Forum
« Open Houses After Accepted Offer Built-In Shelving? »
June 4, 2009
Best Public Grade Schools in BK?
I know about insideschools.org. I know about the 3 or 4 good Public Schools in Park Slope. I know about Brooklyn Heights but other than that where are the good public grade schools in Brooklyn? Can someone with knowledge help me cut through the BS and let me know which hoods to narrow my search to?! Thanks!
Comments
I moved from Park Slope to Bay Ridge for more space and for good schools. PS 185 ranked in the top 10 in some city survery done a year or two ago and PS 102 also does very well. We are zoned for 185 and my son will be attending there starting this fall. Everyone I speak to has nothing but good things to say except for, of course, the crowding, just like every other public school. However they perform well despite the crowding conditions.
Good luck in your search. It can be exhausting.
Posted by: italiana71 at June 3, 2009 7:51 PM
We moved from Park Slope last year and although we considered many other areas for more affordable housing, we also have a preschooler so schools were a big factor. Bay Ridge was the best choice we could find. We are zoned for PS102 and have heard nothing but good things about the school from all our neighbors. It is a big school, but they seem to handle it very well. The nice thing about Bay Ridge is that there are several elementary schools here and I haven't heard anything really negative about any of them overall.
Posted by: mdmh at June 3, 2009 8:32 PM
321 is excellent.
Posted by: Arkady at June 3, 2009 8:51 PM
There's no quick answer to your question, and in fact, that's a good thing and says alot about how far schools have come in the last 5 or 6 years. PS 29 in Cobble Hill is another long-established popular elementary, and PS 58 in Carroll Gardens also has a great reputation among parents in the neighborhood. In Boerum Hill there's PS 261, and I understand there are many highly educated parents in Clinton Hill and Fort Greene using the public schools as well. There are also charter schools, accessible via lottery, like the Children's School and Brooklyn New School that are slightly easier to get into than they were in the past due to the neighborhood schools becoming so much better. You really need to talk to current parents and visit the schools to see the "vibe". Some are more progressive, some more academic, some very crowded, some not, and you need to weigh what you think fits best with your kids' needs and your own philosophy. But the nice thing is that as more affluent parents with young kids move into neighborhoods, the schools are improving in many many places.
Middle school is a different kettle of fish entirely, but, for example, District 15, which includes Park Slope, Cobble Hill, Carroll Gardens, Windsor Terrace, etc. already has a few middle schools that many kids attend.
Posted by: CGfan at June 3, 2009 9:00 PM
the problem is that every good school in brooklyn is oversubscribed thanks to bloombergs policy of rampant over development without increase in infrastructure..every school has waiting lists, and though you may be zoned for a school, there is no guarantee that here will actually be a place...
Posted by: eman1234 at June 3, 2009 10:08 PM
In no particular order...
PS 8 Brooklyn Heights
PS 10 Park Slope
PS 29 Cobble Hill
PS 58 Carroll Gardens
(I am a bit biased though, I'm a PS 29 graduate... many, many moons ago...)
Posted by: christopher at June 3, 2009 10:35 PM
Oh just go where the rich people and cheese boutiques are located.
Posted by: mopar at June 3, 2009 10:59 PM
The Children School a/k/s PS 372 is excellent on Carroll (btwn 3rd & 4th). Admittance by lottery only. It was formally a catholic school, now converted. Extended amount of funding and has so much to offer. Provides busing.
Posted by: Giovanna at June 4, 2009 7:47 AM
Great info guys, thanks so much!
Posted by: swade at June 4, 2009 9:49 AM
how are the middle schools in bay ridge?
Posted by: funkymonkey at June 4, 2009 9:59 AM
Mopar, perhaps you know of any grade schools that feature cheese boutiques? Or any cheese boutiques that offer grade schooling? I feel there is a lack of this kind of cross over for our little ones, especially in the Fort Greene/Clinton Hill area.
Posted by: iz at June 4, 2009 11:16 AM
Don't forget PS 154 (WT), PS 295 (South Slope) and PS 230 (Kensington)
Posted by: oe at June 4, 2009 11:41 AM
PS 58
PS 29
PS 321
Posted by: sebb at June 4, 2009 11:42 AM
I hear PS 295 is a great under the radar school. Some of the teachers that live nearby have told me the school has been zooming ahead with great programs and parent involvement.
I cant speak first hand though.
Posted by: newsouthsloper at June 4, 2009 11:43 AM
no joke here. wife is 10wks pregnant. renting in 321-zoned district. what should I do?
Posted by: joe_the_bummer at June 4, 2009 11:47 AM
"wife is 10wks pregnant. renting in 321-zoned district. what should I do?"
See a doctor
Posted by: newsouthsloper at June 4, 2009 11:50 AM
Like CGfan said, there isn't a real answer to that question. What's best is what's best for your child. Some schools have big reputations, like PS321 in Park Slope, other great schools are smaller and less well known, but just as great in their own way, if not better. In my opinion, parental involvement is what makes a public school great, so instead of browsing through test scores, check out the PTA at each school and what their budget is, and you'll get an idea of how the school is valued in the community. Where ever you find a group of parents that share your values and goals, you will probably find a school that fits for you.
Posted by: slopenick at June 4, 2009 11:50 AM
LOL newsloper... you're right, I need a psychiatrist! and a stiff drink. (oh yeah we have an OB already...)
I was thinking about showing up with an application "gender and name TBD" b/c I've heard this gets really nutty if you wait too long.
If you're on top of your sh!t and do everything on time, is it still a crap-shoot to get into your own zoned school?
Posted by: joe_the_bummer at June 4, 2009 12:02 PM
To eman1234, I agree about the over development problem, that was a big factor in us choosing Bay Ridge, there is no issue (yet!) about not getting into your zoned school. It's nice to have options, but if anyone prefers (as we did) to be able to send your kids to the local, well run, within walking distance, elementary school that most of the other kids on the block also attend then I would highly recommend looking into this area.
Funky Monkey: I have heard good things about McKinley, the middle school here in the Ridge. All the teens on our block attend.
Posted by: mdmh at June 4, 2009 12:16 PM
Slopenick said it best, but you have to talk to the teachers too. The parents can only do so much once the classroom doors are closed. In San Diego where I grew up it was always possible for prospective parents to sit in and watch a teacher in action - not sure if that ever happens here. I'd also ask to see some samples of student work (especially from older kids) so you know what your child will be doing down the road and what the expectations are. Wish I could say more, but I don't know much about elementary education in NYC, as I'm a high school teacher.
Posted by: sixyearsandcounting at June 4, 2009 12:32 PM
The real challenge is Middle Schools. My daughter was enrolled in MS 51 which was a big ho-hum. It's reputation was bogus to say the least. She got physically attacked at least once and was teased unmercifully by a gang of girls. Despite 51, she did ok academically and managed to get into the city's best high school which nearly lived up to the hyperbole.
I know there have been a few additions to middle schools in the area, but there's SO much attention paid to elementary schools and high schools in NY. Middle schools seem neglected.
I volunteer with an organization which involves middle schools from all over the city and I must say I am not hugely impressed with any of them. The private schools seem a little more sensitive to pre-teens but I am not sure it's worth 20K a year.
Anyhow, I'd love to inspire the stroller set to get active about middle schools - Clinton Hill and Fort Greene are especially under-served.
Posted by: Stonergut at June 4, 2009 1:02 PM
There are many schools with excellent reputations throughout Brooklyn. You need to consider what you can afford and how far you are willing to travel and what sort of amenities besides schools are non-negotiable for you. PS 321 you know about; PS 107 in the south slope is amazing with a very involved parent association; PS 154 in windsor terrace has interesting issues but will teach your children and offer enrichment; PS 230 in kensington manages to be diverse and cohesive at the same time; bay ridge schools truly are excellent, as are marine park schools, but you'll be in real brooklyn out there.
Posted by: lf2009 at June 4, 2009 1:18 PM
We like 154 - it is small, great teachers, good principal (not sure what the "interesting issues" are above?) Many of our friends like 10. Community Roots (lottery) in Ft Greene is great too. But the poster above who mentioned Brooklyn New School is wrong - that school is getting harder to get into, this year they had over 400 people on a kindergarten waiting list AFTER the classes were filled!
Posted by: WTbound at June 4, 2009 1:31 PM
Good point, Iz. I think they call it "the cheese gap."
Posted by: mopar at June 4, 2009 1:35 PM
our kid is far too young for me to speak with experience, but neighborhood folks have told me that PS 9 in prospect heights is very good and continuing to improve. since we already own in the area, our plan is to try it out for pre-K (if we get in) and at least the first couple years of grade school and see how it works for our kid.
people have talked about clinton hill and fort greene being underserved with respect to middle schools. i would add prospect heights in with that grouping - it is in the same district and shares very similar demographics.
keep in mind that, in addition to overcrowding, the DOE changes its rules every single year, and may in fact change zoning. this could be a big bummer for you if you buy based on zone well before your kids are in school, because the DOE could simply pull the rug out and send you somewhere else.
Posted by: i disagree at June 4, 2009 1:39 PM
prek and k changes each year. lots of great pre-k progams out there. we are going to 84 in williamsburg and inside schools lists it as a "model" for the city. there are 4 great public all day pre-k's in williamsburg: 132, 84, 17, and 110. 31 and 34 open up to full day for K. there's a great new charter for k. 84 has a great dual language program that starts in K as well.
for 1st on up, district 14 boasts 3 top top rated schools: 132, 34 and 31. (by both inside schools and the DOE).
also for prek and k, private schools: williamsburg northside, WNNS, St. Nicholas and brand new Montessori.
the parents/kids community is exploding here.
also, the schools are not over-crowded. if interested, check out the yahoo group: brooklynbabyhui - amazing parents - no BS or judgments. very supportive.
Posted by: wine lover at June 4, 2009 1:52 PM
both my girls are "graduates" of PS 261 in Boerum Hill. Very lovely experience, not perfect, but pretty damn good. don't forget for middle school and HS, commuting to manhattan is an option, too.
Posted by: kcf at June 4, 2009 1:55 PM
what do they do if your zoned school is full? do they just sign your kid up for the closest one with openings? or do you sort of apply to a lot of them and send your kid to the one that you think works the best?
Posted by: joe_the_bummer at June 4, 2009 2:16 PM
Joe, I'm not sure the DOE knows what to do with the zoned overflow. From what I've heard, it's really a debacle and a scary one at that. We jumped through big hoops to get into our zoned school (selling our old place, and now renting - but by luck wound up selling at the peak as a result) and the idea, after all that, of not getting in would have been devastating, and yet that's what's happening to many families. It's one of the huge failures of Bloomberg. Any one have any concrete updates? As for which schools are "best" there does seem to be a huge spectrum of opinion, since personal preferences are so different. When I was researching schools, I found lots of conflicting advice (lauding and tearing down the same school) - so ultimately, you have to do your own research, decide for yourself, and choose what's right for YOUR individual kid(s).
Posted by: Miss Muffett at June 4, 2009 2:28 PM
Because of severe overcrowding in the "hot" known good schools, you can expect in-zone lotteries and re-zoning in the next few years. The safest bet would be to live in the middle of several good schools. For example, PS 29 (excellent) in Cobble Hill is immediately adjacent to PS 261 and PS 58, both very good schools. PS 29 is over capacity with in-zone kids, but PS 261 and 58 are still accepting out-of-zone kids -- there's room there.
I believe -- but don't know -- that the schools immediately adjacent to extremely overcrowded PS 321 aren't so good. Not my nabe, so I await correction!
The great news, though, is that the situation for elementary schools is fairly fluid. Today's mediocre school could be next year's hot school. With new leadership, it can really happen that fast.
As you look, of course, know your school boundaries. Real estate agents aren't necessarily up to speed.
Posted by: Brooklyn Chicken at June 4, 2009 2:58 PM
"Despite 51, she did ok academically and managed to get into the city's best high school."
What, in your opinion, is the city's best high school? Even if one accepts the idea that there can be such a thing, given how varied kids' social and academic styles area, it seems there would be many candidates.
Posted by: Sparafucile at June 4, 2009 3:00 PM
Brooklyn Chicken - PS 39 and 107 are right near 321 and many people like them and think they are very good (though again, some don't, but I found that was true even with the "famous" 321).
Posted by: Miss Muffett at June 4, 2009 3:03 PM
i have been told by parents of out-of-zone kids at 261 and 58 that they are not accepting any more OOZ kids unless they're siblings (and even then, maybe not). would be happy to find out that this is wrong info.
Posted by: i disagree at June 4, 2009 3:46 PM
My kids went to 261 and it was fine. The diversity (no group is a majority) and faculty are great but the test scores are lower than 29 and 321 and test prep regime was a drag.
This may have changed, but zoned schools did not have to enroll all comers in kindergarten, which is considered optional, but they used to have to take first grade and up if you lived in the zone. Anyone know if that's still true?
Posted by: trudylou at June 4, 2009 4:33 PM
I agree with wine lover (for once, heh) -- Williamsburg schools are underrated and uncrowded. I am bullish on them.
Is the new G&T at PS 20 in Clinton Hill/Fort Greene going to include a middle school?
And does anyone know anything about the G&T middle school in Bushwick?
Mopar, cheese shops, you are teh win. And, sadly or not, that's pretty damn accurate.
Posted by: Heather at June 4, 2009 5:07 PM
In FG/Clinton Hill, PS 11 and Community Roots are both good. Although she hasn't been in place for very long, PS 46 has a new principal who is said to be terrific. PS 8 in Brooklyn Heights is excellent, though it has gotten so crowded that it rarely has room for students who are not zoned for it (Brooklyn Heights and DUMBO).
The real problem in District 13 is middle school. Arts and Letters, which shares a building with PS 20, is a well-regarded new school--but last year they had 1,000 applicants for 80 places. MS 113 is said by some to be good, but I don't think they have a great track record with placing students in the top-tier high schools, with the exception of LaGuardia: 113 is deservedly proud of its selective arts program. The new gifted school at PS 20 does not have a middle school component. While several of its elementary schools have improved in recent years, District 13 still badly needs selective, first-rate middle schools. I hope this will change in the next few years.
Posted by: since 2000 at June 4, 2009 5:52 PM
Middle schools in Bay Ridge also do pretty well. I also hear good reviews from the parents that have their children there.
Posted by: italiana71 at June 4, 2009 6:36 PM
Miss Muffet, glad to hear of the good options in Park Slope.
i disagree, 261 and 58 officially do not take out of zone kids (and really don't for pre-K), but unofficially they do for K and up. So, if the excrement blows widely from 29, there is room in both those schools.
For the OP, pre-K is a separate deal. The UPK ("universal" pre-kidergarten) program is run independently of the elementary schools they are in, and they are usually all pretty high quality. So, an iffy elementary school can have a great pre-K. Pre-K admissions are also run separately -- or the Board of Ed is trying to run them separately -- and at present admission to a "hot" school's pre-K is no guarantee of ongoing attendance at said school, unless you are in-zone or a sibling.
I hope and trust this is all sufficiently confusing. :)
Posted by: Brooklyn Chicken at June 4, 2009 7:45 PM
I sent three kids through PS 321, and, with a few hiccups here and there, I have to say it was an excellent experience. One of my children attended MS 51, and I have to agree, it is terribly overrated. Yes, a lot of kids really do love the "talent" programs there, but the academics leave a lot to be desired, and, of course, the facility itself is dismal. Another child did not get into her top 3 MS choices, and ended up at Collaborative. It is sub-par, at best. Another child, with special needs, attended New Horizons. it was actually a great experience - he really excelled and transitioned into a very good mainstream Manhattan HS. That said, he did work extremely hard and made the most of his situation.
Anyone looking for a good primary school should keep their eyes open with respect to district MS options as well. Do you really want your 6th grader commuting 1 1/2 hours each way to MS? Also, from what I've been told, schools that previously accepted children borough-wide, will now only be accepting kids within district. This includes Twain, one of the top MS choices in the city, and Bay Academy as well (an easy commute for DP families).
HS is another kettle of fish - kids are old enough to commute and there are many good options. Best in the city? Hunter, Bard and Stuy, IMO.
Bay Ridge may well offer the best options for families planning to go public for the long haul.
Posted by: Architerrorist at June 4, 2009 8:13 PM
Architerrorist:
Bay Academy is now closed to out of district students, but Mark Twain is still citywide admissions.
Posted by: since 2000 at June 4, 2009 10:00 PM
We have come a long way in HS quality. I am not sure there is one best but there are "best in area" Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, Beacon, Laguardia, Midwood HS, Telecommunication Arts in Bay Ridge, Bard Early College, Townsend Harris, Cardoza, NYC Lab School for Collaborative Studies, Bronx Academy of Letters.
It to some degree depends on how your defining "best".
Posted by: Brooklyn11218 at June 5, 2009 2:39 PM
Post a comment
Please be patient while your comment is published. It may take a moment.