensive, but it does a lot to make a place more appealing.
Posted by: traditionalmod at October 6, 2009 12:43 PM
I also recommend taking better photos. And, include a photo of the bathroom and/or the front of the building instead of the photo of the Grand Army arch. Photos of neighborhood attractions always make me think "broker," even if the ad says it's by owner.
Finally, make the laundry situation clear--seems like there's none in the building, but it's good to be sure.
Posted by: CarlaSays at October 6, 2009 12:48 PM
"and even though this is not tech. in park slope its only a couple of blocks away and you are competing with them its 1295. They will get the next renter before you.
http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/nfb/1407036744.html"
It's not that far away physically, but it is on the other side of grand army plaza, which qualifies as the equivalent of 10-15 blocks in my book...
Posted by: northsloperenter at October 6, 2009 1:25 PM
My 2c: $100-150 too high. It's very small for your price. And:
"There will be a credit, income, landlord, and housing court check"
Makes you sound very anal. Just do it w/o saying it.
Posted by: cmu at October 6, 2009 1:40 PM
b_b_b, welcome to the grownup table. I so enjoy seeing you made out to be the total fool you are.
---
Another thing, when I lived in a private home in PS the landlord never raised my rent the whole 5 years I lived there. In fact, he lowered it ($25). So charging $1350 to me, in a renter's mindset, that this is a place when it's rented gets the going market rate, and then the landlord just collects income knowing the tenant is good. Not a guarantee, but just a personal reminiscence.
Posted by: infinitejester at October 6, 2009 1:46 PM
"There will be a credit, income, landlord, and housing court check"
Makes you sound very anal. Just do it w/o saying it.
Posted by: cmu at October 6, 2009 1:40 PM
I disagree here...I WANT to read that when I'm looking.
Posted by: infinitejester at October 6, 2009 1:48 PM
I just rented a place in September. Had it listed with a broker for a few weeks in August with no luck. Told the existing tenant to clean up, intalled light fixtures, posted better photos, and had 3 solid applicants for the place within a couple of days. As with other posters, appearance really does matter. Only lowered the rent $50 on a place renting for $2350 in the south slope.
Posted by: Stuart at October 6, 2009 1:52 PM
I agree with the other comments about the photos. Very unappealing.
But I also think the copy of the ad is way over done. My initial reaction was to skip over all of the text because it reads like typical broker drivel. "Historic North Park Slope", "Location, Location, Location!", etc. In all you use 127 words(!) describing the location.
You're renting a studio. Just mention it's prime north park slope and describe the apartment. All the fancy verbiage makes it sound like you're hiding something, or a broker really is involved, or something else fishy is going on.
Posted by: northridger at October 6, 2009 1:56 PM
anyway I just read the full ad you had and two things I did not realize.
a-its a 4th floor walkup
b- it is filled until nov 1 (I thought it was sitting empty)
I would leave the price until the 15th and see what happens. If nothing good comes up lower it on the 15. Also a large 340 sft studio sounds dumb to me. Good luck
Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at October 6, 2009 2:00 PM
Floorplans and more photos. Disclose location. People have too much inventory to choose from and don't want to waste their time or yours. Also, say OBO (or best offer) next to price. This bear market demands creativity.
***Bid half off peak comps***
Posted by: Brownstones Half Off at October 6, 2009 2:09 PM
I don't mean to be rude here, but is it possible for you to remove the dropped ceiling? That would be an immediate deal breaker for me and many others I think. Also, the sofa is blocking the fireplace, which is a charming detail that many people are drawn to...if you could get the tenant to move it out of the way for a quick photo I think that would help tremendously. The clutter and the pictures are definitely what's hindering you here. In all honesty when I look for apartments, I skip the text, scroll down to the pictures and if I'm not immediately drawn to the photos I move on to the next ad. This is what's happening to you.
Posted by: boofer at October 6, 2009 2:12 PM
I just noticed the dropped ceiling too...not feeling so great about it now. I like cabin-y spaces and all but dropped ceilings in my home? Not what I'd hope for.
Posted by: infinitejester at October 6, 2009 2:26 PM
You are assuming that your future renters are all computer savey and that they surf the internet. What about that older generation that is not so computer savey? Is their cash no good|? or are they too stupid for you?
Posted by: hannible at October 6, 2009 2:33 PM
The pictures leave much to be desired. At the price you are charging (which is not so exorbitant, but not that competitive either) a tenant wants to see a decent, clean place. I would also show a picture of the building if it looks good from the outside. Frankly, you are on 4th floor of walkup, and at this price its not going to be easy given the demand and supply. Last, you are doing credit, income, landlord and housing court checks? Thats alot and would turn off some tenants as being too invasive.
Posted by: saminthehood at October 6, 2009 2:34 PM
I would move the "Location, location, location" bit from the beginning of the ad, and delete the majority of it. The ad is a bit overwhelming. a straightforward description works best for me. How about:
Spacious studio in Prime North Slope. No fee; $1395/month, gas, heat and hot water included. On a quiet landmark block of brownstones bordered by the Park. President Street near Prospect Park West.
Large studio, bright southwest exposure, full kitchen with skylight, lots of closet and shelf space, large big-windowed classic style bathroom, original details, decorative faux fireplace, wired for cable, four flights up (on top floor) in a quiet, well-maintained, historic landmark brownstone.
Steps (1/4 block) to Prospect Park, Brooklyn Public Library, Brooklyn Museum and Botanical Gardens, the Grand Army Plaza Greenmarket, a few minutes walk to 2, 3, and Q trains -- approximately 15 minute ride to lower Manhattan or 25-30 minutes to Union Square and midtown.
Super lives on premises. No dogs. Any documents you can bring (credit report, employer reference, pay stubs, bank/broker statement) would be helpful.
Email Jeff (owner) at greatapartment@optonline.net or call me at 917-558-2726. I’ll be glad to answer any questions.
Thanks for your interest.
Posted by: talknerdytome at October 6, 2009 2:42 PM
All the crazy arguing posters showed up today! I can barely fight them off!
Posted by: infinitejester at October 6, 2009 2:44 PM
quote:
"No dogs."
there's your problem. people in nyc luv their doggies! also tenants with dogs often make better tenants than those without. i could understand a "no cats" policy because they stinky stinky up the apartment, but no dogs? c'mon!
*rob*
Posted by: Butterfly at October 6, 2009 2:49 PM
I allow dogs upon approval, that gives you a larger pool of renters.
Posted by: bitter_bubble_buyer at October 6, 2009 2:57 PM
rob - Cats are a lot less destructive than dogs (aside from the tenant's own upholstery perhaps.)
Posted by: Arkady at October 6, 2009 3:05 PM
I'd reprice at $1200/mo and hopefully rent it quickly.
The rental market is shit right now.
When the economy rebounds, jack the rent.
And if that were my apartment, I'd rip out the ugly drop ceiling and revamp the kitchen. Folks still love granite.
The "new economy" is over.
The Age of Obama is upon us.
Posted by: IronBalls at October 6, 2009 3:12 PM
And don't give in and allow pets.
They stink and make it harder to rerent next time.
Who the hell wants to rent an apartment that smells like piss?
Posted by: IronBalls at October 6, 2009 3:13 PM
dogs pee and poop outside outside. unfortunately cats pee and poop indoors and it's very difficult to get feline poo mist particles out of woodwork, tiles, etc. i guess dogs can have accidents tho. but generally landlords clean an apartment before someone new moves in so you probably shouldnt have to worry about any of this.
*rob*
Posted by: Butterfly at October 6, 2009 3:21 PM
"What about that older generation that is not so computer savey? Is their cash no good|? or are they too stupid for you?"
Hanible, if you're of th pre-PC generation, you'll hardly want to live in a 4th floor walkup.
To the OP, pix suck, and the kitchen ain't much better.
Posted by: denton at October 6, 2009 3:35 PM
when i was apartment hunting 3 months ago I can't tell you how many places I saw with drop ceilings. I don't care how cheap or big or convenient the apartment is, drop ceilings are a DEAL BREAKER. The landlords would ask me, why don't you want this place? I'd say, I might as well sleep at my office.......
Also FWIW, acoustical lay-in tiles are odor sponges. So any pet smells, or cigi smoke etc will live in that shite forever.
Posted by: bowl of dicks at October 6, 2009 3:40 PM
quote:
"What about that older generation that is not so computer savey? Is their cash no good|? or are they too stupid for you?"
LOL! you really do NOT want to rent to anyone over 65 tho because it's legally IMPOSSIBLE to get them out if you had to.
*rob*
Posted by: Butterfly at October 6, 2009 3:50 PM
ugh. psychic vision of me at 65 years old frantically looking for a place to live and having the doors shut on me.
*rob*
Posted by: Butterfly at October 6, 2009 3:51 PM
The rent of $1400 is about right for an apartment that size in that location. However, you should clean up the place and apply a coat of paint. Additionaly, get rid of the drop ceiling if you can.
I have 6 apartments in your area (all 1 bedrooms) and when a tenant moves out I always make sure its cleaned out really well and a new coat of paint put on. Additionaly I have tall tin ceilings and I would never in 100 years put drop ceilings.
When you take pictures make sure there is lots of light in the apartment. Light colors on the walls make the space look larger.
If done right there is no reason why you would not be able to rent the space in a weeks time at the most. your building is in prime park slope and although the market is down there is still a huge demand for your area.
good luck.
Posted by: landlord at October 6, 2009 7:28 PM
Lots of good suggestions here. Take talknerdytome's advice on the ad copy, and I agree about the dropped ceilings -- they would be a definite NO for me and probably others. Only one thing to add: once the tenants are gone and you get the place spiffed up, TAKE SOME GOOD PICTURES of the apartment, empty on a sunny day, for use in the future. Then you'll never be stuck using pictures of tenant clutter again.
Posted by: casacara at October 6, 2009 7:30 PM
I went to your Craigslist ad pretending that I was in the market for a studio apartment. I ignored the furniture because let's face it, sometimes having furniture in an apartment can't be helped, and it's not that cluttered that you can't see the bare bones of the unit. Things I saw immediately and liked:
* Beautiful front windows with lots of light
* Nice amount of shelving and closet space
* Hardwood floors (yay!)
What made me go hmmm...:
* No bathroom shot. Even though it says it's big and beautiful in the ad, the fact that there's no image supporting this automatically makes me suspicious.
* Kitchen shot is cropped. Once again, people are more interested in what's omitted than what they see. Is there a place to put dishes? Groceries?
Those things are all things I might be able to live with. Here are the dealbreakers:
* That godawful drop ceiling. And the fact that it's a drop ceiling in a brownstone fills me with GOTDAMN BURNING ANGER. I prefer living in older buildings for the wonderful high ceilings, and I think most people who like vintage prefer that as well.
* Absolutely no dogs. I'm a responsible pet owner. I also realize that some people aren't, and often bad experiences make landlords prefer not to rent to people with pets. Therefore, if I'm looking at apartments on CL I always make sure I have the dog and cat checkboxes checked before I start searching. If I were really conducting a search I would never see this ad.
IMO, one of the best thing you could do is remove the drop ceiling. It's especially important in this case because it's a studio (as opposed to only having it in areas like the kitchen or bathroom) and the entire living area has it!
Posted by: Kaonashi at October 6, 2009 8:03 PM
I would bet money that 99% of the commenters on this thread have not rented an apt. in Brooklyn in the last 3 months. The market is WAY down. I just rented 2 and it was HARD and I took almost a 10% price drop. What rented last year in 3 days took me 3 weeks and with 2 price drops. They were on Craigslist with gorgeous pics, empty, with no dropped ceilings and brand new everything. I consulted w/ 2 agents, one from Corcoran and one from Halstead and they confirmed that things are sitting empty for months even after significant price drops. The agent from Corcoran said that he has two 2 bedrooms that rented in just 3 days last year for $3,600. This year the price is $3,000 and they've been sitting empty since July. He has another 600 sq. ft. 1 bedroom, no fee that has been on the market for 2 months empty. The market has tanked and it's taking longer and prices are lower. People are not looking for a deal they are looking for a steal....hopefully it won't stay like this for long.
Posted by: mamaday at October 6, 2009 8:58 PM
well i rented a place w/i the last 3 months and i gave the LL his ask and all n all i'm pretty happy with the deal,,,,,,,,,,, SO THERE!
Posted by: bowl of dicks at October 6, 2009 10:38 PM
"The agent from Corcoran said that he has two 2 bedrooms that rented in just 3 days last year for $3,600. This year the price is $3,000 and they've been sitting empty since July."
Well, maybe if the agent from Corcoran lowered his $4400 fee the places would rent a bit faster...
Posted by: northsloperenter at October 7, 2009 9:57 AM
Exactly, Northsloperenter. The notion brokers are telling landlords to take huge cuts in their rental income so the brokers don't have to lower their fees in this new market is absolutely absurd. Landlords should be negotiating fees down with brokers and if they can't get a good deal for their prospective tenants don't use a broker at all.
Posted by: traditionalmod at October 7, 2009 10:20 AM
Yes. Landlords need to understand that broker fees are like a "cover charge" at a club.
When you have a line of a people waiting outside hoping to get in, sure, you can charge a cover.
But when you club is empty and no one is walking in the door, it's time to get rid of the cover charge and start a happy hour.
Posted by: northsloperenter at October 7, 2009 10:58 AM
It's always difficult to rent an apt this time of year. Big whoop.
Posted by: mopar at October 7, 2009 5:37 PM
Maybe i you stopped doing bussness wt Cocorean you would do much better. After al it i because of greedy commision charging idiots like them that rents have gone through the roofs for the regular working family. Butterfly you better hope you never get someone like me for a homeowner. You respect elders not treat them like trash.
Posted by: hannible at October 7, 2009 10:17 PM
Hi Starfish1948,
Am a long time N. Slo brownstoner.
One of my kids is currently looking for apt in the poetic Licence nabe, so I tried yr Craigslist post to hv a look/ forward link to her.
However, was no longer viewable as post taken off by owner.
Does this mean now rented?
Hope so for your sake, but o/w pls advise where she can view o/l.
In thanks, Merlyn
Posted by: Marilyn at October 9, 2009 10:04 AM
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