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May 11, 2009
"Sold as is" Properties
I saw a home listed with the message "Property Sold Totally As Is. No Representations or Warranties. Purchaser Pays Transfer Tax & Stamps." Should one be cautious about these type of properties? Is it safe to assume there are issues with the home? Has anyone bought a home listed with "no warranty". Also, what does one "pay stamps" mean?
Thanks!
Comments
I bought my house "as is" - which meant that when I went through my pre-buying inspection I didn't expect the buyer to fix broken lights, toilets, outlets, etc. Seems to me you should go through with an engineer and do an agressive inspection so your price reflects the cost of what is probably a gut job.
Posted by: Putnamdenizen at May 11, 2009 11:28 AM
Meaning, making sure no structural issues that I will have to spend hundreds of thousands spending?
I am fine with spending $ on fixes such as outlets, toilets, etc.
But if its anything major, no go.
Do you think if I ask the agent about the condition they will flat out lie? or play the "i dont know card". Can you recommend a trust worthy inspector/engineer?
Posted by: guikazoid at May 11, 2009 11:33 AM
Also, what if an engineer says its OK then come three months later theres an issue. Can that engineer be held responsible?
Posted by: guikazoid at May 11, 2009 11:41 AM
Engineers won't come out and say it's "ok". They phrase things in terms of possible expected time until something needs to be repaired or replaced, along with a ballpark estimate on cost. At least, that's what ours did.
I'm sure that an inspection is not a guarantee either. If you buy it, it will be yours.
Posted by: corolla at May 11, 2009 11:46 AM
Always use your own engineer for the inspection. Discuss with them, upfront, the details of the inspection (guarantees or warranties on the inspection).
Regardless of how the property is marketed get your own lawyer and inspector (not necessarily ones recommended by the sellers realtor) to watch out for your needs and concerns.
I walked away from a building after my inspector found over $200k worth or structural issues. It cost me the inspection fee and what not, but it was better than buying the property and having to redo the front and back walls...
Posted by: christopher at May 11, 2009 11:48 AM
How much do inspectors / engineers charge for an assessment?
Posted by: guikazoid at May 11, 2009 1:01 PM
I believe there was a discussion here a few weeks back that the going rate for an engineer inspection is 600 "and up" (presumably depending on the size of the building).
We paid $600 5 years ago for a 4 story brownstone.
Posted by: phripley at May 11, 2009 2:11 PM
Heimer does very thorough inspections and tend to err on the pessimistic side in repair estimates. $600 is about right.
Posted by: geekspice at May 11, 2009 2:58 PM
If someone is advertising a house like that, it's because the place is a disaster. Just because you can't find all the problems doesn't mean they're not there. If an old house (like a 100+ year old brownstone) hasn't been actively maintained and updated through the years, you're likely to be facing problems with the wiring, the plumbing, the roof, and possibly the structure (especially if there were weird previous renovations that don't quite look right but you can't put your finger on why).
Expect your engineer to miss things. Possibly major things. Not because he's crooked or dumb, but just because it's nearly impossible for him to discover everything that's wrong with a disaster. Even going into places that I *knew* were trouble, looking hard for problems, I've still always been surprised (and never pleasantly).
A renovation project is going to run you at least $200/sqft. Keep that in mind when looking at this house.
Posted by: vanyali at May 11, 2009 4:53 PM
Heimer is known to kill deals
sooo - if the place is AS IS and you want a thorough inspection - i would hire heimer
Posted by: gemini10 at May 11, 2009 8:32 PM
""Property Sold Totally As Is. No Representations or Warranties. Purchaser Pays Transfer Tax & Stamps."
These words are used on FORECLOSURE and Bank Owned REO properties. All it means is that you BETTER know EXACTLY what you are doing.
Any seller can sell AS-IS... but when you see the words "Buyer pays Transfer Tax & Stamps", it means that the BUYER pays the SELLERS closing fees. NYC charges the SELLER 1% and NYS charges the SELLER 4/10% (((( 1.4% )))). The seller then makes the buyer pay these fees. It might be worth it if you're buying a property for $250K that's worth $400K after investing $50K...
BE CAREFUL... but watch for a good deal...
Posted by: howrealnyc at May 12, 2009 12:39 AM
this home is listed in the 400s in a block that homes are at 900k to 1.2m.
the seller said the home "has lots of work" to be done. im trying to see what "lots" = in terms of dollars.
Posted by: guikazoid at May 12, 2009 11:28 AM
Sounds like the seller is open to telling you about the work the place needs. Maybe you could ask? Don't expect a complete run-down, but the more info the better, right?
If the place is around 2,000 sqft (?) and you spend $200/sqft fixing it, then (from the numbers you've given us) it looks like you end up ahead of the game by $100k. So, if you have the money and don't mind taking on a big project, this might be a good deal.
Posted by: vanyali at May 12, 2009 11:40 AM
1. you need to do your own inspection before hand.
2. You must have a lawyer do a title search and get title insurance.
Pretty much all property is sold as is really...its buyer beware. The warranties and reps normally are only as to title issues...its a word of art...
Posted by: smeyer418 at May 12, 2009 3:19 PM
I disagree with the issue of the stamps and transfer tax, yes these are fees the state charges to record the deed and transfer the ownership but who pays these are a matter of convention not state law. The State doesn't care who pays them as long as they are paid. Traditionally in NY the seller pays these fees but not always and its not required by law.
Posted by: smeyer418 at May 12, 2009 3:39 PM
and its not necessarily a foreclosure. Sometimes its an estate issue and sometimes it just someone wanting to sell something quickly.
Posted by: smeyer418 at May 12, 2009 3:40 PM
I'd look out with "As-Is." It could refer to the condition of the property (as another poster noted it could be a shambles) but it could also refer to the quality of the title.
Your seller might be trying to pass off a quitclaim deed or sell you a property that he doesn't have clear title to and therefore can't legally sell. If you decide to investigate the purchase make sure you have an attorney carefully review all the paperwork and make sure that you get a good, thorough title search and title insurance policy!
Posted by: speedboy10 at May 12, 2009 4:58 PM
one more point make sure the contract allows you only to close if you can obtain good and clear marketable title to the property free and clear of all liens and encumberances. You should care less about what the seller represents or warrants other then they are who they say they are and own the property-
Posted by: smeyer418 at May 12, 2009 9:48 PM
and pay the increased premium for the title that will reimburse you the value of the property and not just what you paid for it.
Posted by: smeyer418 at May 12, 2009 9:48 PM
and finally any one can sell what ever right they have to a property(that is what a quit claim deed is) but you take it subject to any lien that is of record(this is a notice and record state- some states aren't)
Posted by: smeyer418 at May 12, 2009 9:51 PM
"If you decide to investigate the purchase make sure you have an attorney carefully review all the paperwork and make sure that you get a good, thorough title search and title insurance policy!"
Are there EVER any times when a buyer wouldn't want to do all these things on ANY RE purchase?
I bought my house "as is" many years ago from an elderly women in a nursing home who was being represented by her nephew. He lived on the east end of L.I. and didn't want to be bothered with coming to Brooklyn. Actually, he was obviously AFRAID of coming to Brooklyn and, in 1974, might well have been right,although it didn't seem so to someone young and foolish like me.
I knew that the house had been neglected for years and needed new plumbing, roof, electric service, etc. What attracted me was that all the details were intact AND that the house was priced at 1/2 the going rate for the neighborhood. The inspection confirmed what I already knew, but what I was really interested in was whether the house had any serious structural defects that would make the deal untenable. I was quite happy with an engineering report that pointed out many problems, but NOT a concern that the house was about to collapse. 34v years later,I'm glad to report that all went well.
Posted by: Bob Marvin at May 12, 2009 9:58 PM
federated did a very thorough home inspection for me two weeks ago, and they charge only $500 which includes a termite inspection. http://www.fcshomeinspectors.com/
as bob mentioned above, an inspection should be done by any buyer looking at any property. without a professional eye you might get yourself into an ugly situation.
Posted by: sweetser at May 13, 2009 8:33 AM
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