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April 1, 2009

Getting Mugged in Park Slope

I mentioned this incident on one of the threads, and promised to tell the whole story – so here it is:

My wife and I had just finished dinner at a friend’s place on 1st and 8th, and were on our way back to our home on 7th and Garfield, just two blocks away. We were pretty buzzed up – definitely not doing the “don’t-F-with-me” walk that we’ve all perfected, just strolling home in our safe neighborhood. Well, we were walking down the hill on Garfield when two young guys came along in the other direction, one sort of hanging on the other one, just monkeying around, maybe telling a joke. We didn’t pay any attention to them. They just looked like regular kids, maybe about 20 years old. My wife has been in Brooklyn since she was six, and I’ve been in NYC for 11 years, and we’ve trained our selves that even if you are scared of scary looking people, you probably do worse for yourself by showing it. So there was every reason to ignore them like you ignore everyone else on the sidewalk.
Right when they were passing us, one of them just said something like “what’s up”, and I turned around to see him standing about a stride away, pointing a gun at me – he didn’t have a very aggressive look on his face – more like a raised-eyebrow look, as if to say, “clearly, I’m the one who gets the money in this situation, so do what you need to do”
I’m not totally clear what was going on with my wife. She ran up the hill a few strides, and ended up wrestling with the other guy for her bag and screaming. I was obviously powerless to help, and I just focused on making the thing end as soon as possible. I figured that all they wanted to do was run to the park with our stuff, and the guy didn’t really look like he was going to shoot us.
So I told the guy “I guess you’re gonna need this”, and handed over my wallet, and then started shouting at my wife to give up her bag, which she did…but only after I shouted three times. I was mostly worried that the guy was going to slug her to get her to shut up, but luckily, she did on her own and the guys took off up the hill.
We dusted ourselves off, and looked up to see someone in the second story window of a brownstone right above us, and we yelled to him to call 911. Oddly, (there is always at least one totally surreal thing in this kind of story) the guy just stood there staring at us, like he was watching TV. We had to yell at him three or four times to call before he finally disappeared into his apartment.
Then we walked about halfway down the block, and wouldn’t you know it, a police cruiser was right there. We ran up to it, and the cop had her radio out before we even got to the door (they’re trained to look for freaked-out people running at them). She goes, “get in”, and blasts out our description of the two guys, pops a u-turn, and starts flying up Garfield, asking us for any other details we could remember. In less then a minute, we had already passed a few other cruisers swarming around looking for these guys. Within about two minutes, they had a guy with his hands on a wall, surrounded by about 10 police officers on foot. One of the cops had my wallet, and asked me to identify it, which I did.
We actually refused to ID the guy, which disappointed the cops a little. The reason was that – well, they say in that situation, the victims usually do a great job identifying the gun, because that’s what they are looking at the whole time. That is spot on. When the cops took us to the bushes where they found a gun, I had no problem identifying it. I do have to say there was some pressure to ID the guy, and we just couldn’t be 100% sure and didn’t want to guess. A lot of people would match the description we gave, and we didn’t want any innocent people to get locked up.
As it turned out, they arrested they guy on the following: 1) he matched our basic description, 2) they found my wallet and the gun within a couple of blocks of him, 3) he couldn’t explain why he was in the neighborhood, 4) someone of the same description had run from another cruiser just a minute or so earlier, and 5) his heart was racing. When pressed, he said he had been jogging, and he was wearing street clothes.
The cops took us back to the station, where they took every last detail of our story and again asked us to try to ID the “perp”. Again we refused, and we refused to look at mug shots, because we are aware of what it can do to a victim’s memory when one of the mugshots matches the suspect. We were there until about 3:30, and they drove us home. Aside from a little bit of pressure to get a positive id on their perp, they were totally professional, and really nice to us. They offered us coffee, drove us home, and answered all of our questions, even the ones unrelated to the case (how common is this, is crime increasing, etc.)
Here are a few take-aways: This crime was not that common, and busting one was a pretty good score for the precinct (honestly I have to say it was very impressive how fast they acted, and they deserve major kudos). The gun was a loaded semi-automatic with five rounds in it, so if you think guys are doing this with fake guns, it’s not wise to gamble on it. The crime that they see a lot of in the area that you might not expect is burglary, right in the middle of the day while people are at work. And (maybe this is common sense to some): The blocks close to the park are an ideal place to mug someone, because the mugger can run into the park – so at the margin, 6th ave is safer than 8th.
The following Saturday, two of the cops involved came and served us with subpoenas, just basically requiring us to come and give our story in court. Even though we didn’t visually ID the “perps”, we did press charges Thursday night on the logic that if the cops had enough evidence for the case to stand up on its own, we felt a duty to get a criminal off the streets. It turned out to be the right move, because as we found out Saturday, the guy confessed to the whole thing, and even turned in his friend. He was 19, and from Jamaica (explaining his economy of words during the incident). His friend was 16, from Brooklyn, and endowed with the good sense to deny being anywhere near the crime scene.
So, long story short, the 16 year old is back in high school, and the 19 year old broke down and confessed again to the ADA in Brooklyn Superior Court. We were there the following Wednesday to give a recorded statement in front of a grand jury, in case the plea bargain fell through. The charge was first degree armed robbery, which carries a mandatory minimum of five years for the first offense. He was overstaying his visa, and he’ll probably bargain for two years and deportation. Notably, the DA’s paperwork indicated that we had visually identified the suspect, and when we corrected it we were given a lecture about how a lot of people flake out under pressure and change their story. So we had to insist again that we could not ID the guy, and never did, and the ADA had to change the case to base it on the confession instead of the ID. To me, the scary lesson in that was that a visual ID would have been very powerful evidence, powerful enough so that they were not even going to need the confession to move the case on (I think that’s the “indictment”). Of course you hope that a good lawyer would hack away at our ID, but you never know. We’ve all seen “dateline” type shows about wrongful convictions, but it was really shocking to realize first hand how easy it would have been to send an innocent person to jail if we had wanted to.
Anyway, we’re ok, and we’re over it, other than being just a little more spooked by random people lurking around the park.

Comments

Great story and am glad you got through it unharmed. I really do find it hard to believe that you couldn't ID the guy when it just happened 10 minutes prior.

Posted by: dosteov at April 1, 2009 1:33 PM

you could not ID a guy that just 10 minutes before stuck a gun in your face and threatened your wife, sorry dude that is kind of pathetic.

Posted by: billyboomer at April 1, 2009 1:40 PM

Thanks for sharing the story.

FWIW, I was on a jury once for an armed robbery where the victim would not ID the suspect.

The rest of the evidence was pretty strong, but it was hard to reach a guilty verdict without the suspect ID'ing the guy.

We actually did convict, but only have a lot of deliberations and we nearly hung over it. Some stuff the judge told us after the case (that I guess was inadmissible) made it more clear that the suspect was guilty, but it was still a tough case.

Posted by: northsloperenter at April 1, 2009 1:42 PM

I agree it's bizarre and I have no explanation for it -- I felt like a retard, but they say it's not uncommon.. I truly thought they'd run off and we'd just go home and call our credit card companies. never expected to see a cop so soon.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 1:45 PM

Joe
thanks for sharing your story. Am impressed that NYPD reacted so fast and treated you like victims and not like you were annoying them.
I really feel that man who was standing there watching it from his window was the coward.

Posted by: gemini10 at April 1, 2009 1:51 PM

crazy story. it is much easier, and more comforting if you have a confession, or a visual ID, but ultimately, stories like these make me glad that you aren't required by law to have them to convict someone. leave it up to the juries to decide whether the corroborating evidence is strong enough to overcome weaknesses in IDs.

Posted by: i disagree at April 1, 2009 1:56 PM

Sorry to hear about your experience, that's really horrible you had to go through that.

But I think you're insistence on the police "pressure" for a positive ID is misplaced, if you can pardon my critique. Police and DA's are used to victims having some degree of recognition of an assailant (or their jacket, glasses, etc). They are not at that point arguing about 100% certainty, just "yeah that's him," so someone having qualms about that may have seemed overly legalistic to them. Or maybe question what else you weren't certain about recalling the event. I'm sure they were just not used to it, and a little baffled.

Not that you're wrong to do what you did -- just that I can see why you got that pressure.

Posted by: Smokychimp at April 1, 2009 2:24 PM

You're a faggot & a pussy. Stupid liberal douche! "Oh, I don't want to ID the perp. He may be innocent" Fuch off, mate! I wish he pistol whipped yo' liberal white ass. Faggot!

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 2:25 PM

You told the story so well. I wish you peace.

Posted by: infinitejester at April 1, 2009 2:26 PM

just for the avoidance of doubt, my last post was an answer to dosteov. billyboomer, I hadn't seen your comment. you're a dick.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 2:29 PM

Any of you questioning Joe's ability to ID the suspect should try to put yourself in his shoes. It has never happened to me so I don't know what I would or wouldn't remember but I can certainly understand that those moments are not like normal life moments and I admire Joe for not lashing out and just saying yeah that's him if he wasn't sure. Thanks for sharing Joe.

Posted by: wasder at April 1, 2009 2:34 PM

Joe Bummer,

billyboomer is spot on, brotha. You white liberal upwardly mobile folk are sad & pathetic. No wonder my black brethren find it easy to mug yo' pasty ass. You're still a pussy for not id'ing a clearly, guilty man. Gee, I wonder how many black men in PS would be holding your wallet? Is it that they all look the same to you? Faggot

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 2:36 PM

Wasder,

If I see a gangsta in a hood where he don't belong & there's a stashed gun & my wallet nearby, Lord knows I be fingering that brotha & sending his ass off to jail.

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 2:38 PM

Jesus Christ. Welcome to brooklyn, joe_the_bummer.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 2:41 PM

Im glad you came out unscathed. And its good to know the police reacted so quickly and with results.

Those guys are really lucky they ran into you. I'd say 99% of people would have ID'd them without even a second thought to their rights or possible wrongful identities.

And we are all really lucky that this guy was dumb enough to confess otherwise there would be two more criminals on the street.

Posted by: Mrs. Limestone at April 1, 2009 2:45 PM

PropJoe, lemme get this straight. You are black. My description was "two black men". It's pretty clear from the timing that the cops grabbed the NEXT black guy they saw on the street. You are saying that because I didn't immediately put him away, I'm a pussy. Do I have that right?

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 2:49 PM

All I be saying, Bummer is that the gun was nearby & he had your wallet. 2 + 2 = 4. How many 16 year old black thugs are running around PS holding a gun & you wallet? That's one less criminal on the street. Do you civic duty next time, you schmuck. You probably bash cops on the side for fun, right? I'm sure you shop @ PS Coop too.

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 2:58 PM

Mrs Limestone -- you think I should have made a guess to keep your streets a little safer?

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 2:58 PM

I know exactly what you mean about not being positive about recognition. Having grown up in the south and having seen or read about many of my classmates being arrested, or even jailed, for being just in the wrong place at the wrong time or just looking like someone else, I feel very strongly about being positive before making accusations.

Years ago, in the days before cell phones, I lived in on of those cast iron front buildings right above the C train station in Fort Greene. One day my roommate, a Cypriot who had fled Nicosia during the war with Turkey, and I had a party and some of the guests, suburban New Jersey residents, left the street door open. Well three would-be robbers showed up, two pointing guns. The three yelled for people to turn over their money while they all stepped futher into the apartment. My roommate and I saw that the didn't have the door covered and ran into the street. We tried to stop cars but everyone drove on. We called the police from the corner pay phone.

When we got back to the apartment munutes later with the police we found that my roommates brother had grabbed one of the guys and thrown him against the wall and taken his gun. The robbers had all run away. They had taken one person's pocketbook.

We rode around the neighborhood with the police to look for the guys but all I could tell was that they were young, medium height, thin and black. They all had sweatshirts tied up around their faces leaving only a tiny opening. We thought we saw one of the guys in front of the Atlantic Terminal Houses but couldn't be positive.

We went to the police station and looked at piles of mug shots. Lots of very young boys. Many in tears.

We didn't ID anyone. We couldn't be certain.


Posted by: Bessie at April 1, 2009 2:59 PM

Glad you're ok. And never mind the trolls, I would not feel bad for not being able to identify the guy. Similar situation happened to me 5 or 6 years ago. My instinct was to look away the whole time and I couldn't ID the guy they caught who had mugged someone else a few blocks away. The cops were a bit frustrated with me, as I'm sure it was a no-brainer to them....

Posted by: squaredrive at April 1, 2009 3:00 PM

PropJoe what the hell is your problem? fEELINg alittle insecure about yourself? need to distance yourself from the pussys and faggots? whats this I always hear about all you guys on the down low? Do you have any idea how stupid you sound?

Posted by: tsarina at April 1, 2009 3:04 PM

What is this ghetto act that PropJoe puts on???? What a loser.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 3:04 PM

Why you be hating on me DIBs?

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 3:09 PM

joe -
Based on your story, you werent sure if these guys were the criminals or victims at the time of the arrest. If you felt the streets would be safer without these guys on it, then you wouldn't have been making a guess at all.

Im not suggesting you do anything. Im stating the facts they were lucky to find you and we are all lucky one of them confessed. Anything I said not true?

Posted by: Mrs. Limestone at April 1, 2009 3:09 PM

I suspect its probably an act and he has no actual personality. It just sounds all too stupid to be real.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 3:09 PM

P-Joe -- just to be clear, the perp didn't have my wallet. the cops found it on the sidewalk more than a block away. same with the gun. You have no idea how tempting it was to just say it was the guy. It's a Yes or No question. Arrest the first black guy we see?

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 3:14 PM

Joe, glad everything came out alright. Hope too your wife is feeling OK. I also respect the fact that you stood up against making a ID if you couldn't stand behind it. If the cops were worth their salt, they had a wallet and a gun to fingerprint, far better evidence cuz yeah it's a well known fact eyewitness ID is unreliable. Just ask the 200+ men released from jail on rape charges via DNA testing over the past few years.

Still, after all that, I think you need to train your memory or vision better, in case it happens again. After all, you stated that the guy had a 'raised eyebrow' expression. In that look, you should have been able to ascertain his skin tone, features, and clothing at a bare minimum.

Three kids tried to rob me in Ft. Greene Park a number of months ago, they backed off when I wasn't gonna give it up. But in that same glance when I called it in I got height, weight, skin tone, clothes including color and pattern of doorag, item of jewelry, and probable national origin. The cops picked them up in the park by the PJs and I had no trouble accurately IDing them.

Posted by: denton at April 1, 2009 3:18 PM

"If you felt the streets would be safer without these guys on it, then you wouldn't have been making a guess at all."

Are you suggesting that he should have made a judgement call that this guy was a criminal and falsely ID'd him as the perp?

Posted by: squaredrive at April 1, 2009 3:20 PM

PropJoe: answer the question, faggot.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 3:22 PM

When I was looking for a house in Bed Stuy I saw this young kid walk out of a house in street duds, doo rag, etc. He made a call on his cell phone and it went something like this: "Hello, Mrs, Jones. This is so and so. I'm going to be about 5 minutes late for my piano lesson." As I walked past him he said "hello."

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 3:27 PM

Seriously, Prop Joe, you are an idiot. It could have been you (if you really are black and not some race-baiting dick), wrongly ID'd, doing a 5-year mandatory minimum bid. Visual identification is notoriously inaccurate, particularly in cases where a weapon is present and where the perpetrator is a different race than the victim. There are dozens of criminological studies supporting this. Real research, not your preposterous pseudo-ghetto posturing. Joe the Bummer did exactly the right thing. Why don't you educate yourself a bit? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eyewitness_identification

Posted by: Frederick Law Homestead at April 1, 2009 3:38 PM

I would guess that PropJoe is a middle-aged white guy with a red face and a beer gut who likes to pretend he used to be in the military but failed the physical or something when he tried to get in. Pretty easy to see through his routine.

Posted by: lechacal at April 1, 2009 3:39 PM

Bwahaha!

Bummer,

I just think you're lying when you said you couldn't id given you're wife put up a struggle. It's must've been a good 180 seconds of id time before they fled. Story seems false.

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 3:43 PM

Lechacal,

What does red face have to do with white people? I don't get it. Red face? What does that refer to?

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 3:44 PM

He may have actually been in the Army and got a Chapter 15 Discharge for his covert activities in the showers.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 3:46 PM

I dropped the soap one too many times.

Posted by: PropJoe at April 1, 2009 3:48 PM

thanks fred and lecherous cal. I don't know propjoe's work. I think he was baiting me to say something racist. which is strange since I bent over backwards not to DO anything racist. the "why you be hating on me" thing gave it away. I didn't want this thing to be about race.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 3:49 PM

What people chose to hear happened was that the police found a gun and wallet on the guy and you refused to id him. What you said was they had a guy in custody and they thought it was him because he was found within a couple blocks of the items. I would argue (as a defense lawyer) that if you had id'ed him it was tainted by you being asked to id the wallet first. Those who have disdain for your inability to make an identification have either (a) never had a gun pointed in their face or (b) never mistaken who their waiter was at a restaurant even though they have looked at them in a non-stressful situation. It is hard to identify someone. Sorry, I know people want to believe otherwise, but they are simply wrong.

That Jon Brownstoner allows PropJoe to use his homophobic language on this site reflects poorly upon him and his ability to maintain traffic without nutcases being allowed to spread their bile. It is not okay, no more than equivalent racist or sexist language would be okay.

Posted by: Putnamdenizen at April 1, 2009 4:00 PM

Propjoe, no way -- 10-15 seconds top, start to finish. I saw a gun, and a guy holding it. it was more the posture than his actual eyebrows that led me to say what I did about his "expression". my focus went 1) gun, 2) my wallet, 3) my wife struggling with the other perp, and getting her to let go of her bag.

anyone who thinks I'm going to start inspecting the guy's face, you're f*cking crazy. good way to get shot. for what? you think I'm going to do a little clothing inventory on him so the cops can clean up the streets for you guys? F*ck you! how about NOT GETTING SHOT? anyone who thinks they'd do better, good luck.

all others, thanks for your support

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 4:02 PM

These string of posts contain such offensive language that it makes me wonder if I should keep on clicking on Brownstoner forum posts. It is completely uncalled for. I am actually angry now.

Posted by: dutchman at April 1, 2009 4:05 PM

Putnam...that has happened to me many times...not being able to recognize which waiter/waitress was ours 5 minutes after he/she just spoke to us and walked away

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 4:10 PM

dutchman...you can't blame the majority and Mr. B for the assinine comments of one person. I suspect its too much work for Mr B to monitor every post.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 4:11 PM

PropJoe: The red face can be a good indicator for things like alcoholism, anger, years of repressed urges, and staying up late in a "den" masturbating over back issues of Guns n' Ammo.

Posted by: lechacal at April 1, 2009 4:12 PM

putnam -- thanks so much for that intelligent comment. The waiter analogy is exactly how it was. I think it's fascinating that propjoe read what he read from my story. And I absolutely agree with you that the ID would be tainted. that was something I really wanted to get across-- that the whole experience was full of subtle and not-so-subtle suggestion that the guy they caught was the guy who did it. The cops continually referred to the suspect as "the guy who robbed you". once, a senior guy in the department (don't know what rank) came in and just stated, "that guy who robbed you, he's a bad guy". I asked "how do you know, have you had him in here before?". He goes, "no, but he's a bad guy. I can tell he's a bad guy."

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 4:17 PM

oh right, apologies to everyone for returning the homophobic language to propjoe in a playground-level challenge. no offense meant, dibs. it's hardwired and I'll try not to do it anymore.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 4:21 PM

joe: I'm OK with your not ID'ing the guy, but I'm definitely going to side with the cop on his instinct as to who the bad guys are. A senior cop knows a hell of a lot better than any of us who the bad guys are. And no, they don't have to be looking at a rap sheet. A guy who has spent years of his life dealing with perps probably has pretty damn good instincts as to who is up to no good. Police work is not academia.

Posted by: lechacal at April 1, 2009 4:21 PM

Exactly, joe...just like I could tell the guy who I related the story above was a bad guy by the way he dressed.!!!!

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 4:22 PM

"No wonder my black brethren find it easy to mug yo' pasty ass."

Nice try. You are not a black person.

Posted by: East New York at April 1, 2009 4:26 PM

got you dibs. lech we can agree to disagree. I felt a strong sense that the precinct got a "score" if they got a conviction. they filled out a form that said: number of perptrators: 2. number apprehended: 1. clearly pointing to some kind of stat-keeping. I think their performance stats are a big deal, and maybe bigger than exactly having the right guy.

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 4:27 PM

ENY was my white ass meant to be patsy or pasty? Both would work grammatically, and unfortunately, both are correct. Excuse my complete racial ignorance, but I don't think real black people actually spell out their speech inflections the way Mark Twain did

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 4:31 PM

Aks me if I care.

Posted by: daveinbedstuy at April 1, 2009 4:37 PM

When I was training to be a resident adviser in college I received instruction on identifying a perpetrator and properly describing a dangerous situation. One day later we all went out to a retreat location for "bonding". While there, at meal time, someone broke thru the doors yelling and demanding that we all give him our wallets, purses, etc.

Some of us ducked behind furniture, most froze, but less than a minute later our instructor and two local plain clothes police officers let us know that this was a setup and a training follow-up. Once we got over being pissed, we were asked to describe the guy and the situation. There were 30 of us, we came up with 30 different descriptions and scenarios. Some said there were two assailants (there was one); Some said he was wearing a hoodie (he had on a baseball hat); Some said he had a gun (he did not). The only thing we got right was that he was tall and white.

I actually thought it was one of the plain clothes officers only because on second glance around the room he was not a familiar face.

Joe, you followed your instinct and didn't eye ball him; you split your attention to make sure your wife was Ok; you gave him your wallet; you followed thru to help the cops; and you're here to tell the story. Sounds just about right to me.

As for Prop Joe (I can't believe he is Black, way to shtick) screw him. Fools like that either crumple under the pressure or parade around with bravado and get themselves killed.

Posted by: bedstuy11216 at April 1, 2009 4:39 PM

I walked in on a burglar once and stared him in the eyes for as long as it took for me to remember that the thing to do was scream as loud as I could and not just stand there. Not in NYC, FWIW. And different from the last mugging story I told round here.

There's no way I could have IDd the guy. I was not processing face. I was processing "what the fuck is going on." There were doors onto the porch, I walked into the room thinking something was in there, and thinking I was going to do a good deed by chasing the cat/ racoon/ possum out of my roommate's bedroom. It took me a long time to recognize that this was not an oversized rodent. His coat I could ID today, but when I recall the incident, I can see everything but his face.

So whatever. Not everyone recognizes muggers. And it is really shitty for a black guy with a racing heartbeat to be put away for armed robbery because you got mugged by a black guy who took off running. If they can't put together a conviction out of a gun, prints and the damn wallet, I don't see why we can't bash the police department.

Posted by: serpentor at April 1, 2009 4:42 PM

If you really need further evidence of PropJoe's childish, confused attitudes, look no further than the very next Forum post ("Obama chicken") and his jew-baiting comments. Although I have to say it always make me laugh when guys try to out-tough each other on a lousy bulletin board. "Yeh, I would've not only ID-ed that perp, I would've wrestled him to the ground and shot him with his own gun..." Yadda, yadda, yadda ya. All just variants on the "mine's bigger than yours" complex. Too bad bummer has to not only experience something as freaky as a mugging but then gets "mugged" by anonymous so-called tough guys on brownstoner when he offers an honest thoughtful account of the incident.

Posted by: 1929 at April 1, 2009 5:37 PM

When did this happen? My friends on Garfield (both between 7th & 8th and 8th and PPW) say they knew nothing of it. They were shocked. they say if patrol cars were shooting up the block (going the wrong way) someone would have noticed. What date and what time?

Posted by: parkslopemom at April 1, 2009 5:50 PM

parkslopemom-- it was late on a weeknight -- I would say the date, but I'm not sure the case is over, and I don't want to take a chance of messing it up by getting too specific about the timing so that my story can be linked to the actual court case. it was about a month ago. I did indeed shoot up the hill on garfield (wrong way) in the back of a patrol car.

All of the neighbors I told about it were shocked too. People really feel safe here. I hope all of these profane posts (mine included) result in a few people taking more precautions around the hood late at night....

Posted by: joe_the_bummer at April 1, 2009 6:17 PM

Hey Joe glad you and your wife are okay and we understand your concerns about wrongful convictions but that memory of yours is well.. eh kind of pathetic no? :)
Great story dude and thanks for sharing. Great ending as well...we personally deal with gun violence weekly but with less happy endings sadly.
Keep your eyes out folks!

Posted by: pierre de taille at April 1, 2009 7:16 PM

Joe, you are one straight up courageous and principled guy who is a credit to humanity. What a story. First of all, I'm glad to hear that you and your wife are ok. I'm also glad that the the criminal justice system was able to arrive at a just conclusion without your caving into the pressure to give eyewitness testimony over which you had your own doubts.

I completely understand your unwillingness to make an ID under the circumstances. Several years ago, I was assaulted on the subway in an unprovoked and sudden face-to-face attack. Within seconds after the assailant attacked me, he walked away and disappeared. A friend who was with me and I complained to the conductor who, in turn, had police meet me at the subway car when the train pulled into the next station. The conductor opened the doors only to allow the police on but would open no other doors for anyone to get on or off the train. Then, the police had me walk with them through each and every car of the train looking for the perp. Even though the assault had just occurred only moments before, face to face, in a lighted subway car, I just couldn't be certain of any of the details of the assailant at point. (Ok. He was black and was wearing a blue jacket. Very unique identifiers for sure.) Nor could my friend who was not even attacked. Fact is, we were both in shock. And the look of fear on everyone's face as we searched for the suspect was surreal! It was like each man in the car imagined I was going to point the finger at him. In the end, I couldn't make any kind of ID at all that I could be 100% sure about and I ended up not even filing a formal complaint.

All that is to say that your memory failure during a sudden, unprovoked and violent attack, by a stranger, on the street at night, is NOT pathetic. Way too often wrongful convictions have been based on bad IDs. Indeed, a major news magazine show recently aired a special on this very topic. The main story was about a woman who was 100% convinced she had correctly ID's her rapist. Based on her ID, the suspect was convicted and jailed. Something like 15-20 years after the fact, DNA evidence proved she was wrong and the person who had actually raped her had confessed. The wrongfully convicted man and his accuser are now friends. But it was one amazing story of how, even with the eyewitness who is totally convinced of the accuracy of his or her identification, mistakes can and will be made.

Looks like in this case, though, thanks to your cool thinking, clear head and good police work, the right result was reached without a hitch. Thanks for sharing that story and for being the man of integrity that you are!

Posted by: Brooklynista at April 1, 2009 8:30 PM

"(Ok. He was black and was wearing a blue jacket. Very unique identifiers for sure.)"

Especially since they often wear reversible jackets.

Posted by: denton at April 1, 2009 9:39 PM

Thanks for sharing. I have a lot of respect for you, Joe.

A lot of desperation out there. Everybody be aware and be safe. Back to the 70's we go.

***Bid half off peak comps***

Posted by: Brownstones Half Off at April 2, 2009 12:15 AM

Don't listen to people who tell you your inability to id a suspect is pathetic- it's not. No one who has been in your situation can understand what's happening when you're in the middle of being mugged.

I was once mugged by a gang of young kids and a gun held to the back of my head. believe me i wasn't trying to stare them in the face and get all aggressive- I was trying to look down, get my money out of my bag and live to tell the tale. Any psychologist can tell you how the brain works during a terror filled incident- so anyone calling your memory pathetic knows nothing about it, and should shut their mouths.

Cops love to put away criminals- the only thing i would say is that many people cop out of id'ing perpetrators because they're afraid- the cops weren't trying to score points, they were trying to be sure you weren't holding back out of fear.

YOu and your wife are extremely lucky- I have nothing but sympathy for what you went through. I know what its like. I wouldn't be able to id any of the kids who mugged me but if that makes me pathetic, well, at least I'm here to tell the tale.

Posted by: bxgrl at April 2, 2009 11:48 AM

Personally, I commend you for not IDing someone you weren't really sure was the perp. I think most people would say that's him even if they were not sure.just because the cops pressure them. Good for you!

Posted by: cggirl at April 2, 2009 1:36 PM

I know a man who was mugged on a prime, North Park Slope block. He didn't get a good look at the perps either. That's not such an unusual thing.

Posted by: traditionalmod at April 2, 2009 4:06 PM

Thanks for posting this interesting story. I'm glad that the police score such high marks. My own experience when my car was stolen was the opposite, but I'm happy to get a tale from the other experience.

And yes, screw the trolls. Propjoe just posts between exchanging DS games at GameStop.

Posted by: jland at June 8, 2009 10:56 AM

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