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January 11, 2009
SOS: Contractor sans Insurance
I just learned the a contractor that was going to renovate my small coop bathroom has no insurance. The proposed renovations include demolishing most of three walls, retiling; the plumber does have insurance.
Contractor was recommended by someone and praised on the Park Slope Parents' web site.
Questions: is it common for such a contractor to not have insurance? Would someone insured charge significantly more? Can I take out insurance to cover the renovation work (liability to coop, and, I suppose to cover the persons contractor may hire)? FInally, can anyone recommend someone with insurance?
Comments
All the contractor has to do is go to an insurance agent and buy insurance.
If you tell him that your coop requires it, he'll get whatever is necessary.
No big deal
Posted by: IronBalls at January 11, 2009 5:05 PM
IronBalls, my guess is that he is not interested in getting insured (otherwise he already would be).
Do you know if it's possible for me, as coop owner, to get the needed insurance? What it might cost?
Other contractor recommendations welcome...
Posted by: BrooklynCouch at January 11, 2009 6:26 PM
If your contractor is not insured, I guarantee you he is not licensed. And, if you are concerned about the former, I would think you would be concerned about the latter as well. There's no doubt that plenty of unlicensed and uninsured contractors can handle your reno for you. But what happens if something goes wrong? You'll have a heck of a time getting any recourse for damages from tradespeople who aren't carrying the government's required paperwork. I'm not suggesting you should never hire an unlicensed, uninsured handyman type. I've certainly done it often enough (with mixed results). But do know what your stomach for risk is and act accordingly.
Posted by: Brooklynista at January 11, 2009 6:39 PM
You need a contractor with a million dollar liability wth a 2 million dollar aggregate for your type of renovation. Your contractor is a cheapskate or he is dumb when it comes to money.
an insurance policy is cheap.
He has to own the policy and make you and your board as additionally insureds.
if he is an outlaw stay away.
make sure your plumber and electrician have their own separate license.
call utica first and ask them about an artisan policy. they will explain the rates/ you will find them on the internet.
I HATE CHEAPSKATES!
Posted by: Ysabelle at January 11, 2009 11:56 PM
Ysabelle, you strongly suggest to stay away from uninsured contractors; then suggest I call Utica? Isn't that contradictory? The guy in question, who I will NOT name, has been recommended by people both on Brownstoner and by Park Slope Parents, so I am quite disillusioned that he doesn't have insurance;I'm torn between the recommendations and the lack of insurance. Taking down bathroom walls and putting up new ones isn't brain surgery, but it isn't screwing in a light bulb....not happy me...
In any case, I called three other licensed people this evening; names menitioned here on brownstoner...
Posted by: BrooklynCouch at January 12, 2009 12:45 AM
what i meant is to tell your uninsured contractor to call utic first.
if he is dead sent against getting a policy i would be suspicious.
people who are on workmans comp, welfare ,unemployment, or owe child support will not want to get their own policy which tells you a great deal about themselves.
i am not a hypocrite your contractor is.
Posted by: Ysabelle at January 12, 2009 12:56 AM
I'm surprised your coop board would even let you do any work without a cert of insurance on file. You live in a coop, you have a responsibility to your fellow cooperators to not put them at risk. Shared plumbing and an uninsured contractor is a recipe for trouble. Why would you even want to take this risk? There are plenty of not busy contractors out there right now who have taken the time and trouble to do business the right way.
Posted by: denton at January 12, 2009 8:17 AM
Denton's on the money: in most coops, you'll have to submit paperwork for renovations, which includes a description of the work, copy of license, copy of insurance, and whatever else the board might require. If you don't have it, and your board really reviews paperwork, they won't approve the renovation.
It's good that the plumber has the insurance. Does he have a license? But for coop approval, generally all tradesmen need licensing.
Posted by: Minmin at January 12, 2009 8:46 AM
OP, it's not so shocking people wouldn't know a contractor isn't licensed and insured. Everybody always has to ask. Just like in your case, the way some contractors present themselves and how popular they are makes people assume the contractor has everything in order. There's a contractor who has done a lot of work in our neighborhood, and he always does a prominent RE broker's clients' places but we found out recently via a friend who hired him and learned the hard way, that the guy isn't even licensed and insured.
Try Anthony Riccio. He did our kitchen. He has a good, solid team that always shows up and is meticulous. There are over 30 good reviews of him on Apartment Therapy.
347.267.1681
adconstr@aol.com
Posted by: traditionalmod at January 12, 2009 10:17 AM
I am surprised your coop doesn't have a rule about this. Our condo's management company requires certificates of insurance be faxed in before they'll let anyone in the building, including movers.
Posted by: bohuma at January 12, 2009 12:15 PM
HI at Northline Inc we are HIC(nyc home improvement
contractor).we have workers compensation polisy and
liability insurance $2,000,000,-(it means no problem
with coop board).15 years of expirience for You means
well planned project without suprises.
references upon request
please contact John 917-747-8275
northlineinc@yahoo.com
Posted by: john62 at January 12, 2009 1:04 PM
I never said the coop didn't have a rule about "this"; I was exploring getting the insurance myself and wondering if the absence of insurance calls into question the guy's "excellent reputation." In any case, I called a Utica Insurance agent who said I could not buy such insurance, so I called the contractor and told him that unless he could get a policy, no go.
Two insured guys, both mentioned on this site, are coming over today and tomorrow.
By the way Ysabelle, I never called you a hypocrite.
Posted by: BrooklynCouch at January 12, 2009 2:35 PM
go to the website www.nyc.gov and look for department of consumer affairs......home improvement contractor. it will explain what its all about.
if that doesn't work you can call and request an information packet to obtain a licence.
they will mail it and start reading the portions of interest to you.
Insurance is easy to get and cheap.
in order to apply for a license you need to be fingerprinted, show them your insurance first before they allow you take the exam. if you owe money for child support you will never get a lisence. a convicted felon won't get one either.
the interesting thing about all this stuff, it does not guarantee you a good job. The whole thing with renovation is a crap shoot.
If someones place looks great, it doesn't mean yours will.
Posted by: Ysabelle at January 12, 2009 5:29 PM
i'm baaack!
here is a reccommendation for your renovation. they are a small family business. it is a father and son. they are reliable and well priced with verifiable references. All their paperwork is in good order. easy to get along with and they will listen to what you want and work with you and your ideas.
John will come out and give you a free estimate. he is the son.
zaragoza design ...347-728-7691 if you decide to call Don't forget to say its about a job this way john will return your call.
Tell them susan suggested you call.
Posted by: Ysabelle at January 12, 2009 11:02 PM
give the deposit only after you see and verify their paperwork before you consent to any job. if they want it backwards, walk away.
another possibility for contractors who don't want insurance is because when they had insurance their clients filed complaints with the insurer for damages and they no longer can get it.
Don't let them tell you i have a friend who will cover me. in reality the friends insurance will not cover you because the friends insurance is not your job. in other words you are not the client of the so called friend.
Now about the anthony riccio subject. his spiel (german word for play) is he wants you to go to a company called smolka and see a specific guy so you can pay for the design which everybody in a store gives free of charge. the guy is a salesman who sells hannsem cabinetry.
if you want hanssem kitchen cabinets go see manny at atlantis in queens. he is the number one dealer of the cabinets. you will get a better price and you don't have to mention anyones name. atlantis is a showroom and they have a website with their street address and phone number.
by the way anthony ricco is a contractor employed by smolka. he does work for them all the tme.
my chatty responses i hope are helpful.
Posted by: Ysabelle at January 12, 2009 11:28 PM
That's not true about Anthony Riccio, Ysabelle. If he does encourage somebody to use a particular designer and company you don't want to use just have some balls and say no thanks. Because he isn't employed by them nor does he work with that guy exclusively. I was referred to Anthony Riccio by Park Slope Kitchen Gallery, totally different place. He works with a number of kitchen designers. (I didn't pay for my design at PS Kitchen Gallery either if one wonders). Also if you read all the reviews on Apartment Therapy they aren't people who all used the kitchen designer you mentioned. They aren't even all kitchen jobs.
Posted by: traditionalmod at January 13, 2009 10:11 AM
We are licensed and Insured. We have worked in co-op's and condo's in Brooklyn and Manhattan which required us to have all the proper documentation. If you like we can supply you with a FREE estimate and a list of references.
Thank You,
AllRenovation Construction LLC
718-351-4099
http://ww.allrenovation-ny.com
Posted by: allrenovation at January 13, 2009 12:13 PM
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