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September 28, 2009

Noise Recourse?

Looking for suggestions on most effective tools to deal with a recurrent problem. Pane E Vino on Smith street had yet another rousing Sunday night party in their back garden last night, complete with DJ's and speakers placed outside. DcB level was easily 65+. Called the restaurant twice; was immediately hung up on both times. Went over to talk to the manager, who told me the music was "not really that loud" and even denied the fact that it was a Sunday evening. When I kept on insisting they turn down the music, the guy who had rented out the space got in my face and told me he could do whatever he wanted cause he paid "good money" for the place and if I didn't leave "there would be problems". Cops showed up shortly thereafter and made them move the speakers inside, but the noise/music was still at outrageous levels -- there was no way anyone with windows facing the back could have possibly gone to sleep prior to 12:30am, when they finally closed down. Problem is, these events occur randomly and it is impossible to get a DEP inspection on the fly, and the cops can/will only do so much, as they seem only to address the noise coming from mechanicals, not people. Are there any effective neighborhood associations which have effectively dealt with this issue in the past? It would suck to have to spend $50K on soundproof windows because these a-holes have no regard for their neighbors.

Comments

Alone you are not going to get too far.
Once a year the CommunityBoard has a public forum on issues from restaurants and bars (at least CB6 does,, if this block is still CB 6 or not). But knowing noise rules and regs can help and contacting CB might be 1st step.
Getting all the other neigbhors together on this could also be helpful...so plenty of people call police station when happens. Try to contact both your side and Warren St people also as well as people living above shops on Smith.
Find out who landlord is too.
Police pcts (the 76th) also have regular public meetings also...if have several people going and asking about this issue could help.

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 28, 2009 11:54 AM

This galls me. 12:30 on a Sunday is ridiculous. I like this place, but not going any more.

Posted by: Johnny at September 28, 2009 12:03 PM

water balloons after midnight?

Posted by: CG_ups at September 28, 2009 12:05 PM

"It would suck to have to spend $50K on soundproof windows..."

50K? Exaggerate much?

Posted by: streber at September 28, 2009 12:12 PM

You moved above a restaurant and are now complaining about restaurant noise. Brilliant.

Posted by: Bklyn Fire Alarm Guy at September 28, 2009 12:29 PM

you have to be kidding me. please remember you live in new york. if you cannot handle the noise of a late city you should move to the suburbs instead of trying to turn brooklyn into one. are you related to my neighbor who insisted on yelling at a couple of my guests sharing a cigarette in my backyard at 11:45 on a friday night?

Posted by: TWSS at September 28, 2009 12:42 PM

I have no idea why this post is drawing such acrimony. Just because someone lives in NYC near a restaurant doesn't mean they should be subject to unreasonable levels of noise at ANY time of the day, much less after midnight. That's absurd. There are laws about noise that should be respected for obvious reasons. That restaurant manager should receive a hearty slap for his attitude alone.

The only other suggestion I have besides Petebklyn's ideas is to connect with your local neighborhood/block association. Chances are excellent you're not the only one who is pissed off by this. You need to find those people and team up with them. Definitely attend the police precinct's monthly meeting.

Posted by: herkimermaid at September 28, 2009 12:49 PM

I hate this line of thinking that because you live in "New York" you have to tolerate any kind of quality of life destroying crap that's dished out to you. I think most reasonable people would agree that yelling at a few people chatting over a cigarette at a not-too-late hour on a Friday night is out of line, but I think the same reasonable people would also agree that blasting music past midnight on a Sunday night is obnoxious.

Posted by: woodys at September 28, 2009 12:59 PM

wyckoff, I believe Pane E Vino is in Community Board 2. I heard they are working on similar back-yard noise complaints at Camp.

Just for the record, I'm with herkimermaid and woodys. Yeah, it's a city and yeah, it's gonna be noiser than the 'burbs. But it is possible to have a lively metropolis without an 'anything goes' attitude.

Posted by: g man at September 28, 2009 1:28 PM

Either have a dinner party and invite ur own friends over to take advantage of the free dj when they have a party or move to a quieter section...not much else u can do given that u live near a restaurant. It comes with the territory don't u think? I live on a main street in brooklyn..

Posted by: scarter at September 28, 2009 1:28 PM

a free market analysis would say your apartment's rent is adjusted due to both a restaurant in your vicinity (pro) and noise from the establishment (con). you knew there was a restaurant there when you moved in. if you didn't perform the proper due diligence before signing your lease, tough. however, a free market analysis would also say mothers in park slope could regulate themselves and keep their children from careening off rush hour commuters, so there goes that logic. the balance these areas need to take into account is with the people who want to make noise and don't want your goddamn kid in the middle of the sidewalk screaming with you (not you, but mostparents which are on your side of the duel). why should we oblige to your requests without receiving some quiet from you as well?

Posted by: TWSS at September 28, 2009 1:40 PM

TWSS and fire guy, you are just being dicks. Or you didn't actually read and comprehend the complaint. Or both.

"...yet another rousing Sunday night party in their back garden last night, complete with DJ's and speakers placed outside." Or is that just 'standard' restaurant noise now and we should all move t te burbs or back to Ohio?

Posted by: MAT at September 28, 2009 1:52 PM

Since some of you are taking the attitude that the OP should just deal with this as typical city noise, please feel free to post your address so a few of us can park ourselves outside your bedroom windows for a fortnight while blaring music through some speakers. And to make it even more Brooklyn-like, we'll also bring along a powered subwoofer and a microphone to be sure you hear our voices as well as the music. And when your little ones are awakened from the noise and start crying, just tell them "Welcome to Brooklyn, honey!"

Posted by: InsertSnappyNameHere at September 28, 2009 2:00 PM

I don't think that ppl are saying that it's typical city noise..or at least I am not saying that.. but what I am saying is that when u live by a restaurant that has outdoor events this is going to happen..sure the restaurant manager should be alot nicer and sure they should bring the speakers in and do different things to lessen the noise but are they?? probably not. I live 2 doors down to a church that does loud and i do mean loud saturday night services which not only mess up parking but at times can go to after 1am.. approaching ppl who are making noise is such a touchy situation.. in the end..good luck..maybe if u can post flyers in adjacent building about it and get a group together.. i think u will have more success than u are having alone : (

Posted by: scarter at September 28, 2009 2:09 PM

but scarter....restaurants are not supposed to have outdoor events and probably only recently decided to this.
There are regs and the business is not following. We all live near restaurants and businesses. If a developer/builder were violating noise law/working after hours there would be 100% condemnation here. But certain people think restaurants and bars are the cats meow and whatever they do is wonderful and we should thank them for existing.

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 28, 2009 2:22 PM

Restaurant or not, there are LAWS in this city regarding acceptable noise levels and hours, but good luck getting the police to enforce them!

Posted by: babs at September 28, 2009 2:23 PM

"please feel free to post your address so a few of us can park ourselves outside your bedroom windows for a fortnight while blaring music through some speakers."

Visit Ocean Avenue & Parkside. Let's see if your system can compete with the others in the neighborhood.

I doubt it.

Posted by: streber at September 28, 2009 2:42 PM

Thanks Pete & G Man. CB2 was a helpful lead.

Posted by: wyckoff at September 28, 2009 3:00 PM

If people like Fire Alarm Guy think people should tolerate noise in NYC then they can march down to City Hall and avail upon Bloomberg to repeal the noise code laws. As it is the laws do exist so here's a big "whatever" to that kind of totally lame, tedious response.

Posted by: traditionalmod at September 28, 2009 4:08 PM

Insert Snappy Name Here, you spoke for me!
Ridiculous to accept horrendous noise levels because
it's "the city"... contact your CB.

Posted by: bren at September 28, 2009 4:54 PM

Yeah noise sucks and the manager came off like an ass, but living on the 2nd floor, right above on restaurant on Smith street - I think you kind of asked for it.

Its like the people families who moved to Ludlow St in the LES in the past few years and then bitch about noise. Or the loftbuyers in Tribeca who complained about truck traffic and factory noise - the noise and the bullshit was there way before you were.

You likely moved/bought at Smith because it was cool to be on Smith St , w/ the bars and the restaurants and the pretty people and the F train. Its a busy commercial strip full of people eating and drinking all day and all night long.

At what point do people lose the right to bitch about noise - just folks who live near an airport or next to an elevated train?

Posted by: crazypants at September 28, 2009 5:07 PM

where did the person say lived on Smith????
and when did this obnoxious/intrusive trend of restaurants/bars using backyards begin?

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 28, 2009 5:12 PM

"You likely moved/bought at Smith because it was cool to be on Smith St , w/ the bars and the restaurants and the pretty people and the F train."

Ha! The pretty people I'm dying over here.

Sucks you may have to move away from Smith.

Posted by: jack slade at September 28, 2009 5:48 PM

Spot on Pete. I indeed never said I lived on Smith, nor that I rent an apt on the second floor above a restaurant; any intelligent heckler should have been able to figure that out.

Interesting what gets launched from behind the protective veil of anonymity.

Posted by: wyckoff at September 28, 2009 5:54 PM

still a pretty funny comment. cheers!

Posted by: jack slade at September 28, 2009 6:30 PM

I live next to a restaurant which uses it's backyard for events. Here are my suggestions:
1- go talk to the owner and/or managers of the restaurant during the day when it's not busy. It's fine to try to discuss the issue civilly with them. Relate your experience, ask for ground rules (like all amps inside by 10pm, all people inside by midnight on weekends and 11 on school nights.)
2- if it doesn't work (no apology, manager a jerk); start organizing your neighbors. Put the issue of restaurant noise on your agenda, and flyer the neighborhood ahead of the CB meeting.
3- you and your neighbors need to call 311 every time the rules are broken. Go to your precinct meeting and ask about the lack of follow-up on your calls. That will move them to action.

Posted by: Maly at September 28, 2009 6:40 PM

oh, and also contact city councilperson...Yassky is on way out running for another position...so looks like Mr. Levin will be elected in Nov...You can write as president of block association even if doesn't exist. Makes it look like larger number. Since he is new to representing the area he should be looking to impress community so contact him now.

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 28, 2009 7:35 PM

Why not let the market work its magic?
Boycott the restaurant, put up some signs
asking others not to go there, and set up a website.
After reading all this, I'm certainly not going to
go there again.

Posted by: statestreeter at September 28, 2009 7:58 PM

311 won't even answer the phone on a weekend. It's a joke.

Posted by: mopar at September 28, 2009 11:31 PM

There are City regs that establish how much noise from music a bar, restaurant, theater or club can cause to be heard in a nearby restaurant at certain hours of the day. Late at night, I believe it is 45 decibels, tops. Get yourself a simple volume meter and keep a log.

BTW, although irrelevant here, that responsibility extends even to keeping the noise below legal thresholds even for apartments directly above.

Posted by: slopefarm at September 29, 2009 9:31 AM

you might find this article interesting from brooklyneagle
about problem in BayRidge. Especially complaints to SLA
-state liquor authority...
http://www.brooklyneagle.com/categories/category.php?category_id=31&id=31006

Posted by: Petebklyn at September 29, 2009 10:31 AM

Insertsnappy- leave the diaphanous tough guy shit at log-in. Someone might take you up on your jest, which you could easily bypass on such a nice day.

OP- this is still Brooklyn. It was when you moved here, it shall be when you apprehend that it isn't the cookie cutter ignis fatuus you thought it to be.

The lingo sounds exhausted & unwelcoming- as it may be. We all need sleep and had we been neighbors, perhaps we'd of bumped elbows in this melee. Alas we are not, i still find you petulant, flaccid and although I would have never though to step foot in this hole, i now find myself second guessing-

Brooklyn 1, Fakes 0.

Posted by: Brooklynchimp at September 29, 2009 3:34 PM

"ts like the people families who moved to Ludlow St in the LES in the past few years and then bitch about noise"

???? No families move to Ludlow. Families have been here for 40 years and then have every single business around them turn into a bar or nightclub. Places like Club LIBATION have no business being on Ludlow. 3 floors of thunderous bass. This bar is notorious for serving alcohol to underage patrons.

Posted by: Blaut at October 10, 2009 11:45 PM